Starting in 44mag/44spl, need some advice

[Shadow9mm]

So I am planning on getting a 44 henry in the next week or so. I currently load 38/357 for revolver and cast my own bullets but this will be my first time loading for a lever gun. I do have a friend who loads 44 for revolver and lever and will be working with him, but was hoping for some input here as well.

The primary purpose will be a deer rifle for myself and my 13yr old son. Where I live both 44 mag and 44spl are legal. My son shot my friends rifle and preferred heavier subsonic bullets in 44spl over 44 mag. I'm a fan of the magnum cartridges. Will be working up some of both for hunting and plinking.

I debating on sights for the gun. I am somewhere between a peep sight and a small red dot. I can't stand buck horn sights. A red dot seems a bit
sacrilegious, but would give much better dusk and dawn performance as well as ease of zeroing between the 44spl and full power loads.

I currently have
#7
HP-38
Power Pistol
H110
CFEPistol

I'm thinking 240s in general maybe some heavier bullets for 44. I generally prefer 158 and 180 in 357, but 44s are heavier to begin with. Is there a benefit going lighter?

Any thoughts on bullet weights, other good versatile powders I should try and add to my selection, or loading for the Henry?

 

[jetinteriorguy]

In my .41mag Henry I’ve had very good results with Hornady XTP’s using 2400. I’ve also used H110 with excellent results but find 2400 to be more versatile and prefer it.

 

[ligonierbill]

I use H110 almost exclusively in .44 Mag, mostly with 240 JHP, but I have loaded 320 Cast Performance with decent results. The one exception to H110 is AA#9 under Barnes 200 XPB. I'm loading for a 7 1/2" Redhawk, and it is fast. My one field experience was with my brother shooting a commercial 200 gr. load out of a H&R Handi Rifle. He put a big hole completely through a big PA doe with that.

Regards .44 Special, I have used Power Pistol and Unique successfully (again, in a pistol). But AA#7 and HS-6 should also work well. HP-38 seems a bit fast.

You know not to download H110, yes? Have fun, and good hunting!

 

[Shadow9mm]

Clear on not downloading h110 , may have to try some #9. I like #7, but have been dissapointed with its lack of use and or versatility. Most manuals seem to jump from #5 to #9 and skip over #7 entirely.

 

[lugerstew]

I have loaded and shot hundreds of 240g bullets out of my Marlin lever action, I use a red dot at a outdoor range at targets up to 25 yds and even the wife shoots and hits with the red dot.
I am almost positive you cant go wrong with 240g bullets and 23 to 24g of H110 in a 44mag, from the 1800fps and the strong recoil, I can pretty much tell it would put down any deer under a 100 yds.

 

[totaldla]

You need to find out the bullet profiles the Henry will chamber from the magazine - usually the biggest problem. I have no experience with a Henry per se, but I'm sure it will handle the Hornady 240gr XTP which is a very popular deer bullet.

I would use the H110 at max loading with a CCI350 primer.

Don't invest in cast bullets until you hear from other Henry owners about what will and won't cycle from the magazine. BTW, Power Pistol is an excellent mid-range powder in 44mag.

 

[44 AMP]

The key is finding a load(s) that fits your requirements and that the rifle likes. To do this, you need the rifle in hand, and somewhere to shoot it for testing.

As mentioned, some lever guns are quite picky about how well they work with certain bullets. AND they can also be picky about the way they are worked.

I don't have any personal experience with Henry's but I do have a lot with Marlins in .357 and .44 mag.

First off, tube magazines require the bullets to be crimped correctly. Otherwise they try to shove the bullet deeper in the case, and we all know that's not a good thing.

Next point is the "length of the action", meaning how long a round the rifle will feed from the tube to the chamber. This is where extra heavy bullets often cause issues. With all the different possible bullet weights, length, and profiles I wouldn't recommend stocking up on anything heavier than 240s UNTIL after you have the rifle and run a small test batch.

A friend of mine once got some 200gr RN .38 slugs and loaded them in .357 brass for his Marlin 1894 carbine. Loaded a couple to the crimp groove and then put them in the tube to test for cycling. They were too long to work, and the rifle jammed up tight. I had to disassemble his rifle to get the rounds out.

Anything SAAMI spec for COAL (or less) should work fine as far as length is concerned. Over that, its a dice roll in your specific rifle.

And then there is feeding due to bullet profiles. Anything RN or smoothly sloped generally works well. SWC slugs may, or may not, again depending on the rifle, and ALSO depending on how the action is worked.

Too slow, or too fast on the lever can make a difference in some guns. Againk you need the rifle in hand to figure this out.

H110 is a good powder for top end .44 Mag loads. GOing ligher is a bad idea, the powder gets erratic below recommended load levels. 2400 gives about the same performance and is much more flexible so can be loaded lighter than full house loads and still give good results.

