New S&W PPK/s

[rob i]

Hi,

I know that there are a lot of mixed reviews on this gun, but despite that I bought a brand new one earlier this week. I just had the opportunity to fire it this evening. I put 100 rounds of winchester through it and I couldn't believe how accurate it was. I shot very very well with this gun. However... I experienced one jam after about 80 rounds. Please note that I did clean this gun before firing, and that this was the only jam out of 100. I do not have the level of experience that many on this board have and do not get to shoot as often as I'd like. Is one round out of 100 a bad sign? Should it be sent back? It could have been my wrist as I shot, I am not sure. I do know that after the jam was cleared (very difficult), it shot the remaining twenty rounds without a hitch. I was so excited about this pistol until this jam. I plan on buying more ammo tomorrow and giving it another go. I guess I am looking for some reassurance that this is not that big a deal, and part of the break in period. This gun is, by the way, one of the newly designed ppk's by Smith and Wesson with the extended beaver tail grip. Recoil was not an issue in the slightest, and the gun was more than a pleasure to shoot.

Thanks for an insight you folks could provide,
Rob I.

 

[XavierBreath]

When you say jam, do you mean failure to extract, failure to chamber, a double feed? Stovepipe? There are many types.

Compared to the one I had, one failure in the first 100 rounds is pretty normal. Mine never went totally sour, but I was never able to gain confidence in it's reliability. The PPK/S is sensitive to limp wristing. It's also sensitive to weak loads. Watch the square block part of the triggerguard that the slide recoils against for peening. If it starts to get peened, round the corners or it will get stuck in the frame and you can't fieldstrip the pistol.

 

[rob i]

It seemed more like a double feed. It was difficult to clear, but functioned fine afterwards. Sorry to hear you couldn't regain confidence with yours. I am hoping that I can with mine. I really enjoyed shooting it. Thanks for your reply.

 

[Forseti]

Were you using ordinary full metal jacket ammo, or hollowpoint ammo?

If you plan to carry with hollowpoint, but did not fire it in your test run, go buy a box and try it. On an old Interarms PPK/S I had some experience with, it hated hollowpoints, did better with FMJ ammo.

100 rounds with a brand new gun is not too much. Shoot through another 300. Then see how it does after that.

 

[rob i]

It was winchester fmj. I have not yet tried hollow points. I will pick up some tomorrow.

 

[rob i]

update:

Today I went to the range with 3 boxes of winchester winclean fmj's and one box of winchester supreme hollow points. I shot all three boxes of the fmj's (150 rounds), and 12 rounds of the hollowpoints. All fed fine, no failures at all. It was, as yesterday, extraordinarily accurate and tons of fun to shoot. So, 262 total rounds fired, with one failure in the first 80 rounds. Is it safe to conclude reliability at this point? I do think that there could have been a bit of operator error on the failure. Something tells me that I may have put eight rounds in the 7 round mag, but that seems impossible. It could have been limp wrist as well. Not sure, wish it never happened, but no sign of it today. Feedback would be great. I absolutely love this pistol. My other guns are a Glock 19, Sig 239, and a Ruger sp101 in .357. Honestly, I enjoyed shooting this one more than all the others. Including the sig

Thanks,
Rob

 

[Dfariswheel]

Guns are machines, and ALL machines from aircraft to cars, to guns, to egg beaters need a break-in period.

On a gun like your new Walter, about 200 rounds is considered to be about right.

Having a stoppage or two during that break-in is no cause for alarm.

If you want to do a REAL reliability verification, here's my personal method.
After shooting 200 rounds or so to break the gun in, strip the gun AND magazines, and give them a THOROUGH cleaning and lubrication.
Be SURE to reassemble both the gun and magazines properly. (Recoil spring right way around, magazine springs oriented properly, etc).

Buy 100 rounds of THE SAME BRAND AND TYPE of ammo you plan on using in the gun.

Take the gun to the range, and shoot the entire 100 rounds in a single session, if possible. If you can't, don't clean or disassemble anything until you can finish the 100 rounds.

