S&W Lock Project Ideas?

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Cosmodragoon

New member
Alright, a lot of us hate the ILS on modern Smith and Wesson Revolvers. It's not just the lock but the hole, sitting there like a drawn mustache on the face of the Mona Lisa. Yeah, I could just avoid them. The problem comes when S&W makes new guns that are just too cool to pass up. Since I'm obviously having a hard time living with that conflict, it sounds like project time! :)

I've seen people safely remove the locking mechanism. Of course, this typically leaves at least one hole in the frame and an open slot alongside the hammer where the flag used to be. I've seen people make little plugs for the big hole, and they don't look too bad. Of course, there is still that dumb little arrow and "L". So here is what I'm thinking. Not sure if steps 1 and 2 are in the right order.

1. Find someone who can effectively fill/weld any of the spaces left from lock removal, and get the surface even.

2. Get some engraving that happens to cover the "L" and arrow.

3. Get the whole thing hard-chromed

Yes, I realize this could cost as much as the gun to have done. Right now it's just an idea. If feasible, it could solve the problem and make for a very nice custom firearm. If anyone with the experience or mechanical understanding has some ideas here, I'd love to hear them. Even if it's just some leads on people who can do this kind of work, that would be great.

Thanks!
 
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g.willikers

New member
Focus on the shooting instead of the gun and those little irritations will soon become invisible.
Messing with it could easily result in disfigurements that could prove even more irritating.
Leaving it in original condition with the removed parts in hand would make it more desirable for resale, too.
 
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lamarw

New member
Then you also have the factory warranty issue.

I would suggest one would better off purchasing a used S&W revolver. There are plenty of them out there, and one could obtain an unfired or an almost new equivalent used one for the cost of the modifications mentioned in the thread starter. If a buyer is relatively new to guns, then the firearm can be checked out by a qualified gunsmith.

There is a segment of people who like the internal lock. One segment might be those with young children.
 
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bedbugbilly

New member
Good advice. I don't mean to sound harsh, but if the looks of you revolver means more than the way it shoots, then maybe you should consider dumping the newer lock model and getting q more vintage Smith that has the look you want.

I own a number of vintage Smiths . . . don't have any with the lock. Most of my vintage Smiths have good honest wear and the look of them has never been an issue with me. I only care how they shoot.

And as mentioned . . the warranty issue is a good reason not to mess with it. i know a lot of folks do though and in the end, it's your revolver. If you do remove the locking mechanism, at least hang on to it so you can put it back together as it came from the factory for resale purposes. If you weld up the hole, etc. you end up with a "bubba'd" handgun.
 
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James K

Member In Memoriam
The liability problem is not just on resale. If you remove ANY safety device on a firearm, you will end up being liable for ANY damages resulting from a negligent/accidental discharge. Period.

Yes, I know the AD/ND may have had nothing to do with the "lock" or its removal, but even if a jury of non-gun experts believe that, removal of a safety device will show that YOU are dangerous and negligent, as proven by your removing the safety device.

If someone close to you were killed by a driver who deliberately removed the brakes on his car, I suspect you would not be concerned with a technical explanation of how driver's action didn't cause the death.

FWIW, I have followed those claims of lock failure for years and have concluded that while a few seem plausible, most are plain lies, either by anti-gunners trying to ban S&W products, people wanting to "punish" the company for perceived actions, or attempts to extort money from the company.

I have several S&W revolvers with the lock (and more without) and have never had any problems with the lock (which I do not use). I have asked people who claim that the lock caused a failure to fire to allow me to examine the gun involved; none would do so, and one told me plainly that he was lying to extort money from S&W. (Didn't work, BTW.)

Jim
 
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rodfac

New member
FWIW, I have followed those claims of lock failure for years and have concluded that while a few seem plausible, most are plain lies, either by anti-gunners trying to ban S&W products, people wanting to "punish" the company for perceived actions, or attempts to extort money from the company.
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That's my take on the S&W IL issue. I too, don't like the lock, feeling that it was a misguided response to a lawyer/politician demand.

That said, I have several Smith's with the cursed IL and none have had any issues...and after a cpl weeks of use, I don't notice the IL at all. And all of my IL equipped Smiths are at least as accurate as my 'classics' from the 60's, 70's, & 80's. YMMV, Rod
 
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2123

New member
I own both pre-lock and post-lock S&W revolvers. I prefer the pre-lock models, but don't have any issues with the post-lock models.

Both versions shoot just fine and I've never had any issues with the lock models.

As others have suggested, if you don't want an internal-lock model, pony up some money and buy pre-lock ones.

There's still plenty to be had.
 
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Stephanie B

New member
The Wuffo Test

You'd have to pass the "Wuffo Test", as in "wuffo you wanna do that?"

Seriously. There are plenty of good pre-lock and pre-MIM S&W revolvers out there. Why mess with this one?
 
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fourbore

New member
There are people that make machined plugs that fill the hole and secure from the inside of the gun. Google S&W "the plug"
Click to expand...

