NRA/Why is it?

[jefnvk]

Why is it that Democrats seem to think that the NRA is simply a pro-Republican organization out to upset Democrats at any cost? Why is it hard for them to understand that the NRA endorses based on the candidates stance on guns and nothing else? Why is it that they think that Democrats who support gun rights won't get nominated?

Why can't they just understand that the ratings are based on gun rights, and if Democrats would change their stance, they'd get nominated as much as the Republicans?

 

[MeekAndMild]

Given the fact that DNC leadership has been antigun for many years it is really strange just how many Democrats have retained A and B ratings with the NRA. I've seen a lot Democrat recumbents (excuse me, incumbents) with NRA endorsements despite the fact their challengers are pro-gunners.

 

[jefnvk]

But why can't Democrats understand that?

 

[Gypsy]

....ahem, I am a Democrat who understands this.


I am one of those oddball Democrats who is a strong supporter of Second Amendment rights, and I'm also a supporter of environmental/wildlife preservation issues, even though I recognize that a lot of those issues butt heads/money with each other.

It's not an easy position to be in, honestly, and I wish my conscience would allow me to ignore one or the other, but I guess I'm not wired that way.

Voting, for me, involves a whole lot of research before I ever step foot in the voting booth...

 

[hivel37]

Gypsy, though I'm not a Dem, I appreciate your stance on the matter of Second Amendment rights and conservation. These are not at odds at all, in my opinion. Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation for instance.

Now, the PETA folks are beyond reason and have no credibility.
If the Dems can bring out worthy candidates, I will consider voting for'em.

 

[tlm225]

For the same reason that they twist the intent of the NRA rather than truthfully confronting the issues. It better serves the purpose of the party leadership to paint the NRA and it's members as the enemy of their programs and goals.

 

[jefnvk]

I am one of those oddball Democrats who is a strong supporter of Second Amendment rights, and I'm also a supporter of environmental/wildlife preservation issues, even though I recognize that a lot of those issues butt heads/money with each other.

I don't even think that Democrats/Gun-Control goes hand-in-hand. Sure, extreme Democrat politicians cry for all the gun control that they can, but most of the Democrats I know (being in a rural setting) are no different than Republicans on gun control issues. I know lots of Union guys that are Democrats because wage/labor law issues are their number one priority, not gun rights, but they support guns as much as anyone here.

As for environmental issues, I am sure that Ducks Unlimited and Trout Unlimited and the National Wild Turkey Federation, Whitetail Unlimited, Rocky Mountain Elk Federation (I think those are all the right names, hopefully) do a whole lot more for the environment than PETA, or Greenpeace, or the Sierra Club. And those groups sure aren't anti-gun/anti-hunting.

 

[UT_Air_Assault]

I'm not a democrat or a republican. I'm a liberal, who just happens to enjoy guns, especially Evil Black Rifles. I couldn't stand Kerry on any level :barf: , and can't stand the thought of the perpetual SNL skit going on at the White House to go on for another 3 years The comedy of errors from the White House would be funny if people wheren't getting killed in Iraq.
I declined to renew my NRA membership this last time around, for a couple of reasons. First they seem to be blindly following the Bush administration and are never willing to criticize him. In their "First Freedom" magazine they couldn't wait to jump all over people for taking away our rights, unless of course it was Bush & Co. with the Patriot Act.
Secondly why is the NRA even talking about this? If I remember correctly the NRA is a single-issue organization. I recall them rallying against some politician yammering about gun control, by describing him as an extreme liberal who believes in late-term abortion, drug-legalization, and other "extreme liberal" causes. Well, those are all things I support. I know that most NRA members will disagree with me on these issues and that's fine. You have your opinions and I have mine. But I don't want the NRA to be wadding in on these issues. I'm an Experimental Aircraft Association member. Do I expect them to wade into the gun control debate? No. The NRA needs to stick to one issue and one issue only.
Thirdly, they invited a sleezebag like Tom Delay to their convention. :barf: Why would you want to be associated with someone like that?

