Recoil comparison to J-frame please

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dyl

New member
Just out of curiosity: I'm interested to know about recoil of 2 guns/calibers compared to J-frame snubbies.

10mm out of a Glock compared to shooting 38 special out of an Airweight. Also, the Keltec pf-9 compared to an airweight snubby.

Any owners of both a snubby and either of these able to share some thoughts please? Equivalent recoil? lighter recoil? worse than the airweight? I'm used to shooting j-frame Airweight snubbies. I was tossing around the idea of getting and converting a Glock 30 to 10mm someday and this was just a thought. I've heard 10mm was a bear to shoot. I was also considering getting a pf-9 (if prices are low for the holidays) but again - heard it was horrible to shoot. But I have no frame of reference when I hear things like that. And at my last shooting session my good friend was talking about the difference in kick between 9mm and .40 in his converted Glock 23 - and I tried both but can't tell the difference between them. The recoil in those was present but seemed harmless - far from being able to bruise.

So part of me says after practicing with my airweight - how bad could they be?

I'd appreciate your comparisons folks.
 
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psyshack

Moderator
I'm not recoil sensitive at all.

My PF-9 is snappy, but not a issue at all. 10mm Glocks with full house loads shoot like a real .40 should and not like a short .40. .38's and +P's in a air weight are boring if you ask me.
 
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chris in va

New member
I attended a stage I defensive training course a while back. Woman shows up with an airweight J-frame, the shrouded kind that you can still thumb back the hammer as a last resort.

Her knuckle and thumb were bloody after 150 38's downrange. She was thumbing back the hammer every time.:rolleyes:

Looked like this, only silver.




I shot a cylinder through it and wasn't happy with the recoil at all, just with standard range ammo.
 
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ep2621

New member
If you can't really tell the difference in the 9mm and .40 Glocks then the 10mm won't be too bad for you. Pocket book yes (unless you reload) hands no.
I have the Glock20 and it's not as bad (to me) as the J-frame with .38 special +p ammo.

Disclaimer: I haven't shot any Buffalo Bores or similar ammo out of the G20 yet. Just WWB etc.
 
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MLeake

New member
I have a 442...

... and it is somewhat of a handful, but not as bad as some make it out to be. 30 rounds of Buffalo Bore standard pressure 158gr LSWCHP and 100 rounds of range 158gr were not a big deal for one session.

I don't have a Glock 10mm, but used to have a Glock .45. I also have a Fusion 10mm 1911.

The Glock .45 and Fusion 10mm have similar recoil; it's there, but it's not that big a push. The 10mm is snappier, but my Fusion is a 6" longslide, and tames it nicely.

The snubby does kick a big more. I think part of that is due to the smaller grip, as well as the lower weight.

But it's not that bad with 158gr in the 850fps range.
 
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dallascj

New member
I haven't shot a 10mm, but I ewnjoy shooting my snubbies and do not find them unpleasant or hard to control. The PF-9 I shot I thought was terrible. Hands down the most unpleasant 9mm I've ever shot. Snappy and jumpy, would be terrible for follow up shots. I think the PF-9 is only useful as a short range point and shoot panic gun along the lines of most .380's.
 
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Daryl

New member
I have a J-frame .38; an "airweight" that weighs around 15 ounces. The steel model will be heavier, with less recoil, and the titanium model is lighter, wtih more recoil.

.357 mag models in the lightweight models will be pretty rough, I'd imagine.

With +p .38's, the airweight Smith slaps the palm of your hand sorta smart-like, but I don't feel it much in my wrist at all. Just a quick "pop" to the palm of my hand.

A G20 I had a few years back was "different". The slap to my palm wasn't much, but I felt it more in other places. More of a hard, quick shove that I could feel in my wrists and elbows.

Sorta like back in grade school if the teacher were to smack your hand with a light, quick smack from a ruler, VS someone hitting your outstretched hand with a "hi-five".

Or anyway, that's the best I can explain it.

Good luck!

Daryl
 
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dyl

New member
thanks

Hey thanks folks,

Looks like mixed opinions again but I there are a couple things I can take away from this:

There wasn't a unanimous statement of "10mm or pf-9 was just too much".
And a few say it wasn't that bad at all.

We got 1 concern for follow-up shots in the pf-9. (and discomfort) - I wonder, was that even with a Hogue hand-all jr. or Limbsaver?

1 note that recoil in the j-frame numerically carries less force. - thanks for the resource!

1 note that recoil in 10mm feels like it carries more force so it pushes more of the upper limbs.

and 1 story of a persistent lady shooting single action. :D Ouch! Tough lady.