Unique or something similar is best for the .44 Special, and midrange loads in the magnum.

Only use bullets with a crimp groove, correctly roll crimped in the tube mag lever guns. Anything else should be single loaded.

Sights? use what works best for you, and "hang tradition".

Traditions are fine things and if you're after a true reproduction of an old west gun they matter. If you're after the best shooting you can do with a general look of the old time guns, traditions aren't much help.

Good luck, get the rifle, try a few things and then let us know what (if anything) you need advice on.

 

[Shadow9mm]

The key is finding a load(s) that fits your requirements and that the rifle likes. To do this, you need the rifle in hand, and somewhere to shoot it for testing.

As mentioned, some lever guns are quite picky about how well they work with certain bullets. AND they can also be picky about the way they are worked.

I don't have any personal experience with Henry's but I do have a lot with Marlins in .357 and .44 mag.

First off, tube magazines require the bullets to be crimped correctly. Otherwise they try to shove the bullet deeper in the case, and we all know that's not a good thing.

Next point is the "length of the action", meaning how long a round the rifle will feed from the tube to the chamber. This is where extra heavy bullets often cause issues. With all the different possible bullet weights, length, and profiles I wouldn't recommend stocking up on anything heavier than 240s UNTIL after you have the rifle and run a small test batch.

A friend of mine once got some 200gr RN .38 slugs and loaded them in .357 brass for his Marlin 1894 carbine. Loaded a couple to the crimp groove and then put them in the tube to test for cycling. They were too long to work, and the rifle jammed up tight. I had to disassemble his rifle to get the rounds out.

Anything SAAMI spec for COAL (or less) should work fine as far as length is concerned. Over that, its a dice roll in your specific rifle.

And then there is feeding due to bullet profiles. Anything RN or smoothly sloped generally works well. SWC slugs may, or may not, again depending on the rifle, and ALSO depending on how the action is worked.

Too slow, or too fast on the lever can make a difference in some guns. Againk you need the rifle in hand to figure this out.

H110 is a good powder for top end .44 Mag loads. GOing ligher is a bad idea, the powder gets erratic below recommended load levels. 2400 gives about the same performance and is much more flexible so can be loaded lighter than full house loads and still give good results.

Unique or something similar is best for the .44 Special, and midrange loads in the magnum.

Only use bullets with a crimp groove, correctly roll crimped in the tube mag lever guns. Anything else should be single loaded.

Sights? use what works best for you, and "hang tradition".

Traditions are fine things and if you're after a true reproduction of an old west gun they matter. If you're after the best shooting you can do with a general look of the old time guns, traditions aren't much help.

Good luck, get the rifle, try a few things and then let us know what (if anything) you need advice on.

I'm clear on the heavy roll crimp need it for both feeding and to prevent set back.

Ended up ordering a Bushnell TRS-25. Its a low as I can get it on the rail I ordered.

Getting the rifle Saturday. Steel side gate, round barrel, standard loop. Should be a good working rifle. Talked to the shop owner today, he's got it set back for me to pic up. Offered to put money down for layaway, but he said he know me and if its saturday no sense in doing the paperwork for him. I love my little shop.

As far as bullets I generally lean towards wide flat nose, or round flat type projectiles. My buddy has a NOE mold that will cast wide flats or hollow points. the 44spl should feed just about anything. Just gotta be careful when putting them in magnum cases if I am not mistaken. Looking at the lee 110g mold. looks like it has 2 crimp grooves to shorten thing up if need be. anyone try these in 44mag?

I did snag a box of 240g XTP's at cabela's when I grabbed my dies and shell holder. so those and a few of my buddies cast will be what I will be starting out with.

 

[SHR970]

I like #7, but have been dissapointed with its lack of use and or versatility. Most manuals seem to jump from #5 to #9 and skip over #7 entirely.

#7 is versatile and downloads pretty well. Just because many manuals skip right over it doesn't mean a thing. Go to Accurate Powders for your data; 44 Mag is well represented. If you don't think it gives you the speeds you want then use your H110 which has a far narrower loading window. If it wasn't versatile why would they show loads of #7 for 45 ACP which runs at much lower pressures that 44 Mag.?

I use #7 for 115 gr. 32 H&R, 115 and 124 gr. 9mm, 125 and 158 gr. 357, and have loaded plenty of 240 gr. 44 mag. with it.

 

[Shadow9mm]

#7 is versatile and downloads pretty well. Just because many manuals skip right over it doesn't mean a thing. Go to Accurate Powders for your data; 44 Mag is well represented. If you don't think it gives you the speeds you want then use your H110 which has a far narrower loading window. If it wasn't versatile why would they show loads of #7 for 45 ACP which runs at much lower pressures that 44 Mag.?

