Oh, the whiny liberal pukes are going to scream about this...

From Reuters-Yahoo:

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The CIA officer who led the first American unit into Afghanistan after the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks said on Wednesday that his orders included an unusual assignment: bring back Osama bin Laden's head on ice.

Gary Schroen and his six-member CIA team arrived in Afghanistan's Panjshir Valley two weeks after bin Laden's al Qaeda network orchestrated the attacks on Washington and New York that killed 3,000 people, prompting the Bush administration's war on terrorism.

A 32-year CIA veteran with long experience in South Asia and the Middle East, Schroen's prime task was to build up Northern Alliance forces so they could join U.S. troops in the overthrow of the Taliban.

But in the days that followed the worst terror attack on U.S. soil, Schroen said his boss at the CIA also told him and his deputy in no uncertain terms to kill the al Qaeda leadership.

"What he said (was), 'I would like to see the head of bin Laden delivered back to me in a heavy cardboard box filled with dry ice, and I will take that down and show the president. And the rest of the lieutenants, you can put their heads on pikes'," Schroen told Reuters in an interview.

He was quoting Cofer Black, a prominent U.S. intelligence figure who was then the director of the CIA's counterterrorist center.

"I don't think he meant that in detail ... I think he meant to impress upon me and my deputy that this was very serious business and he wanted to get our adrenaline charged," Schroen added.

Black was not immediately available for comment.

Schroen recounts his post-Sept. 11 Afghan experience in the book, "First In: An Insider's Account of How the CIA Spearheaded the War on Terror in Afghanistan," which will be published next week.

Schroen, 63, who is officially retired but continues to work for the CIA as a contractor, said the conversation was a turning point.

"Other than in paramilitary operations, I have never in 32 years heard of an order to kill anyone. And in fact up to that day, my orders and the orders the CIA was operating under were primarily to try and capture bin Laden alive," he said.

Bin Laden's trail grew cold after the Bush administration withdrew its most highly trained special operations and intelligence units from Afghanistan in preparation for the March 2003 invasion of Iraq, Schroen said.

But he was encouraged by news on Wednesday that Pakistani security forces had arrested senior al Qaeda operative Abu Faraj Farj al Liby, reportedly in Pakistan's North West Frontier Province, a rugged tribal region where he believes bin Laden is hiding.

"Bin Laden is almost a Robin Hood among certain elements of the Islamic world," said Schroen, who believes bin Laden's popularity is so great that Pakistan may not want to risk a potentially devastating political backlash by capturing him.

"Going after al Liby is much easier than going after bin Laden. He's by name a Libyan and he has no standing within the community," he said.

As the war in Afghanistan unfolded, Schroen never got close enough to strike at bin Laden himself. But he worked on a plan to use Northern Alliance fighters to kill bin Laden's top lieutenant, Ayman al Zawahri.

"He was supposedly hiding out in the eastern part of Kabul. We paid for assets the Northern Alliance said they were running within the Taliban to go after him," he said.

The effort failed, however. "It was far-fetched," Schroen said. "It was like to do something long-range while blind-folded."
 

UT_Air_Assault

New member
"Bin Laden's trail grew cold after the Bush administration withdrew its most highly trained special operations and intelligence units from Afghanistan in preparation for the March 2003 invasion of Iraq, Schroen said."

Gee imagine that..................... Starting another war before one is finished? Stretching our troops too thin? Going in without enough troops even though the "professionals" (i.e. Generals) say we don't have enough troops?

But hell of a good idea for Bin Laden's head. Would make a great paper weight. :D
 

Wildalaska

Moderator
Got to be true, its not like hes trying to sell a book or anyhting

WildadoseofviolenceadoseofscandalheyletsmakeamovieAlaska
 

tjhands

New member
Any American just short of being steeped in and dripping with treason should not have a problem with our higher-ups making a goal of Osama's head on ice. I would HOPE that that would span party lines and political mindsets.
 

kjm

New member
I think the Iraq thing was somewhat dictated by a window of opportunity. The spring Shamals (really big dirt storms) create havoc with the equipment and the Summer heat creates havoc with the people.

You won't find much disagreement with me that maybe we could have waited on Iraq another year, but I am VERY GLAD about those people's suffering being lessened, and their freedoms being delivered.

As for OBL, I doubt we would have caught him anyway even if the CIA was left in the AO. I don't care anyway. He is not important. His life has gone from relative comfort to being constantly on the run, looking over his shoulder wondering when (not if) he will be caught and if he'll end up at the end of a rope, a knife, a bullet, a needle, or grenade. I kinda feel sorry for him in a GS Patton kind of way.
 

