RBCD Performance Plus Ammo

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Blackhawk

New member
9mm RBCD Performance Plus Ammo

Has anybody used RBCD ammo? I have a ballistic table for their various calibers, and some of the numbers are pretty provocative.

For example, the 9mm Luger 60 gr TFSP bullet has 2010 fps and 539 Ft Lbs at the muzzle from a 4" barrel. At about $1.70 each, they're too pricey for plinking, but it's an interesting round.

Their website is http://www.RBCD.net, but they don't have the ballistic table on it. I had to write to them to get it my mail. If anybody wants other caliber numbers, let me know. They range from .32 ACP to .45 Colt for handguns and .223 Rem to .50 BMG for rifles, but several of the intermediates are missing from their line.
 
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David Scott

New member
The RCBD web site was giving away free boxes of ammo if you were visitor #xxx,000. They apparently still are. I got the three free boxes, two in 9mm and one in .32 ACP. I've test fired them only. They cycle fine in my Ruger P95 but don't feed well in my wife's Kel-Tec P32.

I don't know how effective they'd be in a real life confrontation. They rely on total energy dump from the rapid fragmentation. Yes, they have lots of fpe, but the design won't penetrate much. That probably makes them safer in a crowded situation, but they may not reach vital organs and nerve centers. Until I see some better effectiveness data I'll stay with my 124 gr. Gold Dots.

They included the ballistics table with my shipment, but thanks for the offer.
 
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Blackhawk

New member
Thanks for the report. I'm now curious about any perceived difference in recoil and flash you may recall. They must use some really hot powder to accelerate those light bullets so fast in short barrels. Did you notice much if any differences with them?
 
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454

New member
Blackhawk I would like to see a few numbers from other calibers if it wouldn't be too much trouble:D

Thanks 454
 
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Blackhawk

New member
Velocities and energy at the muzzle. Expansion and depth of penetration tests were shot at 30 feet through a 4 double layers of ballistic nylon into calibrated 10% ordnance gelatin at 34 degrees (Celsius, I presume)

32 ACP:
37 gr. TFSP, 1815 fps, 271 Ft Lbs, Expansion 4" dia x 8" depth

357 Mag:
60 gr. TFSP, 1975 fps, 520 Ft Lbs, Expansion 8" dia x 11" depth
 
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Blackhawk

New member
These are all the handgun calibers listed on the ballistic tables:

Velocities and energy at the muzzle. Expansion and depth of penetration tests were shot at 30 feet through a 4 double layers of ballistic nylon into calibrated 10% ordnance gelatin at 34 degrees (Celsius, I presume)

32 ACP:
37 gr. TFSP, 1815 fps, 271 Ft Lbs, Expansion 4" dia x 8" depth

380 ACP:
45 gr. TFSP, 1500 fps, 283 Ft Lbs, Expansion 5" dia x 8" depth

9mm:
60 gr. TFSP, 2010 fps, 539 Ft Lbs, Expansion 7" dia x 10" depth

357 Sig:
60 gr. TFSP, 2410 fps, 774 Ft Lbs, Expansion 8" dia x 11" depth

38 Spl:
60 gr. TFSP, 1705 fps, 385 Ft Lbs, Expansion 7" dia x 10" depth

357 Mag:
60 gr. TFSP, 1975 fps, 520 Ft Lbs, Expansion 8" dia x 11" depth

40 S&W:
77 gr. TFSP, 2100 fps, 754 Ft Lbs, Expansion 9" dia x 11" depth

10mm:
77 gr. TFSP, 2420 fps, 1015 Ft Lbs, Expansion 12" dia x 12" depth

44 Spl:
110 gr. TFSP, 2030 fps, 1007 Ft Lbs, Expansion 10" dia x 11" depth

44 Mag:
110 gr. TFSP, 2430 fps, 1445 Ft Lbs, Expansion 12" dia x 15" depth

45 ACP:
90 gr. TFSP, 2036 fps, 828 Ft Lbs, Expansion 11" dia x 11" depth

45 ACP:
115 gr. TFSP, 1650 fps, 700 Ft Lbs, Expansion 11" dia x 12" depth

45 Colt:
120 gr. TFSP, 1950 fps, 1013 Ft Lbs, Expansion 10" dia x 11" depth
 
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David Scott

New member
Blackhawk said:
Thanks for the report. I'm now curious about any perceived difference in recoil and flash you may recall. They must use some really hot powder to accelerate those light bullets so fast in short barrels. Did you notice much if any differences with them?
Click to expand...

