Some LEOs just kill me!

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Harry Callahan

New member
I ran into this cop during my travels as an insurance adjuster. He tells me he would NEVER carry anything under a .40. I tell him that the 9mm SD loadings of today are reportedly very effective and I would feel comfortable carrying a weapon with these loadings. He basically tells me I don't know what I'm talking about and tells me I would need to carry at least a .40(if civilians were allowed to in Illinois:rolleyes:). Then we moved on to .40 vs .45. I said I enjoyed shooting the .45 more as I found it less snappy and easier to control. He looks down his nose at me and tells me I'm wrong and that the .45 is far snappier. I felt like telling him that I should know what is more comfortable for me, but I decided to let it go. I just get tired of the elitist attitudes of some LEOs which seem to dictate that "I am an LEO and therefore I know far more about the subject of firearms and shooting than you do". It's funny to realize that I'm a better shot than many(maybe most?)LEOs yet many of them feel the need to try to make me feel that I don't know what I'm talking about. So, to all LEOs, I appreciate your service and respect what you do. To some LEOs, you are not God so treat me with the respect I deserve and don't be so hung up on yourselves. YOU TOO can learn something from a civilian every day. Maybe I'm being too sensitive but that ticks me.
 
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TheGoldenState

New member
You should have verbal tassled with him.

You should have turned YOUR nose down at HIM. Hit him with facts and stats (hell make em up i sincerley doubt hed know) and make him realize he is no master on the subject especially when it comes to ones preference. Some LEO's need it.
 
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Glenn Dee

New member
Hello Guys...


First off... Ignorance come's in all sizes, shapes, colors, and even professions.
In fact I think that most people re-gurgitate what they have been told, what they read, or common myth as if it was handed down from on high.

The title "Some LEO's just kill me" well in fact some will... but thats a different discussion. But to judge police officers by the misinformation of one guy is a bit... silly. I'm sure that no one would want to be judged by just any one person in their profession, race, hobby, neighborhood, town or city. In fact IMO most police officers are bairly conversant in firearms other than the one they carry. Being a police officer does not make a person a firearms expert, or even an aficianado. A firearm is just a tool to most police officers.

Thank GOD that the great majority of police have very little practical experience with their firearms other than practice, and qualification. Some police officers are firearms enthusiasts. But they would probaby would have been no matter what career the individual may have chosen.
 
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Kreyzhorse

New member
First off... Ignorance come's in all sizes, shapes, colors, and even professions.
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+1. Just because some one works with guns doesn't make them an expert on them. On top of that, every one has their own opinions and you know what they say about those.
 
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Harry Callahan

New member
The title "Some LEO's just kill me" well in fact some will... but thats a different discussion. But to judge police officers by the misinformation of one guy is a bit... silly.
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Which is exactly why I said SOME, not all. I'm not judging them all based on my experience with this one. Actually, most of the LEOs I've come in contact with DO treat me with the respect we all deserve. Just unfortunate there are some out there with the "God" complex.
 
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Brian Pfleuger

Moderator Emeritus
As others have said, it has nothing whatsoever to do with his being a cop.

LEOs are regular people from the regular population. Somewhere in their midst are all of the best, worst and in between qualities found in every other facet of society.

There are far more people who believe themselves to be experts than there are actual experts for ANY given subject matter. It could be space travel, firearms, pizza dough, economics, politics, physics, auto body, race cars....

doesn't matter. It a people thing, not a LEO thing.
 
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Bartholomew Roberts

Moderator
Definitely not limited to LEOs, if I have to hear one more gunshop discussion about how "caliber X" will definitely be a one-shot stop if you hit them anywhere on the torso, I think I may :barf: right there on the spot.

It is amazing to me that in such a modern society with so many learning resources, people who actually go out and regularly kill other living things with firearms don't have the first clue in how the animal actually ends up dead or how the particular choice of ammunition contributed to that result.

So many people seem to think that if they just choose the right magic bullet, they have done everything they need to do to succeed (whether it is hunting, self-defense, etc.)
 
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Scattergun Bob

New member
Harry

Maybe I'm being to sensitive but that ticks me.
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perhaps you are, but in the face of such a argument I would feel the same.

A couple of extra pennies on the pile

For several years toward the end of my career, I worked in the training division of my agency. Two things that may influence the thought process of some “firearms challenged” officers are;

1. The total indoctrination of confidence applied to new recruit training concerning equipment weapons and tactics carried out onto the street, being the BEST there is available. In it’s simplest form “Officer Survival” is based on a total suspension of disbelief toward the material and training being presented. I have the best equipment and I have the best training to WIN. Sometimes for those officers who are not gun hobbyist this is all they will ever know, and it is critical to their survival that they believe. So some folks may perceive Confidence for Cockiness when discussing firearms with this type of officer.

