Response from my "rosie" webpage

[Rob Pincus]

Months ago I used some of the free webspace offered by Rosie O'Donnel to condemn her statements made in the wake of the Columbine Incident.

I received the following letter and I sent the following response from that page.

I encourage you to politely invite "Judy" to visit TFL and learn a little about the issue of gun control and "automatic" weapons.

Letter to Me:

Jumeaujs1@aol.com wrote:

I agree with you that some of Rosie's comments were a little "over the top"
and not well thought out. BUT, she was speaking in the heat of the moment,
after more than 2 dozen students had been murdered!! Please keep that in
mind.
I firmly believe in a citizen's right to "bear arms", but I DO NOT think that
right should include - ANY RAPID FIRE AUTOMATIC WEAPONS. These are
weapons
made for the sole purpose of killing human beings. YOU know that and I know
that.
My husband is a hunter and we have guns in our home. I would NEVER, however,
alllow any type of rapid fire, assault weapons in my home.
Many of these guns are designed to use bullets that penetrate the vests worn
by our police officers and, as I said, have NO purpose other than to kill
humans.
You and I both know that when our Forefathers added this particular "right"
to our Bill of Rights, they could never have forseen the condition our nation
would be in today or the ways in which this, "so called" right, would be
misused and abused.
The bottom line here is this - THE MANUFACTURE, SALE AND
IMPORTATION OF ALL
RAPID FIRE ASSAULT TYPE WEAPONS SHOULD BE MADE ILLEGAL IN
THIS COUNTRY AND
THERE SHOULD BE STIFF PUNISHMENTS FOR THOSE WHO VIOLATE
THIS LAW.
I plan to support Rosie in her fight to ban these weapons. The banning al
all weapons, however, was not a well thought out statement on her part. BUT,
the banning of the many so called "street" weapons is a cause worth fighting
for.
Manufacturers know that Tech 9's and other low cost automatic weapons
usually end up in the hands of gang members. theives and drug dealers.
The NRA is just afraid that if they give one inch on any point then they will
open the door to other anti-gun legislation. How wrong of the NRA to put
their own desires before the safety of our nation's children and young adults.
I will do everything within my power to see that these type of weapons are
made illegal.
Sincerely,
Judy

My Reponse:

Judy,

I appreciate your passion and intentions, but you are wrong. I assure you that your
husband's hunting rifle is much more capable of pentrating cars, doors and Police
Officer's vests than any Tech 9.
"Rapid fire automatic assualt weapon" might sound great on TV, but in reality I feel that
you have no idea what you are talking about. Competition shooters can shoot 6 shots
from Single Action revolvers (ie- VERY old fashioned "SLOW" revolvers like the
cowboys of the old west used") in less than 2 seconds.
Furthermore, "automatic", in reference to a firearm, means that the gun will fire more
than one shot with each pull of the trigger. The gun firs "automatically" while the trigger is
held. I assure you that the tech-9 is not automatic. In fact, it is very hard to get a
automatic weapon in this country, unless you are a branch of the military or a Law
Enforcement Agency. You cannot just walk into a shop and get one, it is a process that
takes several months, an intense background check, a special tax to be paid and the
permission of your local police chief or sheriff.
Again, I appreciate your intentions, but you are making statements and using
information that is wrong. Part of the reason you have phrases in your mind that make
you sound ignorant is because of Rosie O'Donnel and her ilk. They repeatedly mislead
the public and blatantly lie. I encourage you to continue being concerned about the
safety of Children and Police Officers. I have children and I am a police officer. But, I
encourage you to become more educated about the issue and firearms themselves.
I suggest you visit Http://www.thefiringline.com . I think you will find a lot of helpful
people there who are willing to listen to your concerns and help you learn about
firearms.

Take Care,

Rob







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-Essayons

 

[Jeff OTMG]

Gee, where have we all heard that information and 'logic' before. The 'facts' and 'opinion' are a regurgitation of the HCI website. You would expect people with a mind to think would investigate and formulate their own thoughts rather than being a mindless zombie, spewing forth comments about a subject that they have absolutely no knowledge of. Reminds me of the lady congresswoman from Ca. speaking of 'high capacity ammunition cartridges'. She wants to pass a law and does not even know what she is passing a law against. Trying to look intelligent by repeating something you here without verifying the information can make you look like a total idiot.

 

[elector]

At the success and pervasiveness of anti-gun propaganda AKA The Big Lie, I'd guess that Dr. Goebbels is grinning from his permanent home in the lowest level of hell.

 

[Jedi Oomodo]

"High capacity ammunition cartridges", eh?

"Factories and citizens who are Re-loading, shall not include more grains of powder in the cartridge case than table 3455-17(subch. R) indicates for the particular bullet weight and caliber of the ammunition being loaded".

The next "first step" in gun control, schmaybe?

------------------
"Fear is the path to the Dark Side...
Fear leads to gun laws, gun laws lead to disarmament, disarmament... leads to Tyranny!"

-------------------------

"If it isn't Scottish, it's CRAP!"

