Reloading and the Mrs.

Harry Callahan

New member
I have made numerous attempts to get the green light from the wife to do some reloading on my own. I know it's much cheaper and probably alot of fun. Mrs Callahan is afraid I'll blow up the house. Any tips on how to "grease the skids" and put her mind at ease. Also, what are the pros/cons of reloading?:confused:
 

DAVID NANCARROW

New member
1st question:does Mrs Callahan shoot too? That was my "in" with the Mrs. Simple economics-which seemed to make sense to her. We could practice a lot more on the same amount of money.
 

Hal

New member
Storing smokeless power is safer than storing gasoline. Just make sure you don't put it a container (like a safe) that will confine it if it touches off.

Primers are a different story.
Generally I only keep 500 to 1000 primers on hand at any given point. I do this for a couple of reasons.
#1- I'm a sporadic loader. I can go months or in the present case, a couple of years, in between. I prefer to have "fresh" primers so I usually only buy enough for a couple of sessions.
#2- I've read that primers can be the most dangerous component to store. True or not, I'm content to err on the side of caution.
(YMMV on the primer part)

Far and away the largest benefit reloading offers me is economy. Some will counter that you don't save anything simply because you'll shoot more ammo.
That isn't true in my case, and probably quite a few other cases also. The reason is that my shooting time is very restricted. I have Lot's of "free time" to load ammo, but not a lot of time to haul everything to the range, setup, shoot then come home and clean all the guns later.
Bottom line here is if your range time limits the amount of ammo you can shoot, then you can save a considerable amount of money.

Another perspective on savings/economy would be using the more costly or exotic calibers, such as the .44 magnum, the ,454 Casuall, the .45LC, the .44WCF etc. Factory ammo for all of these calibers can be pricey. .44mag Factor ammo runs about $20/$25 a box for 50 rounds. Using bulk Hornady swaged lead bullets over a charge of ~ 17 gr of Alliant 2400, I can handload for the .44mag for roughly 1/4 the cost of factory ammo. This is a pretty stiff .44Spl +P+ or "light magnum" load, depending on how you look at it.
Again, the cost savings comes from not wanting to run through too many of them at one sitting. Even though I have a virtually unlimited amount of it, my desire to shoot more than 50 to 75 rounds of it per outing is very, very low.
I find it becomes unpleasant at that point.

Yet another cost savings perspective would be in the case of the less pedestrian calibers or more exotic (.44WCF. or .45 Auto Rim etc.). I lost count of the number of people here that voiced concern over the availability of some caliber or another in their area.
By handloading/reloading, you're always a set of dies and the purchase of brass away from just about any caliber you can imagine.

#2 benefit (IMHO) comes from the fact that you always use premium ammo when you shoot handloads. It costs the same amount to assemble a "junk range load" quality level as it does a premium self defense load (such as Hydar Shocks). By working up the exact ballisitc duplicate of .45acp Hydra Shoks, but using less costly cast lead ot FMJ bullets, you can practice with the same basic load you use for defense. No, it won't perform the same when it strikes the target, but since the target is only paper it doesn't matter.
Many will tell you this doesn't matter or it's a minor detail. IMHO, that's the wrong attitude. Overlooking minor details is generally what leads to a larger disaster. If you take care of all the details, it's amazing how well everything falls into place.

Cost of getting into it - can vary from around $20/$25 to $1000.
Figure on at least $200 to start by the time you buy a press, set of dies, powder, bullets, primers, scale, powder measure and find a source for brass.
IMHE - don't skimp on the scale and the powder measure. I tried and it doesn't work out. Get a good scale and a good powder measure.
I finally broke down and invested ~ $60 in a Hornady scale, but I'm still struggling with a $25 Lee powder measure. My ancient Lee turret press (which many consider junk - and I guess I do also since it is made of inferior materials) refuses to give up the ghost, even after close to 25 years of use.
If you want to explore the upper areas of caliber potential (ie: Load em "HOT"), you need a very accurate accounting of your powder. This isn't the place to cut corners when 1/10 of a grain can mean the difference between "safe" and "too much pressure".

If I get a chance, I'll post a picture of my planned relaoding setup also.
Sears had a miter saw stand on sale last week for $89, and I just picked up a second one. The whole thing folds down for storage. I mounted all my tools (miter saws, router bench, drill press, dremel tools) on 2'x3' pieces of plywood, plus picked up some blank 2'x3' pieces of 3/4" plywood for other assorted platforms.
One of those sheets is going to be used for mounting my reloading press and as a loading/cleaning station.
Broken down/folded up, the whole shebang will fit neatly into the corner of a closet and take up a little more space than a couple of shoeboxes and an umbrella or 3.
I figure I can roll it out and set it up in a matter of minutes.
 

rangermonroe

New member
Probably explaining that the 5oo rounds of various ammunition you have laying around is much more dangerous than the pound or two in a plastic container you will need. If you start reloading, you will soon have a lot more than 500 on hand.