 

[jhendon]

"I didn't leave the Democratic party, the Democratic party left me." Ronald Reagan

"Certainly one of the chief guarantees of freedom under any government, no matter how popular and respected, is the right of the citizen to keep and bear arms. This is not to say that firearms should not be very carefully used and that definite rules of precaution should not be taught and enforced. But the right of the citizen to bear arms is just one more safeguard against a tyranny which now appears remote in America, but which historically has proved to be always possible."

Hubert Humprhey
Taken from "A Liberal Democrat's Lament," by Robert Cottrol, American Enterprise Institute. Statement made in 1960.

"By calling attention to 'a well regulated militia,' the 'security' of the nation, and the right of each citizen 'to keep and bear arms,' our founding fathers recognized the essentially civilian nature of our economy. Although it is extremely unlikely that the fears of governmental tyranny which gave rise to the Second Amendment will ever be a major danger to our nation, the Amendment still remains an important declaration of our basic civilian-military relationships, in which every citizen must be ready to participate in the defense of his country. For that reason I believe the Second Amendment will always be important."

Sen. John F. Kennedy
Know Your Lawmakers, Guns, April 1960, p. 4 (1960)

As a former Democrat I think it's important to realize that Leftists of all degrees - and the leadership of the Democrat Party itself - worship at the alter of The State. The Leftist answer to any social issue is "The State" - a new Program, a new Tax, a new Bureaucracy.

At the core of Leftist political philosophy is collectivism, as opposed to individualism. A collectivist always puts "the greater good" of the collective ahead of any individual right. The American Constitution, the Bill of Rights and particularly the Second amendment were not produced by collectivists and although American collectivists will sometimes give lip-service to respecting the individual rights guaranteed by America's Constitution, their actions betray their words as they consistently undermine the philosophy of individualism and the Constitution's guarantees of the rights of individuals.

 

[Fred Hansen]

Why is it that Democrats seem to think that the NRA is simply a pro-Republican organization out to upset Democrats at any cost?

It depends on which Democrats we talk about. Some Democrats are simply unaware of how radical their party has become. Others are aware, but so far they either can't, or won't make any attempt to change that fact.

The majority of folks who describe themselves as Democrats have adopted an agenda that has, as its logical conclusion, a total dependency upon government for everyone, everywhere, for everything, everytime.

The general ethos of the NRA membership - a spirit of self-defense, self-reliance, self-determination - and the general ethos of "progressives" or "liberals" - a belief in government dependency, helplessness, counting on government for guidance and employment (for the few who want to work) - are just about as antithetical to one another as can be. Therefore the modern Democrat party can only see the NRA as the enemy.

Certainly there are a few pockets here and there throughout the country where Democrat niche candidates can still be pro "huntin' gun", but if they want to get anywhere in the big Democrat universe they are going to need to put down the "huntin' gun" and take up the AIDS, abortion, euthanasia, bag-o-dope banner.

In short one can have freedom and liberty, or one can have government dependence. Freedom and liberty come with a demand that one buck up, and fend for oneself. Gummint dependence comes with the promise that what one allows the .gov to do for one, the .gov will do to one, like it or not.

Choose.

 

[Real Gun]

Given the fact that DNC leadership has been antigun for many years it is really strange just how many Democrats have retained A and B ratings with the NRA. I've seen a lot Democrat recumbents (excuse me, incumbents) with NRA endorsements despite the fact their challengers are pro-gunners.

If referring to the Senate, they vote by caucus decision, rarely appearing in disarray. If NRA believes it is best to keep a caucus together, they will support number of seats rather than people who don't wind up voting as an individual anyway. What's important is for the majority caucus to be pro-gun in total, and that will be how all of them vote with few exceptions. That lacks personal integrity but is really the way it seems to work.

Be clear about whether you are referring to the House or the Senate, because there aren't any pro-gun, Democrat senators.

 

[USP45usp]

I think that Gypsy really isn't a democrat but the same as myself, a moderate.