I use #7 for 115 gr. 32 H&R, 115 and 124 gr. 9mm, 125 and 158 gr. 357, and have loaded plenty of 240 gr. 44 mag. with it.

I had bad luck in 9mm with 115g, stopped almost 0.5 below max due to no velocity increase at all in a 4in barrel. However I had good results with 124g. but based on where it is placed it should be versitile

 

[44 AMP]

I will give you this caution about wide flat points and SWCs in lever guns, you will need to learn the "proper" speed to cycle the lever which results in smooth(er) feeding.

This is, of course, unique to each individual rifle and shooter, but consider this, if the action is worked too "smartly" the lifter can bounce the round up and if the bolt is going forward while the nose of the round is too high, it can catch on the edge of the chamber. A RN or similar often just slides in, but an SWC or a large flat point might not, and the round will stop dead, right there.

IF this happens the cure is simple, bump the lever forward just a bit. THis takes the pressure holding the round jammed off, and then the round will usually drop back down to its proper position on the lifter and feed normally.

You might also find that taking a half second or so pause between fully opening the action and then closing it can help avoid FP and SWC feeding issues. Its a matter of feel, IF you get this problem, learning how to work the action to avoid or minimize it.

Marlins are very prone to this kind of behavior. I don't know if your Henry will be or not, but if it is, there are work arounds. And, of course using a bullet with a smooth sloping nose rarely causes any issues with functioning.

 

[Unclenick]

If you decide to take the optical sight off for another gun and want an iron sight, don't fail to look at ghost ring sights. Given that we are likely talking 100 yards and less, you might be surprised how accurately a ghost ring can shoot and its wide aperture still works in fairly low light.

 

[Shadow9mm]

If you decide to take the optical sight off for another gun and want an iron sight, don't fail to look at ghost ring sights. Given that we are likely talking 100 yards and less, you might be surprised how accurately a ghost ring can shoot and its wide aperture still works in fairly low light.

I strongly considered a peep sight. But felt a red dot would perform a lot better at dusk and dawn. If I ever pull the optic it will get a peep or express sights.

 

[Unclenick]

Usually, when someone says peep sight, they are talking about a small rear aperture. What distinguishes ghost rings is they have a very wide rear aperture such that the whole ring fuzzes to gray (the ghost in the name) when you focus on the front sight, also the reason they still work in fairly low light conditions. At first glance, folks think you couldn't possibly be accurate in your shot placement with them, but it turns out the eye naturally finds center really well. I've done a fair amount of standing position snap shooting with them, including silhouette target headshots at 50 yards and at 100 from the prone position.

 

[MarkCO]

With the powders you have, I'd agree with the H110 for the .44 Mag and I'd start with the Power Pistol for the .44 SPL loads.

As opposed to the handgun, you have more barrel length to work with, so the slower powders generally are more efficient with the .44 Mag, but you don't want to use those for the lower powered .44 SPL. I used Lil Gun for a while and also Ramshot Enforcer with really good results in the carbine barrels.

 

[stagpanther]

H110 is perfect with 240 gr bullets out of a 44 mag carbine, you're all set.

 

[GeauxTide]

A fan of Skinner Sights. I have a 45 Colt Henry and it likes 2400 under 300 Speer. It's a Revolver load, but 16.25" pushes it to 1300fps. I would not be seduced by loading rifle loads that the revolver can't digest.

 

[Dave P]

"H110 is perfect with 240 gr bullets out of a 44 mag carbine, you're all set." Same in my Henry, after they put on a new bbl. I use 21 grains for plinking.

And another vote for skinner sights.

 

[zeke]

"H110 is perfect with 240 gr bullets out of a 44 mag carbine, you're all set." Same in my Henry, after they put on a new bbl. I use 21 grains for plinking.

And another vote for skinner sights.

Took the 44 mag Henry home, cleaned the barrel and looked down it. Took it right back to the factory (25 miles south) and sat in their front reception area till they took it back. They looked at it, and replaced no questions asked. Freaking barrel screech the whole length of the tube.

As others noted, H110 with 240 xtp's and mag primer. Although, if memory serves, the Henry has a faster twist rate that is reported to be better with heavier bullets. Haven't tested that out though.

Am using AA-7 in full velocity 9mm (124/147 gr) and 357 mag loads with a magnum primer. For my purposes, the mag primer made a difference in accuracy. Have also tested it in 45 acp with 230 jhp's with a standard primer, but it seems a tad touchy in the higher powder charges. AA7 seems to like being loaded close to max, and not like being used below max much.

Might consider just using a fast bulky powder with heavier bullets instead of getting involved with 44 special brass and shorter COL's?