Newbie AR Help Please

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GunFool

New member
Hey folks! Please bear with me...I am by no means a rookie when it comes to most firearms...BUT the AR stlye rifles are like alien technology to me! Here goes...

Just bought a new AR style rifle...a DPMS Classic 16 (post-ban)...and I have to say that I'm a little overwhelmed. My first impression is that this must be the most complicated long-gun ever devised! My background has mostly been with handguns and bolt-action rifles. The only rifle I own that even comes close to the complexity of the AR is my old Ruger 10/22, and there really is no comparison. The manual of arms that came with it is a joke, so most of what I know comes from manuals I've scrounged up online. Ok, I've figured out the major parts, buttons, etc. I can load a magazine in the rifle and release it.

Do I have to lock the bolt back (open) when I put in a magazine, then click in the 'bolt catch' to slam it shut and chamber a round? Or can I put the magazine in and then work the bolt to cock the gun?

Cleaning seems like you almost need a gunsmith to pull everything apart, clean it, oil it, and put it all back together (hopefully in the right places)!

On the other hand, I love the sighting/zeroing system! Seems to be quite a bit more flexible than the usual iron sights found on most rifles.

Also, what are the best hi-cap 20 or 30 round magazines for my new rifle and where is the best place to get them online?

Any help would be much appreciated!
 
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ATTICUS

New member
"Do I have to lock the bolt back (open) when I put in a magazine, then click in the 'bolt catch' to slam it shut and chamber a round? Or can I put the magazine in and then work the bolt to cock the gun?"

No. That works best, but you can also "slingshot" the bolt.


"Also, what are the best hi-cap 20 or 30 round magazines for my new rifle and where is the best place to get them online?"

Try www.AR15.com - go to the equipment exchange section. There are many other sources as well, just do a search on google. Buy only USGI...and maybe Israeli Orlite's. Colt, Parsons, Universal, Simmonds,and a few others made contract mags to USGI specs.

Cleaning will become easier the more often you do it. A detailed cleaning is not needed as often as you would think, and even that takes about 10-15 minutes once you get it down.
 
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Noban

New member
There's a little gadget made by Sinclair that holds the upper and lower open and steady for cleaning. It inserts into the rear takedown pin holes. Great little device that spares you the task of disassembling the upper and lower for each cleaning. Runs about $15. Or, you can look at the picture and make one out of wood like I did for about $1.

You can insert a magazine with the bolt closed, but on some ARs it's easier with it open. You can chamber a round by either pressing the bolt carrier release, or by pulling back on the charging handle and releasing.
 
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Rob96

New member
In November I also purchased a DPMS Classic Sixteen. So far it has proven to be a very good rifle. It did not care for Winchesters Q3131 load though. Have heard of some reliability issues with that and would like to try the Winchester Q3131A which is produced by IMI. As far as 30 round mags, right now I have two new Orlites that I got from CDNN for $18 a piece, work great. If you buy Orlites there is a circle molded on the mag that has inside it a number over another number like a fraction. Make sure it is 0/22 or above. These are the newer mags that will be able to be fully seated. There is a rib on the mag body that prevents over insertion. On the mags 0/1 to 0/21 the ridge is higher, mag can be inserted in Israeli produced AR's but not in American, or something to that effect.
 
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hksigwalther

New member
Ah, it only takes a couple times of disassembling/re-assembling the AR to get the hang of it. After taking out the trigger assembly and dropping in a Jewell on my first AR, I couldn't believe how simple the AR really is. Simpler, IMO, than the 10/22. Only minor hangup is the Cotter pin through the bolt/carrier and that dang front handguard retainer. Hvae never taken/put the barrel off/on of an AR though.
 
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ATTICUS

New member
Here's a few items that I found indespenible for cleaning an AR15:

Long Q tips- preferably the ones on long wooden sticks.

Pipe cleaners to reach those hard to reach areas (key, FP hole, and buttstock).

A golf tee for removing pins and that cotter key (firing pin retainer)
The tip of a round (dummy round of course ha ha) will also work.