I can't vote for a democrate based entirely on the gun issue (and the abortion issue, lets not go there). I can't vote for the "lesser of two evils" if that "evil" wishes to take my guns or make it harder to get guns. That is hitting on a fundamental Right that I cannot overlook.

As for the NRA, I gave them up years ago. They are "portrayed" as being for gun owners but they are not, they are hand in hand with the anti's and have been for awhile. They say they are for "gun rights" but they are in it for the money, as are the anti's. Get as many poor slobs to give as you can and then "compromise" on this or that. The NRA started out well, but money got to it as it does to everything and everyone else.

Wayne

 

[K80Geoff]

Here in PA the NRA endorsed at least two Democratic Congresscritters in the last election. Both won BTW. A lot of Democrats used to support the 2nd Amendment, I suspect many still do.

 

[jefnvk]

As for the NRA, I gave them up years ago. They are "portrayed" as being for gun owners but they are not, they are hand in hand with the anti's and have been for awhile.

Well, I haven't quite heard anyone think that they are in bed with the anti's before.

Here in PA the NRA endorsed at least two Democratic Congresscritters in the last election. Both won BTW. A lot of Democrats used to support the 2nd Amendment, I suspect many still do.

That is what I mean. I do suspect this, in fact MI has some pro-gun D's. Some would make it seem though that they would never get nominated over an anti-gun R.

BTW, I came up with this question after getting off DU, if anyone was wondering.

 

[Trip20]

The comedy of errors from the White House would be funny if people wheren't getting killed in Iraq.

People were getting killed in Iraq before the White House sent a single soldier. These people weren't soldiers they were citizens.

What is funny to me is how we (I'm guilty as well) armchair quarterback the "presidency" (regardless of what party is in office) when we are not privy to the sort of information which the White House is. Walking in the presidential shoes, looking at “intelligence” – who knows what any of us would do if in the position to do, well, anything at all.

If 9/11 had never occurred I would support any effort to eradicate governments in any country, which kill/torture or otherwise allow their citizens to be treated this way.

I feel every civilized nation should be involved in ridding the world of these atrocities.

The NRA fights for my second amendment rights. My choice to support their efforts is not affected by their stance on abortion, drug legalization, or other "extreme liberal" causes. Nor does it have to do with the fact that they may support a president who is sending our troops to war.

I want my right to keep and bear arms protected. They're one tool I can use to help in this endeavor.

 

[Jack Malloy]

First of all, you have to understand the Democratic party in Washington is nothing but a pack of marxists, period.
Big government, redistribution of wealth, all power in the hands of the state, etc. That don;t sound like Liberals, it sounds like Commies to me.

Commies have always been big on a disarmed civillian populace.
So to the Reds in Washington, the NRA is a huge, huge enemy and that is not really going to change.

I personally don't understand the many "conservative" Democrats who stick with the party of "gun control, gay rights and abortion" when it runs counter to everything they otherwise beleive in, but they stick to it. WV is a good example. Most "Democrats" here are so conservative they make me look like Jane Fonda.
I remember the old School Democrats who DID NOT TRUST big goverment. They have been replaced in Washington with the Hillary-Big Gub'ment types.
Don't expect the Democrats in Washington to change either. They have their Marxist -Big Gub'ment agenda and they are not going to change it to appease you old school Dems. They are waiting for you to die off.
Thats why they spend more money on convicts in prison than the elderly, by the way. The sooner you are dead and buried the better for them.
If you are liberal and like your guns, become a Libertarian or Independant. If you are conservative and like your guns, become a Republican. But don't stick your head in the sand and con yourself into beleiving that Ted Kennedy, John Kerry and Hillary are ever going to allow Your Right to Keep and Bear Arms to exist as long as they have any sayso in the Democratic Party in Washington.
If you love your guns and you love your freedoms and you work and pay taxes, what are you doing in the Democratic party anyway?
If you sit back and draw a check for a living paid for by taxes on working suckers, you know who your friends are.
The only things they have left to keep them going are straight party ticket voters and people on welfare who are basically being paid to vote straight party ticket.