Or that the gas tank on the BBQ will blow up with a considerable ammount more force.

Pull a couple bullets with pliers, pour the powder on the ground somewhere safe, and light it up. Do this first by yourself, so she wont hear you manaically laughing. After you settle yourself down, show her.

Gunpowder burns vigorously, but unless contained, it is not very impressive. Lotsa fun, but not as fun as pyrodex.

After that, say "See, I couldn't blow us up if I tried. Now get your sexy self out here and check out my new reloading set up!"
 

BobGnKY

New member
Perhaps pour a small amount of gunpowder into an ash tray and light it with a match to show her that gunpowder doesn't "explode" unliss it is confined, and that should anything happen, it will only burn.
 

JJB2

Moderator
might be good for some quality time together......

i guess when i started reloading i didn't ask the spousal unit what she thought of it. i just got a set up and had a good friend teach me how it was done.... if your wife would come in to your loading room and sit and help you do some she would see for herself how safe it is and fun too.... a great hobby to do together....


LIFE IS SHORT...............
 

cloudcroft

New member
I agree with JJB2...

YOU are supposed to be the man of the house. I realize that's QUITE a novel thought and so uncommon nowadays but it IS supposed to be the case regardless.

Life IS short, as JB22 says, and you'll be dead before you know it, so why STILL be so timid/emasculated the rest of your life?

So stop asking permission of people to do what you want to do, especially at your age.

A lot of married men think it's funny they have to ask permission from their wife to do ANYthing. Other Caspar Milquetoast individuals think so, too. It's kind of a "mens' club" for the sheepish I guess.

But it isn't funny, it's pathetic.

So just do it.

-- John D.
 

amamnn

New member
I can just imagine what a woman's reaction would be to lighting off an ashtray of 748. I don't think I'd try that one. Depending upon your self control and/or the intensity of your addiction, it can be hard to make a case for saving money, too. Don't let her see all the neat toys and tools available beyond a Lee startup kit and you might be able to sneak that one past her.
If you have a garage, you might be able to do it in there where married men are banished for most of their hobbies.
 

gb_in_ga

New member
Smokeless powder by itself is nice and stable, even if it did catch on fire it won't explode unless it is tightly contained.

Primers are more sensitive, those are where the real hazzard is. Even then, reasonable precautions make them safe to handle.

Point out that you can quickly recover the cost of a simple entry level reloading outfit in no time, assuming that you shoot any sort of volume and/or calibers that are pricey to buy factory ammo for, and from that point onwards you are major league saving on ammo costs. That always get's 'em.

Pro's -- lower ammo costs, higher quality ammo, the ability to tailor loads to the individual shooter & gun, makes less common/less available calibers shootable for the mere mortal. Also -- becomes part and parcel of the whole "shooting experience", you have more of a feeling of "involvement" in the whole process. Gives you an excuse to go out and do some more shooting, in order to try out yet another permutation on your pet load(s).

Con's -- Hmm -- that's harder. You have to factor in your time -- some find it to be just not worth the bother, oddly enough. It can be a pain to get your supplies, especially if there isn't anything like a decent reliable supplier in your local area. HAZMAT fees can eat your lunch if you have to have your powder or primers shipped to you. Surprisingly enough, you will find yourself shooting more and some will find that increasing volume of ammo ends up costing more in the long run, even given reloads. And -- nobody really wants to stay with their introductory reloading setup -- it ends up growing on you. Sorta like eating potato chips.
 

Tim R

New member
I guess I'm lucky. 25 something years ago the Mrs. was complaining about $12.50 for a box of Winchester 30-06 and suggested I start reloading.

Her suggestion has saved a lot more for my shooting than I've spent on it. Center fire factory ammo has been rare around here for years. I would not be able to afford the ammo to shoot High Power if I didn't reload.
 

Harry Callahan

New member
Thanks to all who responded with thoughtful insight.
To Cloudcroft, how can I say this nicely...you don't know much about women. Are you married? If so is Mrs Cloudcroft allowed to have a mind of her own? My wife is also a mother and is very protective of our children as any mother would/should be. She doesn't share my love of firearms and shooting just like I don't share her love of some things but I have finally talked her into at least trying it, so I feel I have my foot in the door on this issue. Many of her feelings are a little over the top in my view but nevertheless you have to pick your fights. Marriage is a game of compromise-on both sides and I've been playing this game with this wonderful woman for 14 years. Before you judge me walk a mile in my shoes.:rolleyes:
 

Art Eatman

Staff in Memoriam
I agree with BobGnKy. Demonstrate that smokeless powder burns; it doesn't explode.

