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Pedersen Device Cut Springfield
- Thread starter cornbush
- Start date
I don't have a hard number, but Mark 1 Springfields in reasonable shape command a premium - say $1000 on up. If it has the original magazine cutoff, which had a special cut for the Pederson device, it's worth even more.
Why not just tell me where it is, so I can go buy.... err, by and check it out for you??? Hmmmm? No charge for the service, of course!
Why not just tell me where it is, so I can go buy.... err, by and check it out for you??? Hmmmm? No charge for the service, of course!
The 03 Mark I's were initially made at Remington Arms starting in 1916 where Mr Pedersen worked on the development of his device. The amount of Remingtons that actually were released to the feds is an unknown. Springfield production according to their records says that in 1920, 91,750 Mark I's were made. In 1921, 10,025 Mark I's were made. If you find a Remington Mark I, it's a rare rifle as there appears to be none accepted by the military. There were no Mark I's issued to troops as WWI was over by the time the concept of the Pedersen device was reality. All Mark I's were put in storage. Sometime in the 1930's, all Pedersen devices were destroyed as it was considered having no value. All Mark I's were refitted with the correct standard service sear and cutoff after the destruction of the devices. It's unclear just how many, if any, were ever issued to troops.
I've had a few Mk I's over the years. Most were rifles issues to ROTC units and also used as training rifles. I've had the honor of owning one Remington but it was unfortunately stolen years ago. The 03 has many variations and the Mark I is just one of them. I've got 03's with Marlin 5 groove barrels, 6 groove Remington barrels, National Match rifles including the rare model NB, and a few rare 03 Carbines that were only issued on the Philippine campaign in WWII. The American Rifleman did an article on these carbines many years ago. The history of this fine rifle is worth the research if you have the time but you need to know if you don't look at the arsenal records, you might be getting the wrong info.
I've had a few Mk I's over the years. Most were rifles issues to ROTC units and also used as training rifles. I've had the honor of owning one Remington but it was unfortunately stolen years ago. The 03 has many variations and the Mark I is just one of them. I've got 03's with Marlin 5 groove barrels, 6 groove Remington barrels, National Match rifles including the rare model NB, and a few rare 03 Carbines that were only issued on the Philippine campaign in WWII. The American Rifleman did an article on these carbines many years ago. The history of this fine rifle is worth the research if you have the time but you need to know if you don't look at the arsenal records, you might be getting the wrong info.
I have seen two complete Pederson devices:
West Point Museum
Springfield Armory Museum
I have heard there are a few floating around in private hands.
And of course the French pistol cartridge of the 30's was based on the Pederson round. I have owned a mag pouch, and saw a fellow with the metal 'can' to go on the web belt.
The story goes that after The War to End All Wars, they were collected, put in a pile, and burned with Gasoline.
West Point Museum
Springfield Armory Museum
I have heard there are a few floating around in private hands.
And of course the French pistol cartridge of the 30's was based on the Pederson round. I have owned a mag pouch, and saw a fellow with the metal 'can' to go on the web belt.
The story goes that after The War to End All Wars, they were collected, put in a pile, and burned with Gasoline.
but Mark 1 Springfields in reasonable shape command a premium - say $1000 on up
If the rifle retains all the original Mark 1 parts: (cutoff, spindle, trigger and sear) as well as the correct stock, barrel, bolt and other parts, then it will likely be worth $1000+. Recently on the CMP fourm a "correct" 1903 Mark 1 rifle sold for $1150.
After the pedersen device was declared obsolete, most of the Mark 1 rifles were converted back to plain old 1903 rifles & put back into circulation. So unless it's a "correct" rifle, it's nothing more than an arsenal rebuilt 1903.
Price & pay accordingly
FrankenMauser
New member
The rifle that sparked Cornbush's inquiry had a serial number of 1,152,xxx. I'm not hiding the number... I just don't remember anything more precise than one million one hundred fifty two thousand.
From what I can tell, that makes it a 1919 rifle.
It wasn't a bubba job, but had been: dropped in a sporter stock, drilled and tapped for a peep sight, drilled and tapped for a scope, and had a dovetail cut in the barrel for a rear sight (now containing a dovetail blank). It is currently wearing an old "Can-Ex" (?) brand 4x scope, in see-through mounts.