IF, (that is if) I was ever going to buy a locking S&W revolver and I wanted a cosmetic fix, this would be my approach.

I hate chrome. I hate engraving. More than a lock. So....I would take a pass on the OP's steps 2 & 3. Welding is tricky business, while a plug is simple and safe. And reversible. That is a clean sweep. I do not like any aspect of the proposal.

Buying the new S&W is rewarding the wrong headed management. JUST SAY NO! The lock will be gone fast.
 
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FrankenMauser

New member
Buy a pre-lock model and have it turned into exactly what you want.

In the hands of a good 'smith, it'll come out better than any of the 'cool' stuff that S&W is selling now.
 
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Cosmodragoon

New member
Thanks for the responses. I figured people might say "just buy an old one" and maybe I should have been clearer. I have a few of the older ones. I like them very much. As I did say, "the problem comes when S&W makes new guns that are just too cool to pass up." It happened to me. I thought I could learn to get over the lock but it still bugs me. Yet, I do shoot the gun (with focus) and otherwise love it. I'm just trying to see if I can spin this dissonance into a fun project.

Yeah, reports of failure may be rare or even exaggerated. I don't know for sure, but it is something that could happen. It is an extra system that could go wrong and it's one that I don't think should be there in the first place. As per legal risk, I'm not terribly worried. Yes, there is the perception of "ZOMG, he removed the SAFETY!!!". So too could it be said: "he had deadly expanding hollowpoints to maximize damage", or "he was carrying full-power MAGNUM ammo", or "he was stalking around the woods with a giant high-capacity revolver", or "he had a 'trigger job' to get a hair trigger on that thing", or just plain "he had a gun and is therefore the devil". All that and more could come up after any incident, whether defensive shooting or negligent discharge. I haven't had either of those things happen to me either, and I think it's at least a wash with the chance of a lock failure.

(Whatever the case, I'm sure we can all agree that any of that is less likely than someone someday locking it and losing the key, or not being able to dig it out in a hurry.)

That said, any kinds of modifications could present issues. Some of the resistance here looks like resistance to modification in general. As I hope is clear now, it's not like this is my only gun. I've taken it on the occasional woods walk but it isn't a regular carry gun. I'm not worried about resale.

Lastly, I don't have any engraved guns. I don't have any chrome guns. I'm not sure about the engraving but I do think a modest matte finish would look nice and I hear it's the bee's knees as far as surfaces go.
 
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CajunBass

New member
I wonder if there is something like Bondo, you could use to plug the hole, (after removing the lock of course) smooth it out nicely, then hard chrome, or some other finish to cover it? It would have to be something that could be worked and smoothed out, but that would stay in place and not cause an internal problem. JB Weld maybe? I don't know, I've never done anything like that, but maybe someone else has.

Personally, I just put a key on my key chain. I figure if Mr. Murphy is right, that means I'll never have a failure. That would only happen if I didn't have a key (worst possible time).

I had convinced myself I didn't like the lock. Now I've just convinced myself I don't care about it one way or the other.
 
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Texas45

New member
Look in to a product called METALSET.
Superior to JB weld.
Can drill,tap,sand, paint,grind it etc
e98f5df91bd3b8030757a6e957bd846c.jpg



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
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RJM52

New member
I really think that S&W is hoping all us Old Heads die off and all the new revolver shooters just ignore The Hole and sales will continue...

What I don't understand however is the fact that S&W now produces guns without the IL...why? And they must have had enough feedback by now to make them realize that they could probably increase sales by 20% if they just stated making most of their models without the IL... If they had produced their Classic Series without the IL how many more guns would have they sold...my bet is a lot...

Last count I had 45 S&W DA revolvers...only two of which have the IL. And I only own them because these models, 4" 500 and a 686-7 .38 Super, were never produced without the IL...

And remember unlike the Colt 1911 SERIES 80 firing pin block, the S&W IL has nothing to do with the safe or unsafe operation of the of the gun...it is a STORAGE LOCK.

In the last year I purchased six centerfire DA revolvers....all Rugers...

Bob
 
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Jim Watson

New member
And remember unlike the Colt 1911 SERIES 80 firing pin block, the S&W IL has nothing to do with the safe or unsafe operation of the of the gun...it is a STORAGE LOCK.
Click to expand...

IDPA allows disabling of "storage locks" and magazine disconnects.
USPSA allows disabling of magazine disconnects and grip safeties (except in Production.) No mention of key locks.

I haven't heard a liability argument against replacing the mainspring housing of a Springfield to eliminate the ILS key lock. That is an invisible action, the part with the lock is no longer on the gun, no holes to plug. And SA has apparently quit installing it.
 
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Hal

New member
I really think that S&W is hoping all us Old Heads die off and all the new revolver shooters just ignore The Hole and sales will continue...
Click to expand...
Remember when Ruger was a dirty word?
(if you do, then please keep it to yourself until one of the younger members answers "No", or "What in the world are you talking about?"?)

All things must pass.....
 
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