 

[Miss Demeanors]

This sounds all to familiar to me. This is the way I thought some months back. But now I know the truth and think this person should educate herself as well. The intentions are there just going about this in the wrong way. I really think that if they ban these types of guns the only people that are going to lose out are the law abiding citizens, the gang bangers will still get them no matter what the law is. All they need to do is stiffen the laws that already exist and educate these kids some more, seems more simple than wasting time trying to ban guns on grounds of an uneducated guess.

 

[Paul Revere]

This woman is educated. Educated by mass media, which perpetuates the agenda of the establishment, that being...lies, distortions, and fabrications. What she refers to is a direct result of media propaganda. She is convinced that she IS educated on the subject and will argue the point until she is blue in the face. But she is unfortuneately not alone. Most Americans who have an opinion about gun control have received the same kind of brain washing.


Refer these folks to this site: http://www.gunowners.org/fs9901.htm

That should shed some light on their ignorance.

 

[CMOS]

Good thread Rob.

Miss Demeanors, I hope you will email this woman yourself. As one who has "traveled that road" (to knowledge) you may be viewed as someone who she will listen to, if even for a moment.

Good response from you Rob. I suspect she will do what most liberals do - put her fingers in her ears and repeat "I just know I'm right".

CMOS

 

[Mikey]

If you tell the same lie enough times.....

I am a certified firearms instructor and competitive shooter. Every male member of my family hunts and shoots.

And my own Mother believed that the Clinton assault weapons ban was enacted to "finally get those damn machine guns off the street"!

Worse yet, when I tried to tell her the truth over Thanksgiving Day dinner it started an argument with her defense being "I know what I saw! They showed it right there on the news - an AK-47 spewing bullets 90 to nothin'!"

And even worse than that, while teaching the Tennessee Carry Permit safety class, I discovered that at least half the folks getting their permits thought there was already gun registration. I can't count the times someone said they wanted to use a different gun in class but that one wasn't registered!

How do you educate a public that is being bombarded with misinformation everytime they turn on the TV or radio??

Mikey

 

[RepublicThunderbolt]

"My husband is a hunter and we have guns in our home. I would NEVER, however, allow any type of rapid fire, assault weapons in my home. Many of these guns are designed to use bullets that penetrate the vests worn by our police officers and, as I said, have NO purpose other than to kill humans."

As if "hunting" rounds won't punch vests? A local LEO here was killed serving a warrant by a .30-30 Winchester 94 fired through a front door and his vest. Also have to wonder if those guns in her home might be "assault" calibers like .30-06. Personally, I'd rather take fire from some clown with a piece of junk like the TEC-9 than, say, a bolt-action .416 Rigby. Take a look at how well restrictions on "military" firearms work at...

http://www.geocities.com/Pentagon/Quarters/2928/07dig.html

"You and I both know that when our Forefathers added this particular "right" to our Bill of Rights, they could never have forseen the condition our nation would be in today or the ways in which this, "so called" right, would be misused and abused."

On the contrary, I think the "condition" of our Republic is exactly the kind of thing the Founders had in mind while composing the Bill of Rights.

"The NRA is just afraid that if they give one inch on any point then they will open the door to other anti-gun legislation."

See England, Austraila, et cetera...and of course, the NRA has been entirely too willing to "compromise" of late, anyway.

Yeah, I know these people just spout the same pabulum the media force-feeds them, but the real tragedy is hearing the "hunter" saying "ban those nasty black rifles, 'cause I ain't got me none of those" or the gun shop owner gleefully touting restrictions on gun show or private sales because they cut into his "action".

[This message has been edited by RepublicThunderbolt (edited July 07, 1999).]

 

[Miss Demeanors]

CMOS, I will send her an email tonight, will let you know if she responds!

 

[Miss Demeanors]

Ok its done and in her email box!

[This message has been edited by Miss Demeanors (edited July 07, 1999).]

 

[Futo Inu]

Rob, you are to be commended. You have more patience than me in even being able to write a reasoned response without flaming her too much. In truth, we will probably have to be even gentler than you were, however, in first educating typical uninformed antis like her.

We have have GOT to get two ideas through the thick thick skulls of the antis and anti leaders.

1. If you want to do something "for the children", then we need more guns, not less. Prof Lott unequivocally, scientifically proved that more guns=less crime, and that more guns save lives and save social costs. No one has been able to successfully challenge his impeccable academic research based on 15 YEARS ('77 - '92) and over 3000 counties in the US. More guns save lives, not the other way around, contrary to what most people think (understandably, I suppose).

2. Yes, you're right. These weapons ARE absolutely designed to kill people. So what part about self-defense and the citizen's militia do you not understand? [Wait for response; then proceed to explain everything about the militia, protection from enemies foreign & domestic, tyrants, self-defense, on and on - the point is "the second amendment has NOTHING to do with hunting".]

 

[fubsy]

which one of the compromise gun bans that we accepted got rid of the cheap saturday night special.....was it 68?......when ever it was after that the bad guys started using real guns and real calibers......so much for gun control.....sheesh,....durn idiots...fubsy.

 

[4V50 Gary]

Futo Inu,

Are you suggesting that we're to buy guns For the Children? OK, I will.

