reloading match grade LC 223/5.56
- Thread starter rebs
- Start date
"...year date, volume or weigh the cases..." Makes no difference of any kind. It's how you load 'em that matters. The bullet is important but meticulous loading techniques are most important. And that means weighing each and every powder charge plus having the cases all the same length to start.
Granted not all of this is pertinent to say 1/4 MOA to 1/2 MOA loads in a gas gun, but the basic fundamentals are relevant. Take a read of the article, and if you want to dive down the rabbit hole of testing, set aside $10K to get started.
http://precisionrifleblog.com/2013/...-warehouse-lessons-in-extreme-rifle-accuracy/
I am a bit stubborn, and so I don't like to take what others say without some challenge and verification, so I did play with the parameters mentioned. I have a disproportionate number of 21 and 22 inch rifle barrels, and yes 2 at 21.75". When I do a 10 shot load development test and place my charge weight appropriately in the node, +/- 0.1 grains is irrelevant, so I load on the progressive.
Enjoy the process!
http://precisionrifleblog.com/2013/...-warehouse-lessons-in-extreme-rifle-accuracy/
I am a bit stubborn, and so I don't like to take what others say without some challenge and verification, so I did play with the parameters mentioned. I have a disproportionate number of 21 and 22 inch rifle barrels, and yes 2 at 21.75". When I do a 10 shot load development test and place my charge weight appropriately in the node, +/- 0.1 grains is irrelevant, so I load on the progressive.
Enjoy the process!
by no means am I an expert on this, but from a sorting standpoint, I have found some pretty drastic differences in years and case length. LC(13) almost all were 1.901-1.9015. I don't know enough to say those 1.901" cases are too short or not, but i have set them aside for now and am working with LC (11) trimmed to 2.00". that was a good length that didn't require culling out a great many short ones.
Another observation on SAME year dates, not all LC (11) are the same. I found a few, less than 10, where the head stamps were oriented opposite all the others. stamped information oriented to be read from the center out, as opposed to being read from the outside. Also the fonts were a different. Just saying the year is just a starting point, at least for me.
Another observation on SAME year dates, not all LC (11) are the same. I found a few, less than 10, where the head stamps were oriented opposite all the others. stamped information oriented to be read from the center out, as opposed to being read from the outside. Also the fonts were a different. Just saying the year is just a starting point, at least for me.
bacardisteve
New member
I can get 3/4 moa out of mixed lc brass that has been well prepped(flash hole deburred,primer pockets uniformed, consistent length etc) with h335 and thrown charges. I can get that down to half moa if i sort cases by weight and hand trickle.
Neck tension is controlled by hardness, inner diameter and neck thickness.
Necks can be thin’d or evened out by neck turning, or better brass can be bought.
ID is a result of you sizing process. Dies can be modified to produce larger or smaller I’d.
Hardness is controlled by keeping brass sorted by # of firings. Annealing can help even out and reduce hardness.
Necks can be thin’d or evened out by neck turning, or better brass can be bought.
ID is a result of you sizing process. Dies can be modified to produce larger or smaller I’d.
Hardness is controlled by keeping brass sorted by # of firings. Annealing can help even out and reduce hardness.
How much difference on the target you expect to see Rebs ? Last year I took a bolt action .223 with a match grade barrel, aftermarkey trigger and stock. The I weighed out cases, did the water volume thing, sorted by year etc. Weighed and sorted bullets. Went to the range and did chrono tests and grouping tests and at the end discovered no difference in velocity consistency or grouping consistency.
The rifle has repeatedly shot .5 and .6 MOA 10 shot groups at 300 yards with non sorted cases and non weighed bullets. Once put 19 out of 20 into a 1 inch high ribbon at 300 and have posted pics of the groups when load testing
Now may you will be able to separate the difference in accuracy and precision from the noise of gun capability and shooter technique with your AR , but I sure the heck couldn't with my rifle. A 1000 yard benchrester might but I can't.
Anyway have fun sorting, it is a great way to spend a winter evening. If I lived up north I would probably be sorting primers while watching cat videos
The rifle has repeatedly shot .5 and .6 MOA 10 shot groups at 300 yards with non sorted cases and non weighed bullets. Once put 19 out of 20 into a 1 inch high ribbon at 300 and have posted pics of the groups when load testing
Now may you will be able to separate the difference in accuracy and precision from the noise of gun capability and shooter technique with your AR , but I sure the heck couldn't with my rifle. A 1000 yard benchrester might but I can't.
Anyway have fun sorting, it is a great way to spend a winter evening. If I lived up north I would probably be sorting primers while watching cat videos
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hounddawg, did you already have an Optimum Charge Weight figured out before the testing?
@jdc sorting cases by weight and water volume was something I did one time and decided it was a waste of time. Neither my groups or my velocity consistency changed in any way in a test of 25 rounds sorted and 25 randomly picked. But some in the the .1 benchrest crowd thinks it makes a difference so whatever floats your boat
@ Rebs post a few pics of your targets and your benchrest gun, I am sure everyone would be happy to help you analyze targets. I love pictures, they say so much more than words
@ Rebs post a few pics of your targets and your benchrest gun, I am sure everyone would be happy to help you analyze targets. I love pictures, they say so much more than words
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Interesting. My biggest lot of LC brass is LC11, including 1K that I bought new, unprimed. I'm fixing to process all of it, it's all once-fired now, and start the tedious task of checking case length... I'll be curious to see what I find.
As far as benchrest cases, I would start with a known... something like Lapua.... if you are going to go through all the trouble of working the cases. I'm not found LC, particularly in 7.62mm, to be all that consistent.
Don Fischer
New member
I don't shoot match but if I did, the only thing that would change from what I do now is the bullet I'd choose and size of group I'd settle on. I do admit that I go a bit farther than some in reloading but I simply don't go overboard. I don't adjust the distance off the lands, I don't weigh bullet's, don't reburr flash holes or any of the other thing's match shooters do. Generally a hunting rifle shooting 1" groups at 100 yds is good enough for me but, I only have eight rifles. On 308 is for cast bullet's only, my 30-06 and 6.5x55 hang right around 1" +/- my 25-06 runs right at 3/4"- and both my 243's run at and a bit under 1/2". Now the best group I ever shoot was .009" ctc with my 25-06 and 100gr SMK. I looked at that and put the gun away without shooting it again. I know I can't do that again. Oh yea, I have a 6.5x05 that with 140gr SMK's runs at about 1/4" at 100yds.
I think the load for a match rifle is very important and of course the rifle itself even more so but the most important factor I believe is the shooter. Never seen or heard of anyone deburring their own flash hole to shoot better!
I think the load for a match rifle is very important and of course the rifle itself even more so but the most important factor I believe is the shooter. Never seen or heard of anyone deburring their own flash hole to shoot better!
amen to that Don. I would bet Norm Harrold (1000 yd F class champion) could loan me his rifle and ammo and take mine and beat me handily any day of the week at any range in any condition.
wanna find out if it is the equipment or you do some practice with a .22LR at 100 and 200. Shoot some groups on a dead calm day the do the same on a windy day. Humbling does not begin to describe it