Should I buy a Saiga 12 on principle?

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Darker Loaf

New member
So, part of my gun buying philosophy is to buy guns that aren't going to be available in the future. The Saiga 12 seems to be one of those guns that might not be around for very much longer in the U.S.

So, my questions to the good people of TFL are these:
1) Is the Saiga 12 a reliable gun? It seems like they can have issues with reliability, especially with bird-shot. I know that the gun was designed for military use--so higher pressure shells, but how expensive is it to make these guns reliable?
2) What good magazines are out there for the gun? What is the largest sized, most reliable magazine out there? They should be available if possible.
3) What are the best custom shops out there if you want to get work done on a Saiga?

I still have a gap in my collection for high capacity, competition/military style shotguns. I was going to go with an 870--but I really want in my heart-of-hearts a VEPR 12. However, I can buy an honest-to-god Russian Saiga 12 (sporter) at the local hardware store fairly cheaply, cheaper than an 870. They seem highly customizable--something that fits well with my OCD gun-modding. I may just have to buy one. It just seems to be the basis of a good project gun and a fun gun in general.

What is the good and bad of the guns? Can they be made to run close to 100%?
 
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jaguarxk120

New member
You should find a forum or site that is just for the Saiga guns.

Find out what the owners do to them, you might be money ahead by going for the Vepr.
 
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Darker Loaf

New member
Honestly, I was hoping that I could get answers here. I really like the good folks at The Firing Line and tend to trust your opinions more.
 
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Taiin

New member
I cannot comment on the magazines, but my former housemate owned a Saiga 12 and it is a fun firearm. I went with him when he picked it up from an FFL dealer (had to have it shipped in) and we spent many weekends picking off clay pigeons with it.

I thought it was incredibly reliable. I put many rounds through it, and it never once jammed for me. I think the higher capacity magazines can put some pressure on the first shell, deforming it and causing a potential jam. But he didn't use the high capacity magazines, so that could have been why it did not jam.

My housemate customized the Saiga himself. I forget off the top of my head what all he did to it.
 
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Darker Loaf

New member
RE Taiin: Thanks for the feedback. While you did not offer me a complete picture, I appreciate the information, none-the-less. I have little experience with Saiga's and some first hand experience feedback is more than I have. I've heard the same with high-capacity magazines. For me I'd be hoping that 5, 8, and 10 rounders would work. Sounds like you guys used birdshot, which is encouraging. I would skip buying a Saiga altogether, if it could not be made to run with birdshot (I guess it needn't be 100% with birdshot, but close to it would be nice).

From what I've been reading, like many semi-automatic guns, messing with the barrel length changes the pressure in the gas-system. It sounds like a more reliable gun (with birdshot) can be had by leaving the barrel at 19" instead of pinning and welding a muzzle device or some such to make it shorter.
 
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Darker Loaf

New member
I'm definitely less familiar with the 1919 than the VEPR or Saiga 12. My philosophy with guns is to buy very supported firearms, which parts can be easily supported or modified. There-in lies the beauty in a Saiga. It's at the local hardware store, and many people work on them/have parts. As with VEPR 12's.

From a quick search on the internets, 1919 aren't very available, seemingly as rare as VEPR's and Saigas after import restrictions, but without the 3rd party commercial support. Correct me if I am wrong.
 
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Darker Loaf

New member
Re Unlicensed Dremel

I know it is targeted. I just would rather buy a targeted gun that actually runs like I want it to. My list is long... but the Saiga gets bumped up higher because of the import restrictions. However, if it is difficult to make it run, then I'd rather spend that extra coin on an AR-pistol of some sort or another "highish" capacity semi-auto shotgun.
 
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old-dog

New member
I do not understand what principal you are referring to? It I smart to buy guns that you want just in case, which I have been doing for the last 4 years, but they are all guns that are on my bucket list or have a need for. I like the Saiga but have not need for it so I do not buy it. Buying it is not going to affect anything other than your wallet. :) If you have no need for it and may not be able to sell it if it is banned, why?
 
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Erno86

New member
May I suggest checking out China's Catamount Fury, which is a AK shotgun clone that has bolt hold-open on the last shot; but does not accept Saiga magazines.
 
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Darker Loaf

New member
I just price checked my local hardware store on the Saiga 12: it's $800. That's a bit more expensive than I though, and that changes my calculous a bit. Seems like I'd be better off getting a competition FN-SLP or something of the like. I'd end up spending less money in the long run. Sigh.

The Saiga 12 and Vepr 12 still call to me though... detachable box-fed shotguns are just neat. It's just an FN-SLP would serve me better in almost every other way, and probably be more reliable and accurate.
 
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uradaisyifudo

New member
Dumped 2, 8-round mags through the vepr last weekend as quick as I could shoot and get back on target. The 00 buck devastated the old stump I was shooting at, it was fun.
 
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