FWIW--and you may quote me :) --I started reloading in 1950, at the tender age of 16. I have yet to excite a wife with any problem, much less myself.

If she can walk and chew gum at the same time, reloading should be no problem whatsoever. It'll give her something to do in the evening besides watch TV. :D

Art
 

stinger

New member
Mr. Callahan,

I have never been in your shoes, your wife's shoes, nor my wife's shoes. I wear my own.

I am a grown man. I make my own decisions. I certainly take my wife's feelings and thoughts into consideration when I am doing or buying something. But the final decision is MINE.

I certainly would not stop my wife from doing something she wanted to do, so why would I let her stop me. As long as I am not bankrupting the family, or neglecting my duties as a husband and father, what should she care.

I don't know you, but I have a buddy who I would consider is very similar to you. Nice guy, nice wife, but she has him by the cajones. He cannot do anything without her permission. It doesn't matter if it is golf, shooting, hunting, or anything else. He cannot do it if she won't let him.

I don't need permission. My wife doesn't need permission. We are both adults. I didn't get married to have a boss, or another mother. I married a partner so that we could share our lives together. It isn't sharing if she makes all of the decisions.

It is not like you are contemplating doing something immoral or unethical, so what should she care? Reloading is safer than mowing the lawn. Just follow all applicable safety precautions, and do your thing.

I mean no hard feelings. Just something to ponder.
 

cloudcroft

New member
Harry Callahan,

Mine was a "thoughtful reply," too...it's just that you didn't want to hear it.

Besides, would the "real" Dirty Harry (name you use) ask permission for ANYthing?

Harry Callahan, I think not, but Walter Mitty sure would.

I'm just saying it's time to get into reloading if that's what you want to do...this life will be over before you know it so you may as well do some things while you can that you've put off up until now...at least while you still have the interest, inclination and enthusiasm...three things that often disappear as we get older.

Makes sense to me.


stinger,

Well said.


-- John D.
 

Harry Callahan

New member
You know guys as much as I hate to admit it you bring up some very valid points and maybe some "adjustments" need to be made. My wife is a fine woman but she can be a control freak. I'll have to work on that. By the way, thanks for the constructive criticizm. No offense taken.
 

Tim R

New member
Harry, sounds like you are going to go for it. Do your home work and buy once. Cheap isn't always good.

I'm sure the wife will lighten up a bit when she finds out the ammo is better shooting and cheaper. Course, I've never met a reloader who didn't end up spending more on ammo, but they shot a whole lot more. Seems some like to make empty cases just so they can fill them up again.
 

maggys drawers

New member
Harry...you might take the tack that a couple of pounds of gunpowder certainly isnt more dangerous than the 10-15 gallons of gasoline she sits on every day when she drives the car...or a gas fired water heater or furnace in the house. Most people fear because they don't understand....a little education might go a long way. If nothing else...point out how many members are on this forum and haven't blown ourselves up. Good luck.
 

rwilson452

New member
Demo for the Mrs.

Is it worth it to blow around $20.

Go down to the local place that sells smokeless powder. Ask for the slowest burning powder they have. Do you have a BBQ? double over some aluminium foil over the BBQ rack. you want it FLAT no ridges. spill a little powder on the foil. use a piece of wood to lightly tap the edge so the powder spreads out thinly. Invite her out for the demo. tell her this will look like a 4th of july sparkler. toss on a lit match. it will fizzle. If any of the powder didn't get burned keep it on the foil and dump it in her favorite flower bed. Hose it down. She will no doubt be a little alarmed. then inform her that once wet it is a gonzo high nitrate fertilizer. once wet it's harmless.
 

cloudcroft

New member
Harry,

I learned long ago that one aspect of the "feminine mystique" is to control her man (i.e., a power-stuggle is often going on in the relationship). But you know, a woman doesn't respect a man she CAN control.

Go figure.


As for pros and cons of reloading, I look at it differently than most people. And I see only "pros," no "cons."

The MAIN reason *I* do it is NOT for the reasons most other people do it, i.e., (1) to load more accurate ammo (factory ammo is real good nowadays so I don't see that as a good reason, except for the Benchrest shooters), or (2) even to be able to shoot more often (which I don't) for the same cost. I like being able to load my own because I am self-reliant, sort of being my own ammo-factory, if you will.

In the event of civil disorder -- caused by manmade or natural disasters -- if/when martial law is declared and/or all gun shops are looted (or closed by order of the mayor/police chief was the case in the Rodney King Riots in LA a while back because they didn't want "more guns/ammo on the streets" so decent citizens were left on their own with no cops to be seen anywhere)...it wouldn't effect people who reload...they can still produce ammo regardless.

