No CC, but do you pack, anyway?

[Rovert]

Due to the sensitive nature of this question, I understand there might not be many responses, or even votes, but I'm curious, anyway. If you chose to vote, but not comment, I'm sure we all understand.

A recent sidebar conversation I've been having with a fellow TFL'er living in CA got me to thinking about the issue of 'illegally' carrying a gun, in states that are not gun friendly.

I live in New Jersey, one of the most gun-unfriendly states in the country, and view a law that places me in jeopardy, and unable to defend myself, as morally ambiguous at best.

I'd like to hear from those of you who live in gun-unfriendly states, and/or who DON'T have CCWs. If you can legally carry in your state, please do not vote.

Do you carry anyway, despite the enormous legal risks that you take, and probable jail sentence you would have, if you were caught? Are you not concerned about what would happen, if you were in a situation where even if shots weren't fired, that someone would report an altercation to the police, and they'd be on your doorstep in a heartbeat, to haul you away?

Just curious to see how many of us carry, despite the fact that it's 'illegal' to do so.

 

[Ewok_Guy]

lol

 

[Rovert]

As a followup to this thought, I thought I'd share a quick anecdote.

In the State of NJ, as it is with most other states, the law stipulates applicants be approved or denied for their FID card within 30 days. I've been waiting 8 weeks, all in, by now. In the meantime, a man was attacked, and beaten with a baseball bat, then stabbed, only 5 miles from my home.

Nice to see the police are protecting my fellow citizens from a 'crazed' gun owner like me, by making the streets safe for thugs.

 

[gunny6]

It was once said, " Better To Be Tried By 12, Than Carried By 6"...

 

[Rovert]

Gunney, your statement applies to America. Not NJ. Don't confuse this state with life anywhere else in the universe.

We live in a virtual police state here, because the state constitution is formulated in such a way that the Governor of NJ has more power than the President of the United States.

Here, any gun incident lands you in handcuffs, and you are presumed GUILTY until you prove yourself innocent. Kind of like dealing with the IRS... although that's another issue. In this backward state, carrying a gun without a CCW permit, which doesn't exist, since the politicitians are 'protecting' the citizenry, equates to a FELONY. Period. Even loaded magazines, whether they're in your gun or not, is punishable with the same penalty. Want more? BB guns are considered 'assault weapons'. Still not convinced? The penalty for carrying a loaded gun, even if you have no record, and don't use it, but get caught anyway, is more severe than the legal penalty for rape, assault, or burgulary.

Yes, you may be tried by 12, but the 'jury of your peers' will no doubt be comprised of Liberal Democrats, who have been spoon fed a steady diet of mind-numbing anti gun rhetoric. So, at the end of the day, you will be likely wind up being assigned a roommate named Bubba.

I get very concerned about the direction this country is going in, but that, again, is another subject for discussion.

 

[blades67]

I used to carry without a permit before Arizona passed the CCW law.

 

[Brasso]

There are states that I wouldn't live in for all the money in the world. NJ is one of them.

 

[Rovert]

Brasso, the state is ok. It's the idiot National Socialists running it that worry me. BTW, if we happened to be speaking German, the term 'National Socialists' could be properly acronymed as NAZI.

 

[RAY WOODROW 3RD]

Come on now............

O.K. now Rovert, am I going to have to frisk you when you show up at the shoot on Sunday? Just keep your hands in the air when we first meet and everything will be O.K.

This State does suck with its gun laws. We have to keep trying to change them from the inside.

 

[Rovert]

Well, unless you have a badge, or an engagement ring, I wouldn't suggest you start sticking your hands in my pants.

 

[KP95DAO]

I'm like Blades67, I carried before it was legal here in OK. For 20 years. I now have my "permit".

 

[Bowser]

Twice,

once before 9/11 - a 22 revolver.

once after 9/11 - the next day in fact, a .40 S&W.

Also had a loaded rifle in the trunk after the Bay Area bridges were "under threat".

My philosophy is simple. If I need a gun to go somewhere, I don't go there. If I HAVE to go there anyway, then I'll bring a gun.

Drive carefully - I've gotten only one ticket in 8 years - don't get pulled over, you have no worries.

Bowser (in Ca).

 

[Redlg155]

Even though I do live in a CCW state, I haven't always. There have been times that I have armed myself without a permit. I don't think there are many of us who haven't "strapped" one on in an emergency or tense situation, permit or no permit.

I will however never subject myself to living somewhere that restricts me from owning a weapon or not allowing me to carry a weapon. I got a rude awakening when I was stationed in Germany when the Post Commander, or more like Kasern Commander decided that soldiers could no longer be trusted with weapons in their homes. An E-6 had some sort of accident invoving a private owned weapon so the commander decided to order all weapons either shipped home or stored in the company arms room for E-5 and below...I know ...it was an E6 that had the accident, welcome to the military mind!

I had to store all of my weapons in the arms room and obtain permission to check them out for recreational shooting. I have never felt so angered in my life knowing that I had to resort to secondary weapons as a primary method of protecting my family.

I refuse to go through that again.