Make sure to use all the magazine equally, and keep track of which magazine is which, so if there's a problem you'll know which mag is defective.

Shoot the gun in as many different ways as possible, starting most magazine off in double action.
Shoot slow fire, rapid fire, with the gun on it's side, etc.

If it'll shoot ALL 100 rounds with NO stoppages or other problems, THAT gun and THAT specific brand/type of ammo are reliable.

For larger pistols, I go with a 200 round test.

 

[ADBF]

I have an older Interarms PPK/S that I bought about 15 years ago, I guess. I only have six or seven hundred rounds total through that little piece, but there were many different kinds of ammo I sent through it. Everything from junk FMJ's to high quality personal defense ammo. Not one single "squeek," "burp," or "gurgle" in all those different rounds. Accurate as all get out, too for a little gun.

My Dad kept buggin' me to give it to him. But I kept saying no way, I liked it too much. So, about three or four years ago I got him a stainless IA PPK/S for Christmas. First time out that little gun jammed on FMJ's several times. Maybe it was just the luck of the draw on mine.

In my opinion, let 'er break in a bit. Keep it nice and clean and lubed and maybe it will loosen up a bit for you. Best...

 

[bubbygator]

I think you found a keeper! I had an nice one just before the beaver-tail went into effect & it was very accurate & reliable through about 200 rounds. I had intended to put a set of Crimson Trace Lasergrips on it, but they withdrew the design for that model. Although it's a little heavy compared to the plastic (& scandium) guns, it is super flat & very hand-friendly with the beaver. Good shooting!

 

[InToItTRX]

Wow your PPK must be the only good one S&W has made. Both of mine were bad, it took a while but I found a PPK that works great that is actually made in germany. Good luck with your new gun, the PPK is a blast to shoot, I hope your new weapon continues to work well.

 

[drdirk]

rob, your failure is nothing to worry about!

Keep in mind this is an all stainless steel gun! It takes time to break in. I would not consider it broken in unless 4 to 500 rounds!!
Love mine, will replace the cheap looking grips however. Carry in a Sickinger clip holster. It replaced my 642 as my carry gun.

 

[drdirk]

this one is redesigned

See my earlier post: SW DID make a few improvements to this. Not just the beaver tail. It is now as good as they used to be again.

 

[dswindle]

Robi,
I bought a new S&W (Walther) PPK/S about six months ago, and I really like mine also. I also had two failure to feeds very similar to yours -- it appeared that it was an attempt to "double feed." Now, I'm not sure what caused this, but I might have been the problem. I was shooting with a friend (100 rounds total), at the time. I was not paying as much attention to what I was doing as I should have been, and I might have either not placed the magazine in all the way or I might have "limp wristed" the pistol. While I can't be specific, I recall that I might have pulled the slide back to load a round into the chamber, and for some reason, I think that I might not have done that "firmly" enough. Again, I wish I had been paying more attention to what I was doing. I too don't like the grips on the gun, but I will say that S&W went to a new micarta type of synthetic grip as opposed to the old black plastic ones used by Interarms. I think these grips are much tougher than the old ones. I used to have an Interarms pistol that I had Eagle Buffalo Horn grips placed on it that I really liked. The Buffalo Horn grips were thicker than the black micarta grips, and this caused them to take up more space from my hand. This in turn seemed to cause my grip to lower which made the gun much more controllable. You probably already know this, but grips for the old Interarms PPK/S pistols will not fit the S&W ones. The Buffalo Horn grips are very durable and tough. I have only shot FMJ through my pistol, and that is probably all that I will carry in it. I usually carry it in either an ankle holster, crossdraw clip on holster on my belt or sometimes in my "fanny pack." Just depends on the situation and the time of year. Here in southeast Georgia, it is very hot in the summer time, so wearing a jacket is not comfortable. Since I fired my gun the first time, I have replaced the recoil spring with a Wolffe spring. I'll let you know how it works next time. Good luck on your new pistol. Hope you like yours as much as I like mine.

