Sheriff's Dept Finds Its Glocks Broken

BrokenArrow

New member
Wednesday, October 9, 2002

Sheriff's Dept. Finds Its Guns Broken

By Jeff Jones
Journal Staff Writer
The Bernalillo County Sheriff's Department says it has discovered a problem with its handguns that could leave deputies trying to defend their lives with only a single gunshot.
Glock, the company that makes the .40-caliber semi-automatics, has known about the problem for several months but didn't notify the department, a deputy said Tuesday.
The 270-deputy department scrambled to inspect all of its Glocks on Monday after two weapons broke. It discovered two more that were broken, said Deputy Robert Ray, an armorer who runs the department's shooting range.
Three of the four were among 230 new Glocks the department purchased earlier this year. The fourth was purchased by a reserve deputy.
The department asked the Albuquerque Police Department on Tuesday for spare weapons, and Sheriff Joe Bowdich signed a special order allowing deputies to temporarily carry their personal handguns once they qualify with them.
Glock, which has a reputation as a rock-solid, reliable weapon, is the gun of choice for many law agencies. Sheriff's Capt. Darci Ryan said the issue "is a major problem for Glock."
Several calls to Glock's offices in Smyrna, Ga., late Tuesday afternoon did not go through.
"It's not a good feeling to know (that) we don't know if they're going to work or not," Ryan said.
Bowdich and Ryan said the department earlier this year purchased the new Glocks to replace its aging arsenal of the same brand of guns. Law agencies can buy the guns for about $350 apiece, but the department traded in its older guns, spending about $5,000 for the upgrade.
Ray said that on some newer versions of the gun, two pieces of steel in the lower portion of the weapon were improperly machined. Those pieces may be prone to breaking under the stress of repeated firing. If the pieces do break, an affected gun may fire only one shot before malfunctioning.
He said a reserve deputy's Glock broke last week, and the next day, a SWAT team member's Glock broke while he was at the shooting range.
Ray said he called a Glock representative to ask about the problem and was told Glock has known about it since May.
He said the department's "serious concern" is that a deputy involved in a deadly force situation will reach for his or her gun and have only one shot.
He said he has recommended to deputies that they not carry the new Glocks until the problem is fixed.
Bowdich said the county attorney's office has contacted Glock, which promised it would provide the parts needed to fix the guns by next Wednesday.
Bowdich said the force wants Glock to replace all the guns.
Late Tuesday afternoon, Bowdich said he was signing an order allowing deputies to carry their personal handguns if they fall within certain guidelines.
Albuquerque police are issued 9mm Glock handguns that apparently do not have the problem, Ray said. City officers are not obligated to carry their issued handguns and can instead carry their weapon of choice.
City police have already given the sheriff's department at least 20 spare Glocks, and the sheriff's department has asked APD officers who carry other guns to loan the neighboring agency its Glocks until the problem is resolved.
"Any gun that gets into the deputies' hands will be inspected by the armorer and shot by the deputy," Bowdich said. "We're going to make sure they're familiar with the weapon we put in their hands."
Ray said despite the glitch with the newer Glocks, he's still a fan of the company's products.
"I love the gun," he said. "I think it's done us well for almost 15 years now."
This is the second instance in a year the department has relied on defective equipment.
Earlier this year, the department found it had defective bullets. Sheriff's spokeswoman Michele Arviso Devlin has said the bullets didn't expand properly when they struck their target.
Arviso Devlin has said the department received a refund and replacement ammo from the company that made that batch.
 

Fred S

New member
What was the armorer doing when the guns arrived, eating doghnuts? Sounds like there was not a quality assurance inspection upon delivery.
 

Master Blaster

New member
I doubt very much that an armourer could see that there was improper heat treating / steel used in the parts, unless he has spectrographic/ x-ray vision.
This problem would show up after the guns were fired x-rounds.

Its a good thing they do actually shoot them.:rolleyes:

A much better question is why did GLOCK's fabulous quality control catch this, and if they did (Knew about it in may) why didn't they contact all who had recieved the defective weapons?

Well Glock ???? Why would you let a police officer carry a weapon you KNOW is defective???????

