reloading .223 vs 7.62x39

[TennJed]

Currently I only reload for pistol calibers (on a Lee Classic Turret) Considering a AR15 or AK type rifle. Caliber wise does the .223 or 7.62x39 offer any advantages over each other? Things like price, avaliability of componets, brass life, ease of the reloading process.

Any input would be appriciated.

 

[DASHZNT]

I reload .223/5.56 NATO and love it! I woukd like to do my 7.62x39 but the brass is just too expensive. The price that it goes for, I can reload my .308 for less $$ than the brass costs, I dunno why but thats the case. I say reload the brass you shoot from that 7.62x39 and youll be better off. As far as .223 goes though, the brass is cheap and so is everything else. I reload the M855 62gr Steel Core which costs $500 retail for 1000 rounds and it only costs me $225 for 1000. Its totally worth it! Id say, collect good cheap brass and prep it up which takes a little time and when you have alot ready to reload, itll be just like doing handgun ammo and you can rip through a couple thousand rounds in a day... good luck!

DASHZNT

 

[DASHZNT]

Also... Get a reloading manual if you dont have one. Rifle reloading takes a bit more labor. There is some prep involved that is very important. Trimming, Deburring, Chamfering and Sawaging (For crimped primers, usually found in military surplus brass). Read up on this and make sure you have all the tools. Just likd the handgun ammo, once you get the hang of it, its a piece of cake.

DASHZNT

 

[45YearsShooting]

Reloading the .223 is much more mainstream. Thus, components will be easier to find, cheaper, and more choices. .223 brass can be had at scrap prices, or free.

 

[beex215]

762 reloading is quite pricey even if you did save your own brass. 556 reloading is fair bit cheaper. both are comparing to factory.

 

[Rangefinder]

Reloadable 7.62x39 brass is much more difficult to come by, and unless you're willing and experienced enough to venture off-book a bit, there is a lot less published versatility in the load/bullet data available. On the other hand, with a lot of careful working, there is a lot that can be done with it. Being a hand caster, I load all the way from 90gr pest-control pills all the way through 220gr., and a wide variety between. For the average loader, however, .223 is going to be a safe, fun cartridge with tons of available data and components.

 

[res45]

I would agree that if one was starting out .223 would be the way to go bulk brass,surplus or commercial powder and components are much cheaper.

That being side I've reloaded for the 7,62 x 39 for about 10 years now,brass is more expensive but readily available in multiple flavors and there are lots of good powder and bullets choices nowadays. I cast and load my own bullets for 90 to 160 grs. shoot surplus FMJ bullets I've pull myself for other calibers I Mexican Matched and loaded just about ever commercial J bullet for 123 to 150 gr. available.

For general purpose plinking and small game I shoot cast,I save my J bullet stockpile for larger game Deer/Hogs and keep a good stash of steel case ammo for a rainy day. I load for the X39 for accuracy purposes and to have the ability to provide my own ammo without having to depend on market forces or political winds. Shooting cast lead bullet,buying once fired brass or free range pickup and buying other components in bulk all same on the cost of reloading the X39 many of my various rds. actually cost less that steel case ammo but it takes a little work putting the loads together but I enjoy the process.

 

[chris in va]

I reload x39, but only for my bolt CZ. Got tired of chasing thrown brass out of my Saiga so I bought an AR in it's place.

 

[TennJed]

Thanks guys

 

[tank1949]

Tenn,


You might carefully consider twist rate in AR platforms. Most new stuff will be 1x9 twist or quicker. Some older rifles may have slower twist rates that will stabilize the old 55 grain bullets but will not for the 62 grain SS109/M855s. So, if you buy used, please beware. Also, rifles designated to safely shoot 5.56 nato rounds will also safel accept commercial .223 rounds. The other way may not be true. Years ago, the military went to hotter rounds and as a result had to increase bullet lead (jump) or the round developed too much chamber pressure. The trade off was a bit lose in accuracy. RRA has a Wylde chamber that they consider a match grade and it will safely and accurately shoot both, commercial and military ammo. I have several models:A1, A2 and flattops. Most military brass is heavier than commercial. Although, PMC is about the same weight as LC. ARs are fun, cheap to shoot, and as others have stated, parts and accessories are easily available for now. Until the UN and Obama get their way. Buy now!!!!! A grand is cheap compare at not having one at all when the sh-- hits the fan, and it is coming. Also, SS109 penatrators will punch through most body armor. I don't think AK rounds will. I am not trying to sound morbid, but anyone can also buy body armor, until Obama tries to stop that too. You also need at least 10 30 rnd magizines with good followers. It is hell to run out of ammo. Good luck

 

[TennJed]

Good info tank, thanks

 

[JimDandy]

Also, there are probably more automation tools available for .223/5.56 NATO. I know, and already have, the RCBS Lube Die #1, which I found out about watching a video of the Hornady LNL Ammo Plant (any progressive with a case feeder probably could have been substituted, however if you want to search Youtube and watch it yourself...) reloading .223 with a Mr Bullet bullet feeder. The whole thing was automated, all the guy did after the setup was pull the handle over and over. It was a two stage process... first run through the machine, case feed to Lube Die #1, to resize. Then off to the tumbler to clean the lube off- Second Run, (probably) primer, Charge, bullet, (probably) Crimp.

