Pistols for +P ammo
- Thread starter Jehzsa
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Javelin Man
New member
+p+
Hi-Points are able to withstand +P and +P+.
Take their website advertisment for what its worth.
Hi-Points are able to withstand +P and +P+.
Take their website advertisment for what its worth.
ALL 9mms can shoot +Ps.
The high pressure loads WILL accelerate wear and tear on ANY gun, compared to standard pressure loads.
If you can afford to buy that many +P loads, you can easily afford to buy five or six new pistols.
I'll bet your wrists and elbows(or your wallet) give out before the gun wears out.
A friend of mine has a VERY highpressure round chambered in a 1911. It is the 9X23. This is the equivalent of ++++P++++ 9mm loads. I don't think he can afford to buy enough ammo to break the gun in properly.
The high pressure loads WILL accelerate wear and tear on ANY gun, compared to standard pressure loads.
If you can afford to buy that many +P loads, you can easily afford to buy five or six new pistols.
I'll bet your wrists and elbows(or your wallet) give out before the gun wears out.
A friend of mine has a VERY highpressure round chambered in a 1911. It is the 9X23. This is the equivalent of ++++P++++ 9mm loads. I don't think he can afford to buy enough ammo to break the gun in properly.
Ultima-Ratio
Moderator
The 9mm Demolition Derby-
Sorry folks the SIG tho a wonderfully accurate and reliable gun (WITH woosy American pressure ammo) will fall apart under continued use of subgun loads!
Been there and done that already, tho before the frame cracks the roll pin holding the breechface shears again and again.
i ran a gun rental and bough almost a million rounds of spanish surplus 9mm subgun ammo from Paragon back when.
Guns that didn't break, CZ-75s, Glocks, H&K VP and the P-7s. Belgium made BHPs are too soft for daily use aslo with the SMG ammo as two shot their slide/frames loose rapidly.
Sorry folks the SIG tho a wonderfully accurate and reliable gun (WITH woosy American pressure ammo) will fall apart under continued use of subgun loads!
Been there and done that already, tho before the frame cracks the roll pin holding the breechface shears again and again.
i ran a gun rental and bough almost a million rounds of spanish surplus 9mm subgun ammo from Paragon back when.
Guns that didn't break, CZ-75s, Glocks, H&K VP and the P-7s. Belgium made BHPs are too soft for daily use aslo with the SMG ammo as two shot their slide/frames loose rapidly.
What do subgun loads have to do with +P ammo? Subgun 9mm is at the high end of +P+ ranges, not +P.
Depends what you want. I'd just look for mentions of guns that don't have a sterling reputation for longevity, like Beretta 92s or HiPowers. Some obvious heavy duty ones are Glock 17, USP full size (built for .40), all forged steel S&W 5906, 1911s, Steyr GB, MAB PA15 and the Rugers. I'd shy away from the CZs until they announce an end to the broken slide stop pins. If you want a Beretta, the PX4 and the Cougars were built as .40 platforms as well, so they should be better - but I'd tend to avoid aluminum framed guns with the exception of the big old Rugers.
Depends what you want. I'd just look for mentions of guns that don't have a sterling reputation for longevity, like Beretta 92s or HiPowers. Some obvious heavy duty ones are Glock 17, USP full size (built for .40), all forged steel S&W 5906, 1911s, Steyr GB, MAB PA15 and the Rugers. I'd shy away from the CZs until they announce an end to the broken slide stop pins. If you want a Beretta, the PX4 and the Cougars were built as .40 platforms as well, so they should be better - but I'd tend to avoid aluminum framed guns with the exception of the big old Rugers.
The cheapest commercial hipressure ammo I have ever found was some Fed 9PBLE at $400 for a thousand rounds.
If you have a really soft gun that would wear out at a low-low count of just 5,000 rounds, do the numbers. At this extremely low conservative estimate, it would cost you $2,000 worth of ammo, IF you could ever find +P+ ammo this cheap again.
A better estimate would be 10,000 rounds at a retail estimate of $5,000 to $7,000. Some folks claim their gun has a useful life of 50,000 rounds of regular ammo. How many +Ps would that equate to.
If you can afford this much hot ammo, who cares if you have to buy a new pistol or two.
If you are the average shooter or cop and shoot several hundred rounds of +P+ ammo per year, your gun will not ever wear out from hot ammo.
If you have a really soft gun that would wear out at a low-low count of just 5,000 rounds, do the numbers. At this extremely low conservative estimate, it would cost you $2,000 worth of ammo, IF you could ever find +P+ ammo this cheap again.
A better estimate would be 10,000 rounds at a retail estimate of $5,000 to $7,000. Some folks claim their gun has a useful life of 50,000 rounds of regular ammo. How many +Ps would that equate to.
If you can afford this much hot ammo, who cares if you have to buy a new pistol or two.
If you are the average shooter or cop and shoot several hundred rounds of +P+ ammo per year, your gun will not ever wear out from hot ammo.
Some people can afford alot of ammo (or load it that way - it isn't anymore expensive to make +P ammo than regular).