Maybe the folks at glock were eating donuts:mad:
 

croyance

New member
Those pieces may be prone to breaking under the stress of repeated firing. If the pieces do break, an affected gun may fire only one shot before malfunctioning.
So even if your gun did fine on the range, those pieces may be near the breaking point, and give out during the firefight.
So Fred, what was the armourer supposed to do, inspect each part of each gun with ultra sound imaging?
Glock must be counting on the fact that very few LEOs fire their weapons in the line of duty. If a LEO dies with a broken Glock in hand, then Glock would be liable in a suit. The number of incidents in New York and Arizona, couple with the lack of notices (showing prior knowledge) will look very bad to a jury. In fact, Glock believed the problem to be widespread enough to have enough parts to fix at least a couple hundred guns on hand - the parts for the fix ships in a day or two of the story.
I am surprised the county does not request bids from major handgun manufacturers, while demanding replacement/refunds on the Glocks. While I realize than any product can be flawed, the fact that Glock knew, and didn't inform any customers ruins any faith I would have in them. If they had informed LEA's that there was an issue, and they would fix it, then I might keep them. This really isn't meant to be Glock bashing, but that is how I would judge any company buy these actions.
 

bastiat

New member
Glock...perfection...for one shot... ;)

Seriously, if they knew about this in may, then in may they should have contacted every distributor and LE agency that received these guns - they should not have been in service for the past 5 months.
 

Mikul

New member
Another reason to question .40 caliber handguns. Every time I hear of failures on otherwise reliable guns, it's in .40.
 

pwd

New member
What's going on here? I just purchased a Glock 9mm manufactured in June 2002. Should I be concerned that it could have this alleged problem?
 

AZ Jeff

New member
It would be nice to know exactly what "two pieces of steel in the lower portion of the weapon" are actually failing. As it stands now, it's pretty hard for anyone to actually understand what the details of the issue are here.

Anyone know what the real details are? Please, no opinions of Glocks versus other firearms, just facts on the field failure issue here.
 

chaim

New member
Another reason to question .40 caliber handguns. Every time I hear of failures on otherwise reliable guns, it's in .40.
Not that I am a fan of .40 or really have anything against Glock, but I really have only heard of these kind of problems with .40cal Glocks. I wouldn't have any problem buying a 9mm or .45acp Glock but I'll never buy a .40s&w Glock. Then again, that was the case before I heard of the KBs and this- I'm not a big fan of the caliber. The only .40 I have is the CZ 40B (which I would have bought in 9mm if it was available, I bought it because I wanted the GUN and it was only available in .40s&w)
 

BrokenArrow

New member
Thinly veiled? Looked bare naked to me!

It's only "bashing" cuzz it's bad news; that's Glock's fault, not mine. They are the ones who sat on it since May... ;)

Not just LE contract guns either; the reserve officer purchased his separately. Have heard of several other new civilian Glocks around here doing it recently; gun I saw was a G23 had a broken locking block/pin, less than 1K rounds through it. Have heard the BCSD guns broke the same way, but not sure.

BCSD has kBd some Glock 40/45s over the yrs too; w factory ammo BTW. Still love those Glocks!

BCSD is borrowing Glock 9mms from APD. A couple weeks ago and APD officer's G19 "Phase Three" jammed during Q; gun had to be taken apart to get the case off the extractor. Let's hope they don't borrow too many that do that? ;)

Ooh! ooh! No veils on this one:

NEW GLOCK RECALL !?

This information was passed on to me by our department's Lt too late in the day for me to make any further contacts; so I'll pass on what I know and follow-up on Monday.
Apparentlly Glock is recalling and replacing the frames of pistols in the EMZ-prefix serial number range, because of "brittle" accessory rails which may shear off. Three of our department G22s are effected. Apparentlly theyare shipping new frames and we are to return the original ones once they are received. This is all I know at this time. Stay tuned...

Heard about that on 10/4, haven't seen any follow up yet...

I'm sure this is all just an ammo, limp wristing, training or maintenance issue; don't worry, be happy!
 

M1911

New member
Any idea what these parts are that are breaking and what the affected serial number range is?

M1911
 
My guess is that it's the frame rails breaking.

That's the most obvious thing I could think of that would A, be there in a pair, B) stop the gun if they broke, and C) would be machined.
 

krept

New member
Thanks for sharing and I agree that this stuff isn't even close to Glock bashing but is very informative. Very much thanks for following up with the serial #s. I'd want to know if one I just purchased could go bad.

Absolutely need better QC with firearms.

Interesting tidbit about the ammunition as well. I guess sometimes lighting strikes twice. Poor guys in the dept are probably carrying BUGs if they didn't before...
 

BrokenArrow

New member
Alleged problem pwd!?!?

Need more proof/details? Call BCSD yourself. 505-768-4100 (info), 505-845-4362 (range). They were all out to lunch when I called... ;)
 

Mikul

New member
I love H&K's, but their compact .40's are having a variety of problems including broken shock buffers and bent guide rods.

The full-sized .40's seem to have some immunity from these problems. My guess is that the heavy slide is more effective in absorbing recoil than a spring.
 
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