2. The folks at the top would rather blame equipment for failures It’s always cheaper to find a fault with equipment, then it is to drill down and find other issues that may be more expensive.
That is how the salesmanship of convincing the rank and file that down sizing or up sizing caliber is the new secret to success on the street. It was easy to sell up caliber changes to street officers (bigger is better), I really would like to have heard the successful sales pitch to down sizing.

Good Luck & Be Safe
 
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griz

New member
That reminds me of a young hunter who has already killed two deer with XXXXX gun and is convinced that no other gun can come close to his death ray XXXXX. Let him believe what he wants, life is too short to correct everybody who is wrong.
 
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5whiskey

New member
Some police officers are firearms enthusiasts. But they would probaby would have been no matter what career the individual may have chosen.
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I can say, as an LEO, that this is true. I was a gun nut way before I was a cop.

My personal opinion? The extent of this gentlemans knowledge of firearms is likely ONLY with his various police departments. He probably only shoots when given the opportunity by his department. If that is the case, then he has not had experiences with a diverse number of firearms/calibers. Which there is nothing wrong with that. What is wrong is acting like a guru just because you think you should because of your profession.
 
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gunmoney

New member
IMHO the reason why many like to jump on cops about issues like this is the fact that, whether we like it or not, we view them as authority figures who's job it is to make difficult judgement calls and possibly use his firearm to take a person's life if the situation may demand. Therefore, most of us subconsciously, or consciously, hold the idea that they better know what the hell they are doing. Otherwise, the noble image of an officer quickly dissolves into just another moron with a gun and the authority to take my life based in their own, now questionable, personal judgement.
 
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Danny45

New member
Kind of funny.

I've seen that same attitude on several internet forums. And none of those commandos were LEOs.
 
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Paul B.

New member
You reminded me of an incident that took place when I lived in Nevada. Guy in Idaho broke jail, more or les kidnapped the sheriff, commandeered a small plane and ended up landing at the local airport of the small town where I lived. Loal LEO had the sitiuation under eelative control until the FBI showed up, after which they took control. Finally they talk the guy into giving up and this one FBI agent in in my office (I worked at the airport and was there when all this went down.) and he has the gun he took from thr escapee. It's a Browning High Power witht he magazine safety still intact. So big smart arse FBI man has remover the magazine and cleared the chamber. We're cool right? He's rying to snap the hammer down with the magazine out, so I tell him it's got a magazine safety. It won't shoot if the mag is not in he gun. he says, "I'm an FBI agent and I'm trained with firerams." I tell him again to just put the magazine in the gunand you can drop the hammer. Again I get his BS that he'd a trained FBI agents etc. etc etc.
I fnally get mad and say, Look you jackass, I've owned two of that guns nd I know what to do. put the damned magazine in the gun and drop the damned hammer. Now by this time wo other agents are looking at me and then one of them tells him to go ahead and try it. He does, "Click!' the hammer drops and he's about as red faced a dude as I've ever seen. Somehow, it would not have surprised me to see him jack a round in the chamber first. I was not impressed by the FBI on that night. Maybe that guy should be pushing a desk and not be working in the field.
Paul B.
 
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WC145

New member
A couple of extra pennies on the pile

For several years toward the end of my career, I worked in the training division of my agency. Two things that may influence the thought process of some “firearms challenged” officers are;

1. The total indoctrination of confidence applied to new recruit training concerning equipment weapons and tactics carried out onto the street, being the BEST there is available. In it’s simplest form “Officer Survival” is based on a total suspension of disbelief toward the material and training being presented. I have the best equipment and I have the best training to WIN. Sometimes for those officers who are not gun hobbyist this is all they will ever know, and it is critical to their survival that they believe. So some folks may perceive Confidence for Cockiness when discussing firearms with this type of officer.
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Good post, Bob.
It's a lot like the military. Why are the Marines consistently some of the toughest guys and meanest fighters our military puts out? Because the entire time they're training to be Marines they are being told that when they leave Parris Island THEY WILL BE THE BADDEST M*****F***ERS IN THE VALLEY! Cops get a lot of the same kind of reinforcement, not so much the bad a** stuff but a lot of COPS DON'T DIE! and YOU ARE IN CHARGE! stuff because of their training or equipment or whatever they need to hear to foster that attitude. And lots of them come from passive environments where they've never hit or been hit, shot anyone, forced anyone to comply with their wishes.

Guns stand out for most people as a big deal when it comes to cops, however, like the rest of society, a lot of cops aren't all about the guns because they're a really small part of the job most of the time. So, whatever they're taught by the people that are supposed to know is gospel and you're going to have a hard time arguing or common sensing that out of some of them.

And, for what it's worth, I carry a 9mm 1911 on and off duty, the only .40S&W I own is a revolver, and I don't carry anything polymer. Bet that don't fit in anybody's cop gun mold!;)
 
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RETG

New member
As someone else said, not related just to law enforcement officers. Just look at the threads on this forum. It is rife with people who will tell you a .45 is better than any other round. You will have people with .40 tell you it is the best, and we can go on forever.
 
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