New Vaquero vs. Old Vaquero
- Thread starter gyvel
- Start date
OLD Vaqueros can take high pressure "Ruger Only" (Tier-III) loads from the manuals
NEW Vaqueros are much lighter/smaller and (in 45Colt) are Tier-1/2 limited.
See;
http://www.riflemagazine.com/magazine/PDF/HL 246partial.pdf
and...
http://www.riflemagazine.com/magazine/PDF/HL_234_preview.pdf (p. 39)
NEW Vaqueros are much lighter/smaller and (in 45Colt) are Tier-1/2 limited.
See;
http://www.riflemagazine.com/magazine/PDF/HL 246partial.pdf
and...
http://www.riflemagazine.com/magazine/PDF/HL_234_preview.pdf (p. 39)
Driftwood Johnson
New member
Howdy
It all boils down to the strength of the cylinder. The cylinder of the older 'original model' Vaquero was larger, so there was more metal surrounding each chamber. The frame was then larger to accommodate the larger cylinder.
When the New Vaquero came out, the cylinder and frame were shrunk down to about the size of a Colt Single Action Army. There is less metal surrounding each chamber.
This photo may help explain. In the center is the cylinder of an 'original model' Vaquero chambered for 45 Colt. On the left is the cylinder from an Uberti Cattleman, on the right is the cylinder from a 2nd Gen Colt SAA. Both are also chambered for 45 Colt. Sorry, I don't own a New Vaquero chambered for 45 Colt, but the amount of metal surrounding each chamber would be very similar to what you see with the Uberti and Colt cylinders.
This is the reason that although the 'original model' Vaquero was chambered for 44 Magnum, the New Vaquero is not.
It all boils down to the strength of the cylinder. The cylinder of the older 'original model' Vaquero was larger, so there was more metal surrounding each chamber. The frame was then larger to accommodate the larger cylinder.
When the New Vaquero came out, the cylinder and frame were shrunk down to about the size of a Colt Single Action Army. There is less metal surrounding each chamber.
This photo may help explain. In the center is the cylinder of an 'original model' Vaquero chambered for 45 Colt. On the left is the cylinder from an Uberti Cattleman, on the right is the cylinder from a 2nd Gen Colt SAA. Both are also chambered for 45 Colt. Sorry, I don't own a New Vaquero chambered for 45 Colt, but the amount of metal surrounding each chamber would be very similar to what you see with the Uberti and Colt cylinders.
This is the reason that although the 'original model' Vaquero was chambered for 44 Magnum, the New Vaquero is not.
To add, if you are talking .357, the point is moot. Both with handle any .357 load. In fact the New Vaquero is the same cylinder and frame size as the .357 introduced in '55. Only when we talk about .45 Colt that you have to be aware of the difference. The original Vaquero and current BH in .357 is way overkill.
A point of order here, one pertaining to terms. There is a "terminology trap" built in to the names Ruger gave them, and people penchant for shortening names and misunderstanding.
At one time, it was reasonably simple, but today we have many variations of Blackhawk and Super Blackhawk, the Vaquero and the New Vaquero.
The NEW VAQUERO is the gun in current production. It is a fixed sight SA revolver of the same approximate size as the Colt SAA. The frame is marked "New Vaquero".
Always use BOTH words for this gun, and we know what is being talked about.
the VAQUERO is the larger, heavier, fixed sight SA revolver that Ruger produced before the New Vaquero. The frame is marked "Vaquero". It was built on the 44mag size frame. Call it Vaquero, or if you must add an identifier, call it the "original Vaquero", and confusion will be minimized.
If possible (and I know its not easy) avoid the use of the phrase "old model" when referring to the Vaquero.
"Old model and New Model" are terms specifically referring to the Blackhawk lockwork system. Ruger changed the lockwork (added a transfer bar and some other changes) in 1973. Blackhawks (and Supers) made before that are referred to as "old model" or "3 screw", by shooters.
Guns made after 73 are called "New Model" by Ruger. The frames say "New Model Blackhawk" or "New Model Super Blackhawk".
The Vaquero wasn't built until many years after the New Model (transfer bar system) change. There is no such thing as an "old model Vaquero" (a Vaquero with the pre 1973 lockwork).
