My first reloads, work-ups, and results...

[FiveInADime]

I just started handloading and today I tested out my first loads. I am reloading .243 Win. exclusively for now.
Here is my first load workup. Maybe you guys can help me decide where to go from here. :AR15firin

87gr. V-Max - IMR 4064 - C.O.L. = 2.70 - 5 Shot Groups, 100yds., 73°F - Hornady Case - Federal 210M Primer

1. 33.8 Gr. = 0.792" No Signs Of Over-Pressure
2. 34.3 Gr. = 0.710" No Signs
3. 34.8 Gr. = 0.485" 4 shots; pulled the 5th 0.944"
4. 35.3 Gr. = 1.597" No Signs
5. 35.8 Gr. = 1.448" No Signs
6. 36.3 Gr. = 2.651" No Signs
7. 36.8 Gr. = 0.751" 4 shots; flyer 1.207"
8. 37.1 Gr. = 1.410" No Signs

Here's a picture of my first 3 groups... I was pretty excited with these.


I was disappointed to see that the groups opened up as I went up in charge weight. They started coming back around max. Should I bump up a few tenths of a grain on max and see what happens? Even at max-load from the Hornady manual the primers were not even flatting out.

Thanks in advance.


SENT FROM MY GALAXY S 4G USING TAPATALK

 

[dacaur]

Your distance between loads is too big... believe it or not, as little as .2-3gr can make a big difference, at least in my personal experience... When I was developing a load for my .308,. I settled on 43.8gr of varget with my 165gr SST's. I started around 35gr and worked up in .2-.3gr increments. 39gr gave sub moa groups, then everything between there and 43.8 was over an inch, 43.5 grains gave groups at 1-1.5", while 43.8gr gives consistent sub-moa groups, with the occasional .5 MOA when im having a good day... 44 grains opens the groups back up to 1.5-2".....

I would say load some up around 36.8gr, try 36.4, 36.6, and 37gr....

 

[mrawesome22]

This is where a chronograph really shines.

After that many rounds it will be hard to tell if it is shooter fatigue or luck making the groups smaller or larger.

Over the chronograph, if es, sd, and avg vel go down, but groups open, more than likely it is shooter error imo.

Fouling could also alter these reults.

Did you do any cleaning?

Did you give the barrel time to cool?

 

[mrawesome22]

Just an fyi, but if this is a hunting rifle, the only shot that matters is the first from a clean, lightly oiled bore.

My varmint guns hit high left for the first couple shots but settle to zero after that.

It is good info to know since I clean my guns after every trip out.

I have a muzzleloader that if I don't run a dry patch before shooting will hit 4inches right.

All following shots will cut each other no matter how dirty it gets.

Have fun and enjoy getting to know your boom sticks

 

[FiveInADime]

Thanks for the input guys. I would have loved to have had a chronograph but that hasn't been budgeted yet. I will try playing around with loads around 36.8gr.

To answer your questions mrawesome:
This is my predator rifle and I am on board with just getting the cold bore shot to count, although I only leave #9 in the barrel, no gun oil. I am an Arizonan, however, so we really are oblivious to things like humidity that everyone else experiences .

I never let the barrel get too hot to comfortably grip. I always take a ten minute break between groups.

This gun, by the way, is a Winchester model 70 'Youth Ranger' mid-80's push feed. 22" bbl, 1:10.

SENT FROM MY GALAXY S 4G USING TAPATALK

 

[Brian Pfleuger]

If you want a good, systematic load development strategy, check out Dan Newberry's OCW.

On the matter of charge increments, yes, they should be smaller. Increments should be between 0.7 and 1.0% of anticipated max charge.

If you expect max charge to be 37.1gr, 37.1*0.01= 0.371. That's the MOST you should be increasing. Less than .4gr, so .3gr would be ideal.

I'd be willing to bet that a 2.6" group in that sequence is "operator error", so to speak.

Flat primers, in and of themselves, are not a reliable pressure indicator. In the absence of any indications of pressure (all indications, not just one), it is safe to go one charge increment beyond expected mac charge.

I'd redo the testing, using Dan Newberry's technique.

 

[FiveInADime]

If you expect max charge to be 37.1gr, 37.1*0.01= 0.371. That's the MOST you should be increasing. Less than .4gr, so .3gr would be ideal.

I'd be willing to bet that a 2.6" group in that sequence is "operator error", so to speak.

Flat primers, in and of themselves, are not a reliable pressure indicator.

I'd redo the testing, using Dan Newberry's technique.

Thank you for the link. This being my first try at this I used .5gr. Increments because I saw that often recommended.

In the 2.6" group no two bullets were close to each other. It was truly shocking to me to see such a bad group form. The barrel was cool, I was shooting off of a concrete bench with bench bags. I can confidently say that it wasn't me shooting that bad.

I know that flat primers are not a reliable over-pressure indicator, but even at my max loads they still looked the same as my starting load primers.


SENT FROM MY GALAXY S 4G USING TAPATALK

 

[Brian Pfleuger]

In the 2.6" group no two bullets were close to each other. It was truly shocking to me to see such a bad group form. The barrel was cool, I was shooting off of a concrete bench with bench bags. I can confidently say that it wasn't me shooting that bad.

Anything's possible I suppose. I do see a lot of reports of remarkable changes in group size. I usually struggle to find a difference in groups from any of my guns when I'm working up loads. I'm not sure if the variance others get or the variance that I don't get is more confusing to me. I certainly know that I'm not a world class marksman and my guns are nothing special.

I know that flat primers are not a reliable over-pressure indicator, but even at my max loads they still looked the same as my starting load primers.

I know what you mean. I never see any difference in my rifle loads, I use CCI BR primers in both large and small rifle in several different cartridges. They always look the same, no matter what.

On the other hand, I have used both Federal and CCI primers in 357sig. The CCI primers never flatten any more than their rifle primers do but the Federal primers will flatten and mushroom at even the lowest starting loads and will pierce before I reach max loads.

I used .5gr. Increments because I saw that often recommended.

Understandable. It's not a bad recommendation for an awful lot of guns. There are lots of cartridges that use 50+ grains of powder, even 70 or more. For them, 1/2gr might be unreasonably small.

That's the trouble with the internet. Some guy might say "Yeah, I use 1/2gr increments, works great for me!" but he doesn't mention that he's loading 65gr either.