A stripper clip (I use an SKS clip) is useful in removing carbon from inside of the bolt carrier.

A chamber brush designed for the AR.

A good stiff toothbrush.

CLP and Hoppes #9.

A chamber/bore guide is not a bad idea either. It keeps some gunk out of the chamber when swabbing the barrel.
 
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bad_dad_brad

New member
Hey GunFool, I hear ya!!

I just bought an AR-15 Bushy Shorty about a month ago.

I am just in love with this rifle, but at first, like an exotic woman, she intimidates, but then you realize, just like all women, she can be figured out. Disassembly for cleaning is pretty easy once you do it a few times, and you realize, that deep down, it is a pretty simple mechanism, and a very easy rifle to maintain. Hint, get a little tool from Bushmaster to push the upper and lower retaining pins out. It is on their web site.

http://www.bushmaster.com/shopping/gunsmith/imp-1.asp

Regarding charging the weapon. To really be safe, you should have the rifle on safe before you chamber a round. How? Pull back the charging handle on an unloaded AR (no magazine in the well) and let go. Since you are not loading a round with this action I sort of gently let the bolt come back. Put the rifle on safe (you can only put the rifle on safe when the hammer is cocked). Load the magazine and repeat the above action, except let the bolt slam back. This will chamber a round into a rifle on safe.

Note that you can lock the bolt back on an empty mag well by holding the charging handle back, and pushing on the bottom of the bolt catch lever. To save wear and tear on your charging handle this is what I do. I pull the handle back, lock the bolt, push the charger forward till it clicks into place, put the rifle on safe, load a magazine, and hit the bolt catch to chamber.

Awkward? Sort of, until you realize the easiest way to do this is the to put the rifle butt in right groin, holding the rifle with your left hand around the mag well, pull the charger back with your right, and press the bottom of the bolt catch with your left thumb, locking the bolt back.

If you are loading a new mag after emptying a new one, and will be firing immediately, then just hit the bolt catch after putting a new magazine in. Otherwise, make sure to safe your AR between loading. I am pretty religous about flipping that safe lever to SAFE. It is so easy to do.

I think the AR is a great rifle. Very ergonomic. There are tons of things on the rifle to hold onto, the carrying handle, the mag well, the front and rear stocks. Very handy. Even though the basic sound design is 40+ years old, through constant updates up to the current A2 model, it has remained modern. And it still looks just as cool and futuristic as ever.

I agree with you regarding the sights. Very good compared to any other "civilian" rifles I have shot. I like the large aperture peep.

There are plenty of post on the TFL forum about AR mags. There are a lot of good hi-caps still available at reasonable prices.

Finally, you might want to get this book:

"The Complete AR-15/AR-16 Sourcebook" by Duncan Long published by Paladin Press. Pretty good reference at a reasonable price.

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/t...f=sr_1_1/103-5784866-3856658?v=glance&s=books

I think I picked one up for about 25 bucks from a book club I belong to. There are a lot of videos and books about the AR.
 
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Ironbarr

New member
Gunfool...

I have a new Olympic Arms AR 15 - I knew nothing - as in ZERO - about anything after the M-1 Garand. Read a lot, but didn't get the A, B, C's until I read the online OLY AR 15 manual. Since the AR design is pretty standard you might read it. Go to http://olyarms.com/usa.html and click on Tech Info... you'll find it there. Should answer some of your questions and expose you to some of the "language" (yes, seems everything has a specialized language).

(Now folks, I'm going out on a limb. If I'm technically incorrect, please jump in... and be gentle - I'm still learning Thanks.)

After spending some time learning mine, I likened it to (in some ways) a 1911 in that the bolt (slide, in that case) reacting to the force against the recoil spring, etc., cycles through extraction, ejection, cocking, stripping and chambering when a round is fired. Racking the 1911 slide is akin to manually pulling and releasing the AR's Charging Handle. It retracts the bolt and when released, the bolt strips and chambers a round and readies the trigger world for firing. The force of a round fired is, essentially, gas. It is fed back through that tube under the handguards to retract the bolt, starting the reload cycle.