Gary

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Vigilantibus et non dormientibus jura subveniunt




[This message has been edited by 4V50 Gary (edited July 07, 1999).]

 

[TheBluesMan]

I think we should take Rob's idea a step further and politely invite all people from anti-gun forums to a special, permanent thread here at TFL where level-headed informed people like Rob and Miss Demeanors can help them see our side of the issues.

I know that the majority of antis wouldn't listen or even try it, but there are always a few who try to keep an open mind. It is these people who are the most important to reach.

The hard part will be to avoid flaming these folks for their beliefs and we would all have to restrain ourselves and let our better judgement rule the moment.

At the very least, it would make an interesting thread. What do you think? Is it worth a try?



-I must go and talk with those who would listen. --Dances with Wolves

 

[Scxorch]

I know the issue has been skirted, but will someone please tell her that fully automaic assault weapons that she so colorfully described have been "banned" (liberals favorite word-ever notice how they cannot speak without uttering it?} since 1936 (or '38, or '34)!!!!!

The so called "assault" weapons ban only banned semi automatic copies of these fully automatic military and law enforcement weapons. While they may look ugly, that is no excuse for infringing on our second amendment rights! That's like locking up people and calling them criminals...just because they are UGLY! Oh oh...

[This message has been edited by Scxorch (edited July 08, 1999).]

[This message has been edited by Scxorch (edited July 08, 1999).]

 

[Jeff OTMG]

Not trying to be a jerk, just informative, it was NFA 1934, GCA 1968, FOPA 1986.

 

[Ipecac]

Rob, good letter. I would like to see all of us try to explain to the mis-or-uninformed what our rights really are, however.
"so called rights" wow, we have a long way to go. Futo Inu, you're on target. Fire for effect.

4V50Gary, since you're buying guns for kids, will you adopt me?

 

[CMOS]

Miss Demeanors, please post your email to her for us to read. Thanks.

CMOS

 

[Miss Demeanors]

This is kind of long so be prepared!

Dear Judy,

My name is Sandy and I am a 28 y/o mom of a 4 y/o girl. I am also a fan of Rosie. I have a few comments on your ban the guns issue and hope you will take the time to listen to my story.

Let me start by saying that I have a fear of guns. When I was 16 a boyfriend of mine got ahold of his fathers gun, played with it, and shot himself in the head. I was there, I was sitting next to him, it's something I will never forget. After that I had a terrible fear of guns and the violence that goes with them.

I watch Rosie and had seen her campaign against guns. I could understand where she was coming from. I took the inititave of writing my congressman stating that I wanted the violence to end. I used to post at Wb Rosie boards and when all of this started up we had alot of people that came there just to bash our opinions. I couldnt understand why so many were for guns and so many not. Both sides had good arguements. So instead of arguing about an issue I really did not have that much knowledge about, I decided to learn more about them and what they are capable of. I talked with some nice people that were willing to provide me with information and not bash me. I looked up statistics, lots of them. I looked up types of guns and what they are capable of. When I had questions they were answered in an educated manner. After looking into all of this, my feelings about guns began to change. I have learned that these "fully automatic assult weapons" are already illegal and can not be obtained by a citizen. The larger weapons that are being defined as "Assult weapons" are nothing more than a rifle in most cases. The media and government just gave them an "evil" name. They are not the guns that you and I see in the movies. The media has led us to believe that. By banning these weapons, we will only accomplish taking them out of the hands of law abiding citizens, and not out of those who chose to commit crimes. The gang bangers will always get them, whether they are legal or not. It's like drugs, they are supposed to be illegal yet so many people obtain them. Anything in this country that is illegal can be and will be obtained one way or another, sad to say but that is a fact. I cant tell you how much I feel for those children at Columbine and their families. It hurts to see our children living in such a violent world and becoming violent themselves. But we can help without banning guns or adding more gun laws. I, personally, think we should have metal detectors at all schools, this will stop the guns from getting in there in the first place. I think we need to educate our children with facts and morals. We need to educate the children about firearms and what they are capable of, it's not what they see in the movies. The NRA has an excellent program called Eagle Eddie. It is designed for younger children. It teaches them that firearms are dangerous and not something to play with. Kind of like Smokey the Bear and fires. It is so good to establish this in their minds at a young age, that is when they are most vulnerable. Last but not least, the gun laws that ALREADY exist need to be enforced and have stiffer penalties. If you do some research for yourself, you will see that very few people are actually prosecuted for gun crimes. What does this teach our children? If you break the law you will get a slap on the hand and be sent home? These kids today are not afraid of consequence. We need to establish that this type of behavior will not be tolerated under any condition. That is what is going to provide more saftey for our children. Like I said above, I AM a mom and believe me my heart is in the same place as yours, but you cant fight something that you know nothing about. I have retracted my statements to my congressman. You know as well as I do guns will always be out there in the hands of criminals along with drugs and everything else that is illegal. To be honest, I feel safer knowing that law abiding citizens have guns and own them, maybe one day they will save you or one of your children from a crime, how would you feel then? If we ban guns there will be more crime than there is today.

Thanks for taking the time to listen to my story.