But non-reloading people looking for ammo THEN -- after stores were closed/looted -- were too late to get any and thus had to depend on whatever ammo they already had in stock, if any.

Even if the stores WERE open, and they wanted to buy a gun -- as some of them found out -- there was a waiting period in place for buying said gun...but they needed it NOW due to the clear and present danger all about them. But most of them did not have a gun. The irony of that situation was that those same liberals voted FOR those kind of laws -- such as the waiting period -- and it all came back to bite them.

Most were anti-gun liberals who had no guns in the house and who NOW had no way to defend their own famlies -- let alone any other fellow citizen. While looters roamed about and fires burned in their neighborhoods, they had to go next door to ask/beg a conservative "gun nut" neighbor for a gun/ammo loan!

How pathetic. Something bad had to happen to wake them up...like the reality of human nature to prey on others.

Anyway, in that scenario, if you CAN reload your own, you ARE your own factory and it doesn't matter if the gun stores are closed. It doesn't matter if martial law is declared and you must stay at home. You can reload your empties as they become available should you need to shoot some up during such a time of crisis. If you've plenty or powder/primers/bullets, running out of ammo is much less likely. In this case, empties are not "once shot and that's it" as is true for most people who have to buy factory ammo and do NOT reload, reloaders can reload the same case many times over (especially pistol cases). And if you neck-size rifle cases (for use with the same bolt-action rifle in which they were fired), they also can be reloaded many times.

So while I DO save money loading my own, I MAINLY like the freedom and sense of secutiry reloading gives me in those kinds of "emergency" situations. And if I need to hoof-it (bug-out), I can carry something like a simple Classic Lee Loader, some pwoder/primers/bullets in my backpack and even be abe to reload out in the field.

As for costs, when I started out reloading back in 1974, I bought the more expensive stuff...RCBS brand mostly (but Lee dies and other assorted Lee stuff such as powder-measures), and a single-stage RCBS press and Uniflow powder-measure. A few years later I went on to a progressive RCBS Auto 4x4 press (what a quality machine that was -- actually all RCBS stuff is -- almost perfect EXCEPT that it had four dies stations and I really needed 5).

NOW, I have almost come back to my starting point in that I got rid of my progressives and am back with a slower press (and mostly Lee branded stuff) as I prefer to do "batch loading" for more precise control over the consistency of the ammo loaded: With a progressive press like the 4x4, I found myself HOPING each case had the same (or any) powder charge while at the same time I was concerned about a double-charge in a pistol case (really can't double-charge a rifle case). A progressive press requires close attention since so much is happening at once...it only takes ONE of those over-charges to ruin your day when it goes off in your face! When reloading hundreds of rounds at a session -- as progressives allow one to do -- you just can't be 100% SURE you didn't screw up somewhere or miss some step or wondering if just ONE case has a overcharge in it.

Slowing down the process with a single-stage press works better for me now and I don't worry about squib or overcharged loads anymore (or primers in backwards)...or spilled powder at the progressive's charging station or primer-feed problems. I don't need to produce 100s of rounds of ammo anymore, just enough to reload any empty cases I have from my last outing (or ammo spent while "holding the fort" during some crisis, were that ever to happen). But I could produce hundreds if I needed to.

I also like the concept of recycling things, in this case the empty brass. Same for my shotgun hulls.

And also, with Lee equipment (I suggest either their cast-iron Classic "O" press or the more recent cast-iron Classic turret-press rather than their aluminum presses), one is into reloading as cheap as it gets over any other brand.

So spend as little (Lee Reloader "C" press) or as much (Dillion Super 1050) as you want.

Reloading is not difficult and it does not need to cost a whole lot of money to get into it.

Good luck,

-- John D.
 

270Win

New member
I'm lucky in that my wife somewhat enjoys shooting, and after a demonstration (agreed with Art here) that powder burns and doesn't KABOOOOOOOOM, was completely fine with it. Plus, I don't smoke and that pretty much eliminated all possible threat for her.

Then she actually WATCHED me undertake the many tedious steps in crafting a precision cartridge, and was convinced that anything THIS boring HAD to be safe. I wasn't just tossing dynamite into a pot with some brass, lighting a fire beneath it, and shaking it wildly while laughing maniacally. Which, I suppose, was her ultimate suspicion all along.

The very final clincher was the fact that it's a money saver. She was surprised at the initial cost of press, power and primers and whatnot, but then saw just how much you make with so little, and how brass can be reused, etc.

So it hasn't been a problem since then. In fact, if she had her way, the reloading bench would be moved to the rec room so I could talk to her and be sociable while I'm engaged in this hobby; nevermind the fact that concentration is as necessary an ingrediant as powder or primers ;)
 
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