 

[okiefarmer]

All the comments about the x39 brass are spot on. I picked up a bunch of nickel a pop large primer brass years ago, and had been sitting on it shooting up my steelcase. I now sit on my steelcase, for rainy days as mentioned above, and shoot cast in the brass cases for plinking. I was trying to find a load that would lay all the brass in one general area, like can be done with many auto guns. Not so with the AK platform. What I did find out is the AK will digest almost anything, not picky like some autos, but still throws it clear to Arkansas. Now when I shoot brass at a range or in the pasture, I remove the original bolt and replace it with a bolt from which I removed the piston. Now it's a bolt action, but I can play with the sighting in of certain projos, and not worry about watching the brass as soon as I pull the trigger.

 

[tank1949]

Another problem with handloads

I iosted this on another forum, but it holds true for 223 or any reloads. Just another process if you plan on reloading rifle brass.

I'd love to get 20 reloads out of 308 brass but after inspecting the inside of the cases with paper clips, looking for case seperation about 1/2" from base, I have come to realze that about 8-10 is all I can get, if that much. The 308 is "Hot" and the heat will cut a circle inside the brass over time. This will lead to case seperation and jams and perhaps death if you are trying to protect youself or family. Inspecting brass by running a paper clip that has a small 90 degree bend up and down the inside of each brass may save you life or at least a big buck. I do this for all rifle brass that I know has been reloaded more than once. If you feel any indent, a circle has started and discard brass. Just some advice...

Steel cases rubbing inside a steel rifle chamber will eventually wear out the chamber.

 

[JimDandy]

Get the Brass Catcher from CTK Precision. Or make your own with a fishing net. I got one for my AR, and I love it.

 

[okiefarmer]

Quote from above---

"Steel cases rubbing inside a steel rifle chamber will eventually wear out the chamber. "



BS

Innerweb rumor that just won't stop. Sometime in your spare time go check out the lacquer on one of the steel cases just ejected from your favorite toy. What does the lacquer look like? Is it all stripped off and the case look beat up. Well, ok, it will be dented if fired in an AK toy, but that is the dent from hitting the receiver cover, and they have little fixes for that. But, there is nary a scratch on the case from ejection, thus if the lacquer is not scratched, I don't know what in the sam hill could be causing all the chamber damage to which you refer. I can see no damage in my chambers after 10s of thousands of rounds through them all.

 

[Rimfire5]

From a practical perspective, reloading 7.62x39 for an AK is almost a wasted effort.
First, I haven't been able to see any difference in accuracy between the cheap factory ammo and hand loads. That is the only rifle that I haven't been able to improve upon.
Second, it costs as much to reload ammo as it costs to buy the cheap factory ammo so there isn't any savings to cover your effort and no improvement in accuracy to make it worth it.

The first condition might be different if I had a CZ 527carbine and it improved accuracy with hand loads, but with my spray and pray AK, it just isn't worth it.

On the otherhand, my .223 CZ 527 shows marked improvement from hand loads and it costs about 50 cents less a round to load match grade ammo (high grade bullets, match primers, and Lapua brass) over what it costs to buy good factory match ammo. And to make it even better, the hand loads that are matched to the barrel harmonics out shoot the best factory ammo by a large margin.

I would vote yes on reloading .223 and no on reloading 7.62x39.

 

[Marco Califo]

223 is much more versatile

223 is much more versatile.
You can hunt deer down to rodents with it.
It is easy to load, brass is cheap and plentiful, bullets and powder are mainstream.
223 rifles can be an excellent target gun, long rang rifle, or a cheap blaster. With M855/SS109, you can even drill through concrete walls, including rebar. I know, I have done it!
7.62x39 is the Russian equivalent of 30 Cal carbine, brass is expensive, bullets are a non-standard diameter, it is not noted for accuracy, long-range, or versatility.
All of the above are reasons I own one bolt action and one semi auto 223, and pass on 7.62x39 every time they are on sale. I would, and will, purchase another 223.
But if you want an odd-ball gun for novelty or your local cold war re-enactments, get an SKS or AK.

 

[okiefarmer]

"Second, it costs as much to reload ammo as it costs to buy the cheap factory ammo so there isn't any savings to cover your effort and no improvement in accuracy to make it worth it."

I would argue with that. I am poking my X39 full with a 130 grain projo, identical to the milsurp in shape, for somewhere in the neighborhood of 6 pennies, depending on how far I can amortize the 7 cent case cost. Still using up a batch of AA 2200 I bought years ago for $50/8# promo.

If ya don't count my time, and no one does when doing something they enjoy, that's a pretty good savings over bought ammo. Same with 5.56.

I haven't seen 5.56 or X39 milsurp/reman anywhere lately for less than 30 cents a pop. Until my input costs go up exorbitantly, I think I'll keep on keepin' on.

 

[DASHZNT]

Whoever says its the same price is outa their mind!!!

I reload .223 M855 62gr Green Tip Steel Core Penetrator Rounds and they cost a whopping $0.16 per round. Thats $160 for 1000 which when you compare with $550 for 1000 of the same in commercial ammo its one big DUUUHHH!!!! And the best part is I worked up a load that is very accurate with my rifle. Thats the best part of reloading, you can make something that is accurate and hott that your gun likes and thats something you just cannot get with store bought ammo. Not to mention, less $$ per roundz means more trigger time which ultimatly results in mord proficiency with your rifle.

DASHZNT