"New" and "new model" mean different things to Ruger, and to us. It is very easy to use the incorrect term in conversation, and confusion can result.
In this case, calling the Vaquero the "old model" is pretty clear from the context, but this is not always the case, so I would recommend saying "original" or just "Vaquero".
and, to answer, the Vaquero is not "allegedly" built on the (new model) Blackhawk frame, it is built on the Vaquero frame, which is the same size (strength, etc) as the (large) New Model Blackhawk frame (.44 mag size, not the smaller "flattop" version.)
The Vaquero frame is essentially the NM Blackhawk frame but with a Colt style smooth topstrap and fixed sights.
The significant difference between the New Vaquero and the Vaquero is that the New Vaquero fits Colt size holsters, the "original" Vaquero does not.
The Vaquero can handle the top end .44Magnum level handloads. The New Vaquero is not considered safe with those loads.
The Vaquero can handle the top end "Ruger only" .45 Colt loads, BUT it is still a fixed sight revolver, and it can take a bit of work either in ammo, or in PERMANENT changes to the gun to get it zeroed with the heavy loads.
A (new model) Blackhawk in .45 Colt will handle the same loads, and is easily zeroed with a couple of screwdrivers. AND it can be rezeroed just as easily for different loads. The Vaquero (and all fixed sight guns) cannot.
This might not matter to you, but it does to me.
This should give you an idea of the difference between them. The top gun (blued) is a New Vaquero 5.5" barrel. The bottom (stainless) is a Vaquero, 4 5/8" barrel. Both are .45 Colt.
Note how, despite slightly over an inch difference in barrel length the guns are virtually the same size overall.
You'll have to pardon me as I'm a belt & suspender man when it comes to unambiguous terminology about things that go "boom"
Used alone, "Vaquero" is ambiguous to 90% of the shooting population (a number I made up myself)
In contrast, OLD Vaquero is totally unambiguous.
So y'all will have to forgive me in advance.
Used alone, "Vaquero" is ambiguous to 90% of the shooting population (a number I made up myself)
In contrast, OLD Vaquero is totally unambiguous.
So y'all will have to forgive me in advance.
Driftwood Johnson
New member
Howdy Again
You may notice that I referred to 'original model' Vaquero and New Vaquero in my post, which is how I always refer to them to help dispel any confusion. But if Ruger had been smart and used a term like Vaquero Mark II, as they did with their old 22 auto-matic pistols, a great deal of confusion could have been avoided.
You may notice that I referred to 'original model' Vaquero and New Vaquero in my post, which is how I always refer to them to help dispel any confusion. But if Ruger had been smart and used a term like Vaquero Mark II, as they did with their old 22 auto-matic pistols, a great deal of confusion could have been avoided.
Jim Watson
New member
Poor flimsy New Vaquero.
It may not take the gross overloads of a (original) Vaquero, but it is still a bigger, stouter gun than a Colt.
And as 44 AMP says, it is subject to the limitations of any fixed sighted revolver. To take the adjustable sights off and raise the price was a marvel of marketing by Ruger.
It may not take the gross overloads of a (original) Vaquero, but it is still a bigger, stouter gun than a Colt.
And as 44 AMP says, it is subject to the limitations of any fixed sighted revolver. To take the adjustable sights off and raise the price was a marvel of marketing by Ruger.
Driftwood Johnson
New member
Howdy Again
'original model' Vaquero at the top, a pair of New Vaqueros underneath. A little bit difficult to tell from the photo, but the 'original model' is significantly larger than the New Models.
Colt Single Action Army and New Vaquero. So close in size that without picking them up and cocking the hammers, you have to look at the number of screws and the configuration of the triggers to tell them apart.
'original model' Vaquero at the top, a pair of New Vaqueros underneath. A little bit difficult to tell from the photo, but the 'original model' is significantly larger than the New Models.
Colt Single Action Army and New Vaquero. So close in size that without picking them up and cocking the hammers, you have to look at the number of screws and the configuration of the triggers to tell them apart.
Driftwood Johnson
New member
Nope. That's just an illusion caused by the camera angle.