All collectors' value is surely gone, but it's an interesting rifle in its current condition. As Cornbush and I are both looking for another project rifle, it caught our eye. We were mostly just interested in the rarity of the Pedersen device ejection port, to decide if the 'oddity' of it was worth the asking price of the rifle (for our own use).
None of us had ever seen one with the Pedersen device modification before (anywhere out west - Utah/Idaho/Wyoming/Arizona/Oregon/Washing).
From what I can tell, that makes it a 1919 rifle.
It wasn't a bubba job, but had been: dropped in a sporter stock, drilled and tapped for a peep sight, drilled and tapped for a scope, and had a dovetail cut in the barrel for a rear sight (now containing a dovetail blank). It is currently wearing an old "Can-Ex" (?) brand 4x scope, in see-through mounts.
All collectors' value is surely gone, but it's an interesting rifle in its current condition. As Cornbush and I are both looking for another project rifle, it caught our eye. We were mostly just interested in the rarity of the Pedersen device ejection port, to decide if the 'oddity' of it was worth the asking price of the rifle (for our own use).
None of us had ever seen one with the Pedersen device modification before (anywhere out west - Utah/Idaho/Wyoming/Arizona/Oregon/Washing).
Last edited:
Jim Watson
New member
My Mk I was bought many years ago at the same price as any other surplus Springfield in the store (A whopping $36.00, the NRA/DCM had run out of $25 rifles by then.) It has the original 1919 barrel and is in a type S stock that might be original. But the dedicated cutoff and sear are long gone, like most others.
I once read that there were 65,000 Pedersen Devices made. Maybe that number is incorrect, it is hard to see why there would have been more rifles than devices.
I once read that there were 65,000 Pedersen Devices made. Maybe that number is incorrect, it is hard to see why there would have been more rifles than devices.
No, that number is wrong. I'll assume you have one too many numbers and the serial number is 1,520,XXX. That would make it a mid 1920 receiver with a 1919 barrel. Obviously rebuilt some where in it's lifetime and not necessarily in a arsenal. As parts were also sold to the public, a lot of the old beaters were rebarreled by gunsmiths sometimes using the surplus parts. Back in the 1970's when the 03's started becoming a collector item, a few of the "gunsmiths" took up making their own Mark I's by slotting the receivers. You need to be careful if buying a Mark I making sure that it is in the correct serial number lot.The rifle that sparked Cornbush's inquiry had a serial number of 11,52x,xxx.
That number is correct. The original order was for 500,000 of the devices. But the device came to be after the war so the order was cut to pretty much what was already made- 65,000.I once read that there were 65,000 Pedersen Devices made.
There are a few of the non-functioning devices around. I'm aware of 5 of them. One is at Remington, one at Springfield, one at West Point, and two in private collections. If I remember correctly, all are from the Remington days of development and not 100% the actual device that was made for the troops. Kinda close but no cigar but it beats having nothing to remember this blurp in history.
Another neat accessory that I've had the opportunity to buy but didn't, a floor plate with flaming ball and US markings that held a 20 round clip. I could have bought one back in the 70's but I thought the guy wanted too much for it- $225.00 at the time which was a fair amount of change back then. I wish now I had bought it. It would bring some dandy profit today.
FrankenMauser
New member
No, that number is wrong. I'll assume you have one too many numbers and the serial number is 1,520,XXX. That would make it a mid 1920 receiver with a 1919 barrel.
Apparently, memorizing serial numbers while being a member of the walking dead is a bad idea. I was incredibly tired yesterday (no, not drunk), and can't believe I actually typed that number out, as well.
The number was 1152-something, with 7 digits. So, I corrected my other post to read 1,152,xxx. (I have a very good memory for numbers, and believe the full serial number is 1,152,536. But I'm not 100% positive.)
That 20 round magazine was specifically developed for the Army Air Corps. The pilots and observers wanted something more than their .45 pistols and revolvers to respond to 'the Boche'. I saw some advertised last year, but I don't recall the price. They may have been repos.
What I would love to find for my 1911 collection was the wire brass cage to capture the brass from the pistols. Seems the fired brass was punching holes in the fabric wings, old boy!
What I would love to find for my 1911 collection was the wire brass cage to capture the brass from the pistols. Seems the fired brass was punching holes in the fabric wings, old boy!