Just a tangent note, I believe one reason I've been able to tolerate the Airweight is because of a modified rubber Taurus grip I've put on mine that covers the backstrap yet does not add length to the grip (no pinky rest). I couldn't find any other grip of that design and it helps to prevent too much trigger finger due to the short length of pull. I'll show it off sometime when I figure out how to post pictures in case others are interested. All it took was to drill 2 spots for the pin in the S&W. Although now the grips say Taurus on it :eek:

I appreciate the input.
 
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Slopemeno

New member
I find lightweight J-frames in .38 Secial tend to have "sharp" recoil, but there's not a lot of volume of recoil there. Not a gun to learn on, or for extended range sessions, but mine shot right to point of aim. I felt like I'd owned it for twenty years after twenty minutes on the range. Great little guns.
 
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psyshack

Moderator
dyl

PF-9 can be shot very hard and fast! With good recovery.

Tri-Target.jpg


Folks that are shot sensitive need to get a knife or body guard. My wife can now shoot full house .357's with her 60 Pro with no pain. The first 10 rounds about killed her. She learned......:D
 
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Erik

New member
Using off the shelf offerings, I've found +Ps out of Airweights to be snappier than "standard" loads from G20s.
 
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Black_Sheep

New member
Recoil is such a subjective thing, the best thing to do is somehow try before you buy. Try out your friends guns or rent one at the range...
 
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dyl

New member
Hey thanks again guys.

Unfortunately, most of my friends aren't shooters and I'm still looking for a range that'll let me try.

Psyshack, Nice shooting! That wasn't off a rest or anything? I've always heard the pf-9 "wasn't accurate" and was ready to accept that or look to the Ruger SR-9c or something like that.
 
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Mosin44az

New member
I have a Smith 638 Airweight and had a PF-9. Kept the Airweight, sold the Kel-tec.

I actually thought the felt recoil from the PF-9 was slightly less than my Airweight, but the PF had pretty snappy muzzle flip which slows followup shots. I recall shooting them about the same. The PF-9 is accurate, with a better trigger than the P11. I dumped the PF with the idea of getting a PM9 someday soon--clearly superior, that one.
 
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engineer88

New member
I have two jframes and two pf9's. In my opinion, the jframe with +p ammo and no backstrap covering grips (I use the smallest hogue) hurts more than the pf9 with +p ammo. The locking breech helps with recoil but increases muzzle rise. With a two hand grip this is easily controlled. Also my pf9's and jframes are plenty accurate.

I am not very recoil sensitive I guess, but to put it in perspective, 150 rounds through my p3at beats my hand up worse than 150 through either of the two listed above in a single range session.
 
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Sevens

New member
Here's something that I'm absolutely, positively certain about:

Felt recoil is way too personal and way too different for each shooter to try and quantify in a discussion. I'm sure of it. Unless you are talking about the obvious (what's worse, Buckmark .22 or S&W .44 Mag) then you can get many opinions, most/all of them valid opinions, but none of them will paint a proper picture and they won't solve your dilemma.

There are so many factors at work... bore angle, grip angle, grip material, size of the grip, weight of the handgun, the loads you are firing, the size of your hand, the style of your hold... and probably a dozen other factors.

My EDC is a Glock 29. First thing -- Pearce +0 grip extensions transform this pistol in to a shooter. Seriously. They are a "must have" for the G29.

I also have a S&W 1006, that's the full size -- it's huge. It's heavy, large, all of that, and with a Hogue rubber grip. With the same ammo, it's LESS COMFORTABLE to shoot than my Glock 29. Same ammo. Same shooter. No BS.

My buddy has a Ruger LCR in .38 Special. Running +P 158gr plated Flat Point handloads, it's more uncomfortable to shoot than my Glock 29. I'd much rather put 100 rounds of 10mm through my G29 than to put 50 rounds of that +P through his LCR.

I just recently sold a beautiful S&W Model 60, .357 Mag 5-shot J-frame with the full underlug 3-inch barrel and the OEM factory rubber grip and with any .357 Magnum load, it was quite uncomfortable to shoot. I'd rather put 100 rounds of 10mm through my G29 than 25 rounds of any .357 Mag through the model 60.

I don't expect those exact results would be the same for the next shooter.

If my post leaves you with anything of value, take this much: Don't be afraid of the felt recoil of a Glock 29, especially with Pearce +0 grip extensions, especially if you have experience with snubby revolvers.
 
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MLeake

New member
+1 Sevens

Grip fit and material make a HUGE difference in perceived recoil. A gun that kicks hard, but that fits the hand properly, will hurt less than another gun that might kick less but has a grip that fits poorly.
 
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