questions for NYPD SCU ...

[Rob Pincus]

Okay, I am not sure this is even appropriate, so this thread may disappear... but:

I will be attending an awards banquet next week in NYC for the infamous Street Crimes Unit. There are supposed to be about 4-500 of NYC's finest in attendance, primarily from the upper echelons and from the SCU...

As law abiding gun owners I was wondering what questions some of you might have for members of this unit. Specifically as pertains to there aggressive disarming of citizens with little regard for personal privacy and tradional "probable Cause" constraints.

This is in no way a promise that I will ask anything.. so don't expect a line by line response at the end of next week.. I just wanted to get a feel for what the average non-LEO gunowner would ask.

(I'll tell you right now, don't bother posting broad or Policy related questions.. remember, these are cops on the beat, not Janet Reno.. I promise I won't ask them any question with the word "constitution" in it )



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-Essayons

 

[Destructo6]

Holy cow! You pretty much limited us to very little.

Maybe ask something along the line of whether they, in general, feel threatened by non-criminal gun ownership.

 

[Byron Quick]

Destructo6,

Owning a handgun in NYC, as I understand the current law, makes one a criminal by definition.

Rob,

I would ask if they believe law enforcement officers should be held to the same standards as private citizens for their actions. Specifically regarding royally screwing up with the application of lethal force. If the answer is yes, LEO's should be held to a different standard-why?

 

[Art Eatman]

Yeah, Destructo6's question, coupled with questions as to just how bad a problem is "bad-guy" gun possession for the street-cop.

And, what weaponry is most commonly found? Do they attempt any trace of sequence of possession from original purchaser to badguy? And, how frequently have they encountered "assault weapons"?

 

[Hal]

Art: The BATF has a "Crime Gun" trace program. The results can be viewed at the ATF web page.

 

[DonL]

Rob, I hope this doesn't come across as being too cynical, but I would want to know how would they feel, what would they do, how would they react if a tactical unit performed a no-knock dynamic entry raid on their homes with a warrant based on incorrect, unverified, or specuous information.

The reason this comes up is that there was a program on the Discover or Learning Channel about SWAT teams (an interview with Darryl Gates has him saying that the original acronym that he wanted to use for SWAT was Special Weapons Attack (?!) Team, which was shot down by some with cooler heads). One of the team leaders and training officers seemed like he loved his job a little *too* much when it came to raids, almost a screw-the-private-citizen rogue sort of enthusiasm that I'm pretty sure isn't prevalent in the majority of response team personnel around the country. Please don't get me wrong, I'm very, very pro-LEO, but this guy seemed a bit, well, over the top.

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Don LeHue

The pen is mightier than the sword...outside of arms reach. Modify radius accordingly for rifle.

 

[Grayfox]

Ask them how much shooting training they have had. Any beyond what a regular patrol officer gets? Any special tactical training? How often do they practice shooting and tactics? And then ask why a "special, elite unit" can't seem to shoot straight.

 

[Destructo6]

Art Eatman: I believe that, with the proper permit(s), a New Yorker may have a pistol within city limits. The kind of permit(s) other cities require for CCW. I have no idea about long guns.

Being such a touchy subject at present time, I wouldn't want to bring up anything that would suggest that these guys were a little trigger happy.

Grayfox: I don't think these guys have a problem with shooting straight (41/4) but they do seem to have a slight judgement problem.

[This message has been edited by Destructo6 (edited April 17, 1999).]

 

[K80Geoff]

Destructo...To answer your question, in NYC it is almost impossible for the average law abiding citizen to obtain a pistol permit. Only the politically connected and businessmen who can prove that they must make deposits of over $7000.00 in cash are able to obtain permits, and their claims are checked, they must provide years worth of bank deposit slips, etc. Celebrities, who have money, good lawyers and friends are given permits. At least one radio celebrity, who is a known drug abuser and wife beater, has a permit. Ron Kuby, the avowed communist attorney has a permit. I could go on. By the way you need a permit to own any type of gun in NYC, even a shotgun and the permits require a background check that normally takes six months to do. Friends who live in the city and shoot sporting clays store their guns at clubs outside the city limits. the process of obtaining a permit is a demeaning and laborious one and several who have done so feel they were treated like "PERPS".

NYC is not like other cities, it is a stinkhole of liberalism and leftist Bovine scatology.

 

[Destructo6]

K80Geoff, I agree. NYC, LA, and SF are all cities that could use an enema. Hmmn, I wonder where one might get a few of those 100 missing Russian suitcase nukes… That was a little joke, there.

[This message has been edited by Destructo6 (edited April 17, 1999).]

 

[Bushwhacker]

Destructo6, You forgot Atlanta, New Orleans
Rob, Better wear that vest!

 

[Rob Pincus]

The question about (which guns) was already on my list.. I'm interested in that too..

the Tracing of guns would definitely be up to the ATF, but I am already curious about what they do with the guns....


DonL,

Their job does not include dynamic entry or high risk warrant executtion, as I understand it... They are more like a "high risk patrol" unit.

Gray,

The Training for the unit is definitely on my short list, too.

 

[Jeff Thomas]

Rob, perhaps it would be interesting to ask them if they expect to be able to carry a handgun in the City when they retire? If so, why should they be treated differently from any other trained, honest civilian?

Probably a bit touchy, no?

 

[Rob Pincus]

The retirement issue is already on the table with them, through the LEAA's legislative agenda, as is the more immediately important issue of reciprocity.

This is the first time I am going gunless is a looong time. I am flying through LaGuardia and it is not even close to being worth the hassle of thinking about taking a gun through, apparently you really get the third degree if you try to declare a handgun coming or going....

I'll update everyone Thursday or Friday.