BUT, even if you have money to burn, it doesn't mean you want to treat all your possesions as disposable. Having a gun you like is nicer when you know you'll still have it a long time from now.
I guess I just don't understand this fascination with disposable gear.
BUT, even if you have money to burn, it doesn't mean you want to treat all your possesions as disposable. Having a gun you like is nicer when you know you'll still have it a long time from now.
I guess I just don't understand this fascination with disposable gear.
Thank you all for your replies. FWIW, chosen ammo will be Geco BAT, British Aerospace and Hirtenberger. No subgun ammo. All +P. And not that expensive but for the BAT which btw, at $39.95/50, it is not exactly plinking stuff. The BA and the H are just slightly more expensive than most regular commercial loads.
Hello Handy. Yes, has to be a forged steel frame. Which takes out of the running HK, Glock, etc. mainly because I don't like polymers. The S&W seems like a fine choice. But already have one in a similar platform(1006). Steyr GB is way too big, 1911s don't care too much about them now. Bernardelli seems to be it. Not bigger than my S&W 1006 and definitely slimmer. Major problem is finding x-power rec springs here in CONUS, which might be solved by substituting from another make. Which one, I don't really know right now.
And true, I don't want nor need a disposable gun, or even one that would disintegrate after, say, 6,000 rds. Which for the remainder of my lifetime should be plenty enough.
Hello Handy. Yes, has to be a forged steel frame. Which takes out of the running HK, Glock, etc. mainly because I don't like polymers. The S&W seems like a fine choice. But already have one in a similar platform(1006). Steyr GB is way too big, 1911s don't care too much about them now. Bernardelli seems to be it. Not bigger than my S&W 1006 and definitely slimmer. Major problem is finding x-power rec springs here in CONUS, which might be solved by substituting from another make. Which one, I don't really know right now.
And true, I don't want nor need a disposable gun, or even one that would disintegrate after, say, 6,000 rds. Which for the remainder of my lifetime should be plenty enough.
Don't write the GB off too fast, they aren't any bigger than a 92, and have very good triggers (the last version, anyway). Self regulating gas systems are ideal for heavy loads.
You're looking at Bernadellis? Like the P-018? Sure, it's steel, but I wouldn't immediately presume it is all that tough.
You're looking at Bernadellis? Like the P-018? Sure, it's steel, but I wouldn't immediately presume it is all that tough.
I'm now carrying the 1006 IWB and it's certainly a handful and a half. The Steyr, unfortunately will seem to only aggravate the situation. However, the Lakeland, Fl gunshow is on Jan. 21-22 and will make certain then if my recollection is accurate enough.
Exactly, I'm looking at the P. One, aka P-018. Compact model. Made with hot European ammo in mind. However then again, I would need to find an x-power rec spring for it. Just in case. With it, it should hold up to the intended use.
Btw, I see the Bernardellis as a beautiful Italian woman. Looks slim, delicate but can give one heck of a punch!
Exactly, I'm looking at the P. One, aka P-018. Compact model. Made with hot European ammo in mind. However then again, I would need to find an x-power rec spring for it. Just in case. With it, it should hold up to the intended use.
Btw, I see the Bernardellis as a beautiful Italian woman. Looks slim, delicate but can give one heck of a punch!
Probably because you saw the black model. However, http://www.bernardelli.com/main_pistols.htm
I doubt I could find it here, but if the only one I find(until now) is the black, I'll have mine matte chromed, get the walnut grips(probably from Italy, cheaper usually than in the US) and leave black parts as in the photo. A regular Gina Lollobrigida! http://www.lollobrigida.de/
I doubt I could find it here, but if the only one I find(until now) is the black, I'll have mine matte chromed, get the walnut grips(probably from Italy, cheaper usually than in the US) and leave black parts as in the photo. A regular Gina Lollobrigida! http://www.lollobrigida.de/
USP a heavy duty? I doubt it has any edge over the 92FS (esp Brig. /Elite)...
In the 92FS manual it says that constant use of +P+ ammo is not recommended, because it will reduce the service life (which is the case with all guns). So basically +P is OK and so is occasional +P+
Really? The USP full size has a small version of the recoil reduction system from the Mk 23 in a gun built around .40. Some people have rechambered those .40s for 10mm. You bet it is up to it.
The Beretta has the opposite credentials: A gun that gets beat up in .40 and was unworkable in .357 Sig.
The Beretta has the opposite credentials: A gun that gets beat up in .40 and was unworkable in .357 Sig.
FWIW, I once owned an H&K USP 9F and the manual stated that it was OK to fire +P and even +P+ ammo through it. IIRC, good enough for 40,000 rds. or some astronomical figure like that. Which, to me, is enough for about 3 or 4 lifetimes.
I don't like polymer, but have to admit that the darn thing was built like a Ruger. Perhaps better.
Btw, purchased the Bernardelli P.One. $410.00 sh. included. Mint. One 15 rd. mag. Black, Handy.
I don't like polymer, but have to admit that the darn thing was built like a Ruger. Perhaps better.
Btw, purchased the Bernardelli P.One. $410.00 sh. included. Mint. One 15 rd. mag. Black, Handy.