Mosin Nagant problem

O

Opinated

New member
Bought a Mosin Nagant, cosmoline galore. Disassembled it into major parts and cleaned most of it. Reassembled it and now the bolt will not remove and the trigger seems loose. I suspect that the trigger pin was lost and I reassembled it that way. The bolt works OK but cannot now be removed. The disassembly screw head under the bolt is not accessible now. My bolt has serial that matches the magazine box, etc.
Any way to get the bolt out without cutting it apart? That would take hours of Dremel grinding. I bet this is not the first time this has happened.
Thanks for your help.
 
T

tobnpr

New member
You say the bolt functions normally- but it sounds as though the bolt stop/sear is engaged on the cocking piece (bolt is cocked but cannot be released)?

Never seen a way for the trigger pin to fall out while it's in the stock, as the inletting will not allow it to do so- must have been missing as you say when you assembled it.

You can access the screw head under the cocking piece- but it ain't easy. You need to work something in there into the slotted head and gradually work it around to loosen enough for the mag to come loose.

Alternately, and you may need another set of hands, pull back the cocking piece as far as it will go (a lot of spring tension)- you can then squeeze a pick down in there and depress the sear releasing the cocking piece.
 
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tangolima

New member
Take the action out of the stock and start everything from there.

Sounds like the trigger was assembled incorrectly, so that the sear doesn't come.down enough to clear the bolt. It a very simple rifle design. It shouldn't be very hard.

-TL

Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk
 
M

Mobuck

Moderator
"Take the action out of the stock and start everything from there."

"The disassembly screw head under the bolt is not accessible now."

I know nothing about a M N but apparently dis-assembly is not as easy as it appears if the bolt isn't removed. tobnpr likely has the best plan.
 
O

Opinated

New member
If the trigger pin is missing, and I cannot confirm that at this time, obviously it was missing when I assembled the action/barrel to the stock. Removing the action/barrel from the stock is not possible, as far as I can see, without removing the screw which is under the bolt when the bolt is in the receiver. And I see no way to loosen that screw with the bolt in place.
If I did assemble it with the trigger pin missing, it almost certainly has happened to others previously.
To rephrase my dilemma, how to remove the bolt from the receiver when the trigger will not release it?
 
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tangolima

New member
I got the wrong mental picture when I first read the op. It is the tang screw that is covered by the cocking piece. My bad.

Does the trigger move up and down? With the bolt handle raised and pulled back, grab the trigger and pull it to the bottom of the trigger guard, can you feel the springy tension of a spring?

If you can make the gun fire, the cocking piece will go forward and expose the tang screw. There are a few ways you can try to make the sear release the cocking piece. I just need to know where you are with the trigger.

-TL

Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk
 
O

Opinated

New member
The responses are very much appreciated. They provoke additional thought on my part. I have never fired this rifle-- this assembly is the first after removing the cosmoline. I do not recall even dry firing it. The rifle is in my shop in a detached building, so holding it while on the computer is not possible.
Watched several more of the YouTube videos and now realize that if the bolt was not in the cocked position, the back tang screw is partially exposed.
If I remove the magazine bottom and spring, any chance to release the firing pin tension?
I do not recall how this date was established, but earlier I was led to believe that my rifle was made in 1945-- appears to have minimal mechanical wear.
The stock has two minor repairs and then was refinished-- presumably by Russian armorers.
If I knew where to drill, I could drill the stock at the trigger pin position and insert a pin if it is missing-- then patch that hole.
Given the good condition of the metal, if necessary the stock could be sacrificed. Cutting away the wood would expose the screw body enabling removal with pliers on the body.
A replacement stock would be necessary.
Hopefully you, collectively, will have some insight on these "ideas".
Thanks again.
 
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O

Opinated

New member
Watched some more Mosin Nagant videos on YouTube and caught glimpses of the parts that might be involved in the problem with my rifle.
I think that The Receiver/Barrel (RB) and Magazine Body/Trigger Guard (MBTG) can be fastened together with the screws, perhaps loosely, without the stock being between them. This would permit examining the relationship of the working parts without the stock blocking the view. This would enable seeing if a shim or pick inserted at a certain point might release the bolt.
So I need another such rifle in good working condition for this experiment. Working now on buying or borrowing one.
Your ideas and suggestions welcomed.
 
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tobnpr

New member
This would enable seeing if a shim or pick inserted at a certain point might release the bolt.
Click to expand...

Wow...Deja-vu...

Exactly what I said, 3 days ago...

You can lead a horse....
 
J

Josh Smith

Moderator
Hello,

The trigger spring is NOT the bolt stop.

The bolt stop is on top of the trigger.

You should be able to rotate the trigger so that you can pull the bolt out. You may have to pull the trigger down some, too, but it's very possible.

Please don't Dremel etc. It'll come out just fine with a little work.

Here are some links that may give you a more clear understanding:

http://www.smith-sights.com/tips-and-how-tos.php
http://www.smith-sights.com/instructional-videos.php

There are several movies and articles.

If you have any further questions, please ask. I know these rifles and like to help.

Regards,
Josh
 
O

Opinated

New member
Thanks for the links to the videos.
I located another Mosin which needs some loving care. The (motivated) seller had planned to make it into a sporter but did not yet modify anything. Other projects had gotten his attention. It should be in my possession by next week. It has two stocks with it, the original and the sporter. The stocks are worth the price paid for this one.

Several videos note the tendency of the trigger pin to fall free by gravity-- and I suspect that is what happened in my case. What about lightly peening the pin ends so that drift would be required in order to remove the pin? Wonder what Russian troops did in the field about the loose pin problem? Dropped in the gravel while field cleaning would not be good.
 
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B

ballardw

New member
and I suspect that is what happened in my case. What about lightly peeing the pin ends so that drift would be required in order
Click to expand...

While rust may hold things together I believe you meant peening
 
O

Opinated

New member
What an egregious error on my part-- omitting a crucial letter-- and not a vowel at that. I meant to use hammer and punch to PEEN the pin. Any reason not to do so?
 
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O

Opinated

New member
Another question, please. I have never fired a M-N. Bought two big "spam" cans with opener of ammo that were stated to be corrosive primer. Have been told by one person that spraying Windex into the bore and then cleaning in conventional manner is sufficient after firing this ammo.
Do you agree? If not, what is the procedure that you use? Any idea what the Soviet troops did for cleaning while in the field?
 
1

10-96

New member
Yeah, it appears Windex is a pretty common neutralizing step that I see quite frequently on the innerwebs. What I use is a 50/50 mixture of Ballistol and water (some folk used to call it "Moose Milk"). I like the idea of the Ballistol because when the water evaporates, it leaves the oil. Of course the barrel gets scrubbed by regular cleaning, but I don't worry about the stuff getting into or staying in other areas by accident. And, letting the moose milk soak in the barrel surely can't hurt in cleaning as it stays around longer than the Windex which is kinda quick to evaporate.
 
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