Anyway, read the online book... it will help.

-Andy
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shooter_john

New member
"Good Magazines"

Hey Gun Fool-
I have 2AR's, my babies as I refer to them, and the absolute best magazines I have ever seen are the Israeli Orlites (30rd) I own three and have never missed a round out of any of them. The rebuilt GI mags that have been rebuilt also work well. You can tell if they are rebuilt if the y have green followers, if they have black, dont waste your money. Another huge factor is ammo- stay far away from the really cheap stuff- it will cause you a lot more trouble than it is worth.
Have a good one!
 
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_YoYo_

New member
save yourself the hassle of orlites and thermolds and the such.. just get GI mags..it would be nice to get some that are still in the package with green followers. or if you get rebuilt ones(they work great) make sure the lips arent bent and they are not all dinged up. As far as the 20 rounders go... factory colt 20 rounders work well.. I know a lot of people say they don't have trouble with the orlites or thermolds. While they are a hell of a lot better than most aftermarket mags like USA mags, they still aren't as good as GI contract mags. Orlites will work perfectly for just plinking around every now and then. But if you leave them loaded they tend to lose shape, and they will also malfunction in high stress situations. I realize they are made of polymers that are stronger than steel, and they look a helluva lot better than scratched up GI mags.. but take it from someone who has owned many different mags of every type out there.. ask anyone over at ar15.com they will tell you the same.. orlites are ok, but spend a little extra and get some USGI mags..
 
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Destructo6

New member
Don't be intimidated, the AR series really isn't all that complicated.

There's some small pieces in the bolt assembly that you should definately keep track of in the field; namely the firing pin retainer and bolt key. If you need to disassemble the bolt in the field, simply put the parts in your upturned hat (official USMC method).

The AR series has a lot of nice little features. When you change mags with the bolt locked to the rear, you can simply hit the bolt release with the the heel of your left hand to release the bolt (no need to gingerly press the big end). When you wear thick gloves, you can drop the trigger guard down, just by depressing the button at the forward end with a bullet tip or similar.

The only GI mags you don't want are Cooper and Sanchez. Adventureline, Kay, Colt, etc are similarly good.
 
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GLOCKT

New member
While charging a new mag,watch out for the charging handle.This can not be sling-shoted.
It's aluminum and can bend,break and wear very quickly.I use the bolt release on my Bushmaster every chance possible.
 
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zxc

New member
ARs are complicated but they take abuse well. Use it and get to know it well, pretty soon youll be wanting a preban, doodads etc. Love the look of a dinged up AR 15.
 
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GunFool

New member
Thanks for all the help and suggestions guys! This is why I love this forum above all others! I already feel more comfortable with my new rifle. The dissassembly for cleaning still seems daunting but I have faith that it will become less frightening with time. I am very confident with the AR's operation now, however, and can't wait to put her through her paces.Thanks again to everyone who replied!
 
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yorec

New member
Some good pointers so far, guys. Good enough I don't think I have anything to add...

So instead I'll point something out for ya, GunFool:

Cleaning seems like you almost need a gunsmith to pull everything apart, clean it, oil it, and put it all back together
Click to expand...

Just give it a year of consistant use and cleaning and you'll be laughing about this statement like crazy. ARs are modern, but high tech? Only in the design.

Have fun with it!
 
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voilsb

New member
the old ar15.com (old.ar15.com) site has good info on learning your new baby, too. it's got a section that walks you step-by-step disassembly, cleaning, and reassembly. it might be daunting at first, but it really is a pretty simple procedure.

enjoy your rifle. i've loved all of mine (though most (all but one) were only on loan until the gov't wanted me to return them after we got back in from the field).
 
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RandomPerson

New member
Regarding those handguards:

I found removal and installation of those a complete bear, and a few weeks back had to do this over and over again several times. Turns out someone came up with a tool to make this a two-hand job -- it hooks into the magwell and helps you easily hold down the slip ring. Check out Brownell for it.
 
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