In the P95, I didn't notice too much difference, but it's a 27 ounce (unloaded weight) pistol. In the Kel-Tec P32 the RCBD definitely had a bit sharper snap, but not unbearable.
 
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CaesarI

New member
The only test I've seen has velocity numbers WAY lower than advertised (though granted with a 3.1" barrel) rather than 2010 fps try 1776 fps. Didn't penetrate 10" either more like 8" and the whole diameter was only 2" instead of 7". Perhaps they perform better out of a 4" barrel. Here's the site: http://www.goldenloki.com/ammo/gel/9mm/gel9.htm

His penetration values tend to vary from most standard tests done by FBI, etc. though they're still a good indicator. But I'd consider the velocity values accurate.

It's also the only independent test of RBCD ammo. Ballistic Gel when calibrated has been proven to correlate very closely to human tissue, the clay RBCD likes to use, has not. But it does make for pretty pictures. And probably fun shooting.

Long and short is, I looked at it too, and yeah it looks impressive, and if it worked the way they say it does it would be. But it doesn't. So until the next super bullet comes along, I'll still prefer the standard variety.

-Morgan
 
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Blackhawk

New member
The velocity differences are dependent on barrel length. 3.1' versus 4" as RBCD used will definitely cost some velocity, but I'm still surprised that it was that fast from a 3.1" barrel.

RBCD did use calibrated ordnance gel, and the expansion diameter is definitely a function of velocity with a frangible bullet.

In other words, I don't see any conflict with what RBCD claims and goldenloki reported.

The real issue I struggle with on this type of ammo is that if you hit somebody in the torso with one of these, you're going to kill them regardless of them being a BG, a bystander, or a LEO. It would be hard to argue in court that you were just trying to stop an attacker instead of trying to kill him.

A JHP is going to slow down a lot going through a person if it does exit, and it likely won't exit. That makes it safer for bystanders than a FMJ.

It's also arguably a "safer" bullet than a FMJ because the wound is easier to treat instead of having to treat two wounds.

Since your objective SHOULD be to stop an attacker rather than kill him, that should be paramount in your ammo choice. A frangible will deliver all of its energy into the target, but it's lethality is so high that you couldn't successfully claim you had another intent in court. The JHP also delivers all of its energy into the target, but the wound is far more treatable than with a frangible, and it's likely to stop the attacker. A FMJ only delivers part of its energy into the target so it doesn't work as well in stopping the attacker, and the wound may not be as treatable as from a JHP since there are likely to be two of them.

These bullets may be fun to shoot watermelons with, but I don't think I'd ever carry them or even leave any of them in a weapon.
 
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krept

New member
LOL (sorry) 11" of expansion and 11" penetration from the ACP sounds pretty amazing. I realize that it's fragmenting but still...

If it behaved on unarmored critters like it does on the jello monsters, surely it would be a devestating wound.
 
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Blackhawk

New member
Shawn,

RBCD has changed their website! They've added the ballistic data, and now I can't find the jellos either.

Here's a link the the 9mm jello picture that GoldenLoki has: http://www.goldenloki.com/ammo/gel/9mm/xrbcd2.jpg

When RBCD sent me the ballistic tables, they included a color brochure that has jellos for a .40 S&W and a .45 ACP 115 gr. at 1650 fps. RBCD's site is at http://www.rbcd.net/ and their contact information is fairly easy to find on it.

All the jello pictures are side views.
 
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Jeff OTMG

New member
I have been using RBCD for over two years now. Just bought two more boxes at the Mesquite gun show a couple of weeks ago. The slugs are now in their 5th generation. Roscoe has a neat piece of equipment to mold the slugs, he just dials in the mixture and can get 2"-24" of penetration. Check out these links for more info:
http://www.thefiringline.com/forums...?threadid=33010
http://www.thefiringline.com/forums...p?threadid=4714
http://www.thefiringline.com/forums...?threadid=48872
http://www.thefiringline.com/forums...?threadid=55389
 
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Blackhawk

New member
Jeff,

Ah, somebody with real first-hand experience! Thanks for the links, but they don't work.

What's the typical price for them? What caliber?

Do they penetrate interior walls? Do they fragment after hitting a window? Seems like they shouldn't, but I can't tell.

If it's a choice of a wild shot through a wall or a BG, I'd rather avoid the wall penetration.
 
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