 

[rob i]

Thank you for all the positive responses! Dswindle, I am glad to hear that someone else had exactly the same scenerio that I did. Just like yourself, I wasn't paying as much attention as I should have been when the jam happened. I think that I was getting too comfortable shooting it. It seems that perhaps many of the bad reviews surrounding the Smith and Wesson PPK/s's, were more about the ones made prior to the redesign and the move to Houlton, Me. Not sure, but I am glad to read the very positive reviews in the last few days regarding these new PPk's. I really do like this gun alot.

thanks again.

Rob

 

[9mmsnoopy]

one jam in 100 rounds a bad sign? not on a ppk/s, sounds like you got the cream of the crop, the TWO ppk's i had would average a jam every 10 rounds or so. have owned many guns since and never a single jam from any of them.

 

[denfoote]

I would sat you are about half way through your break in period and that things are coming along quite nicely!!

One thing.
Aftermarket mags??
FORGITABOUTIT!!!!
I bought 4 Mec-Gar mags. None worked!! Went back to the Walther mags from S&W, let's say things got better real fast!!

 

[InToItTRX]

I am sure S&W improved things, I hope it was due to me sending a letter to Walther in Germany explaining to them they should drop S&W as their importer because S&W was ruining the Walther name.

I don't mean to over complain, but I highly doubt S&W has made their new and improved PPK better then some of the German PPK's.

I would have more faith if I did not get a full refund from S&W on two of their PPK's.

Stay away from non factory mags, the one time I bought an aftermarket mag was for my M4, I was out at the range shooting with my new 40 round mag, after about 20 rounds the mag fell out of the gun and broke sending my ammo everywhere.

But as I said the PPK is a great gun, I hope yours turns out to be ok.

 

[rob i]

Update:

I made a trip to the range tonight and put 149 rounds through my PPK/s. I did have one failure to eject at about round 72. It was a totally different kind of jam this time. When I went to clear it, the empty case was mangled up front and a live round fell out as well. It functioned perfectly for the remaining 77 rounds. I am crushed that this happened, but I do remember noting that something seemed off when I loaded the mag, but didn't think much of it at the time. I've shot 411 rounds through this pistol and so far have had 2 failures. One seemingly double feed, and one failure to eject. What's everyone's thought on this one?

Thanks for any feedback you can offer.
Rob

 

[InToItTRX]

What type of ammo are you shooting? Do you intend on using the gun for self defense as well? If so I would test the ammo that you would load the gun with for self defense to make sure the PPK likes it. I have noticed that PPK's can some times be picky with what type, or brand of ammo you use. I shoot Winchester white box FMJ's for target practice, and Federal hydra shocks for self defense, I have not had any issues with these two bullets, however my PPK is also german. But give it a try, maybe the PPK's like the Winchester White Box. PPK's also do need a break in time, I think when I had my S&W PPK the gunsmith told me 500 rounds. So see how it handles after 500 or so rounds.

 

[rob i]

A couple other things that may be worth noting. The two failures that I had were with the mag with the finger extension. Also, the first failure was with the Winchester white box and the other was with the Winchester winclean. I have only shot 50 rounds of the white box and 300 rounds of the winclean. It did not jam on the 20 rounds of winchester supreme hollow points, or the 42 rounds of winchester silvertips. Also, I can't help but think that perhaps the rounds weren't seated properly in the mag each time I had a jam. I remember something just sort of seeming wierd when I loaded the magazine each of those times. I didn't think anything of it at the time. Also, each time, they were completely different kinds of jams. The last one being a failure to eject fully. I stripped the gun last night, and the extracter looks fine, but seems to be a bit of brass burs and much filth caught under it. Also, I shot 149 rounds last night. It jammed on # 72 and fired the remaining 77 perfectly. I emailed walther america and hope to hear from them soon. I will call four seasons today and see what advice they can give. I do plan on carrying this. I bought it for that specific reason. One other thing, both jams occured in the first 334 rounds. Not sure if that is part of the break in period. Thanks to all.

Rob