Good Shooting
RED

 

[Archer1440]

Just a side note- Let's not give up on living in places like California (my home state) and NJ (which has some great areas)- let's keep up the fight. It really shocks me to see all the posts that say "move out". Stand and fight !

 

[KSFreeman]

During L skul in Chicago, three entire years of living the life of a "felon" for exercising my right to defend myself. I brought up four guns, a carbine, a shotgun, and two pistols.

Closest I came to getting caught, was when I was moving into a new apartment in the Loop. I put both of my long weapons in my guitar case. I dropped the case as a CPD car rolled by. The case did not pop open as one would think.

I love Chicago. The women, the shopping, the theaters, the dining, etc. I hate the scum that runs it. For those that don't know, recently a woman was shot in the swanky Kingsbury neighborhood (by the East Bank Club where Oprah runs). It made the lead story of all networks. You see, crime came to the people who thought they could insulate themselves from the reality that they created.

I despise the fact that when I cross the Indiana/Illinois line I instantly become a felon. However, I understand that there is always a price to pay for freedom. Dealing with the Cook County State's Attorney is that price.

"Live free or live in Illinois!"

 

[ut83]

This is not really UT83 ok? ok. I have taken the ccw course and sent in the paperwork to the state. Right now I am using my "learners permit" to carry when I feel its the thing to do.
I did carry on and off before this..situational, of course.
There is a learners permit for ccw isnt there? They didnt cover
that in my class...hmmmmmm

 

[Rovert]

Archer, forgive me if my response sounds combative, I don't mean to, but just how is it you suggest we 'fight'? By carrying illegally, and getting thrown into jail? Do you have any idea what it's like to live in a police state like NJ or CA? What is it that one man can do?

I began writing a lengthy commentary on the fearsome direction our complacency has been leading us, but it got a bit too long. Let me see if I can summarize just a few things, just to give you an idea of how the 'other half' lives.

We have a Governor who's more powerful than the President, because of the way the state constitution reads. That's what enables them to continually thumb their noses at the Bill Of Rights and Constitution, and make up their own rules, like charging a $50 processing fee, despite the fact that constitutional rights cannot be taxed. That's why I've been waiting 9 weeks for my FID card, in a day and age where NICS checks take 15 minutes.

We have a Commissioner of State Police who is hand-picked by the Governor, and isn't about to jeopardize his $200,000+ per year salary, in a state that perfected the concept of Racial Profiling. Wonder why permits are taking 3 to 6 months (or longer) in this state? Wonder why I don't keep any NRA stickers on my car?

We have a Legislature who, by agreement, won't hear any bill that isn't assured of being passed, since they don't want to waste their time (on freedom) and gum up the works. They're much too busy figuring out how to get more tax dollars out of us, and how to keep the toll plazas up on the highways.

We have a media whose agenda is not about fair and balanced reporting, but to sensationalize stories in a mission to garner more advertising revenue. Bad news sells (gun accidents and shootouts). Good news doesn't (woman fended off rapist with a .32). That just feeds the public fear, ignorance, uncertainty and resistance to the 2nd amendment.

We have a population who believes that the state exists to grant rights, forgetting the names of Locke, Rousseau, Henry and others. They forgot that our country was founded on the premise that Man exists in a natural state of freedom, and all rights were ours - NOT the State's. These people also believe that if someone's right to something that they don't want to partake in is threatened, then it doesn't affect them, so they don't get involved.

So, those of you who live in AMERICA, and NOT in NJ or CA, please consider this an open cry for help. If you truly believe in Freedom and the 2nd amendment, and want to HELP those of us who can't do so ourselves, because we're essentially behind political bars, please feel free to do something about it. It's hard to fight, when you've already been handcuffed and gagged.

Remember, gun restrictions are like cancer and taxes. They just keep getting bigger, and worse. Yours may be next.

 

[Bowser]

Rovert,

no offense, but would you have fought against the British in the War of Independence? It was against the law after all.

To everyone: No freedom without sacrifice. It never ceases to amaze me how many people whinge and whine, but always have a convenient excuse to fall back on.

Either stand up, or stay on your knees.


Bowser.

 

[Rovert]

Bowser, if I thought that being locked up would get some sort of value by way of media attention to our 'cause', then it might be worthwhile. I have been considering some strategies along the lines you suggest, though.

Not to put too fine a point on it, but what state do you live in? Are they gun-friendly in your home town?

 

[Zundfolge]

I live in Kansas, where there is no CCW but carrying concealed is just a misdemeanor. I must admit if I lived in Chicago or NJ or one of the other CCW=Felony states I would probably not carry as often (I carry almost daily) but I'd still carry when going out to the ATM after dark and other times when I felt particularly vulnerable.

Kansas is run by 2 Democrat parties, the Democrats and the Republicans (who are mostly RINOs...with the exception of Sam Brownback and Todd Tiahrt, who are in the US Senate and Congress) This is the state of wonderful Republicans like Nancy Kassebaum and Bob Dole (who is no friend of the 2A) we have a wonderful RINO governor named Graves who is about as big a tax and spender as Ted Kennedy and has vetoed CCW twice.