Waitone

New member
The tub-thumping to capture OBL is generated by our guardians in the media. Hollywierd creates conflict where the closing scenes of the movie feature a fight to the death by the head good guy vs the head bad guy. Reality is a might different. OBL is much more valuable as a fugitive in the Islamic world running from safe house to safe house. Humiliation is better than martyrdom for our position. I think it is just great he has not been found. It is of greater strategic value to kill or capture his seconds, attack his sources of money, disrupt his plans, destroy his training camps, and just generally lay waste to his infrastructure. Wars are not fought with two protagonists having a duel, contrary to hollywierds images.
 
"No, we won't."

Hum... let's see...

Buying an AR-15, looking for a shooting range in Eastern PA, questions about a Makarov, hanging out on a gunboard...

You're not exactly the kind of whiny liberal puke who would be upset by something like this.

I'm not even sure I'd classify you as a whiny liberal puke.
 

Trapp

New member
UT,
weren't you one of the "Terrorists are People Too!" people on the prisoner thread? How could you condone Osammy's head on ice? Me? I would love to see that.
 

paratrooper

New member
I daydream about standing on a platform at Ground Zero . Filling the area in front of me are all the FDNY and NYPD souls that went from average to exceptional in the matter of hours on 9/11 . I would pull OBL head out of that box and throw it out into the middle of the crowd while Hank Williams JR. hollers into the microphone "Are you ready for some FOOT-BALL ????"
 

UT_Air_Assault

New member
*sigh*

Trapp,
I know that Bill O'Reily or G. Gordon Liddy might not of covered this, so here we go:
There is a difference between a combatant on a battlefield and a helpless prisoner in a cell (who may or may not even be guilty of anything). Some allah-akbar terrorist slinging lead around with an AK-47 can be legitimately eliminated. Yet, once he surrenders you have both a legal & moral duty to safeguard him regardless of the fact that he may of just shot your buddy.
As for hacking OBL's off and putting it on ice, that probably wouldn't be a ROE or Geneva violation since this would be done by SF forces whose ops are in a Geneva legal grey area from my understanding.
All this is much different than a conventional military unit in a garrison setting operating a jail, using torture to try and "soften" up prisoners. Or is that the new way to "win hearts & minds"? Things may of changed since I got my last POW brief, but I don't recall a leash being on the minium equipment list.
 

buzz_knox

New member
As for OBL, I doubt we would have caught him anyway even if the CIA was left in the AO.

The CIA never left Afghanistan. They are still there. The fact is that Bin Laden's trail went cold (officially at least) after Tora Bora.
 

Spotted Owl

New member
Any American just short of being steeped in and dripping with treason should not have a problem with our higher-ups making a goal of Osama's head on ice. I would HOPE that that would span party lines and political mindsets.
Agreed. If I were Bush and bin Laden was killed, I'd have his head cast inside one of those blocks of clear acrylic and use it a a paper weight on my desk in the Oval Office. And I'd make damn sure it was plainly visible whenever I made a speach from the Oval Office.
 

Trapp

New member
I guess I am just not PC......who is Bill O and that other person anyway? I just don't listen to politicians.........I agree about the Legal obligation..Morally, well morals are up to the individual Not society.
 

dZ

New member
Gary Schroen was on NPR this week:
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=4626666

First In
Written by Gary Schroen
Hardcover , 400 pages
May 2005
While America held its breath in the days immediately following 9/11, a small but determined group of CIA agents covertly began to change history. This is the riveting first-person account of the treacherous top-secret mission inside Afghanistan to set the stage for the defeat of the Taliban and launch the war...

http://www.randomhouse.com/rhpg/authors/results.pperl?authorid=60388
 

IronGeek

New member
Slandering Liberals

It's funny, but contrary to conservative mantra, I've never met an American liberal who was in favor of Osama Bin Laden or Saddam Hussein. They may have been against invading those countries in order to prevent "collateral" damage, but none of them ever spoke up for either of these two evil men. Politicking is just so odious to me.
 

UT_Air_Assault

New member
Good point Iron.
But remember to be a Neo-Con, you have to abandon logic, independent thought and only pay attention to Bill O'Reily, G. Gordon Liddy and any other obnoxious idiot on Fox.


Q: How many Bush Administration officials does it take to screw in a light bulb?

A: None. There is nothing wrong with the light bulb; its conditions are improving every day. Any reports of its lack of incandescence are a delusional spin from the liberal media. That light bulb has served honorably, and anything you say undermines the lighting effort. Why do you hate freedom?
 

70-101

Moderator
Q: How many Bush Administration officials does it take to screw in a light bulb?

A: None. There is nothing wrong with the light bulb; its conditions are improving every day. Any reports of its lack of incandescence are a delusional spin from the liberal media. That light bulb has served honorably, and anything you say undermines the lighting effort. Why do you hate freedom?

B. Except: If a light bulb burned out in a United States governmemt facility in Iraq were it would take two senior Halliburton executives and a senior General Electric field engineer who are on a two hour conference call from Washington D.C to instruct an Iraqi soldier how to screw in the light bulb at a total consulting cost to the United States Government of $47,223.13
 
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