Military trivia

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Buzzcook

New member
What was used to end the last dog fight of WWII?
For extra credit name the planes involved.

I'll post the answer in about an hour.
 
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Dragon55

New member
How about............. extremely tight turning radius????????

P51-D mustang .... Japanese zero model ____????
 
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Bart Noir

New member
What was used to end the last dog fight of WWII?
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Since the obvious answer is that it was ended by a .50 caliber machine gun, I guess it was something else.

So I vote that a Hellcat ended the dogfight by firing a 5-inch rocket and blasting a Nakijima Tojo (Ki-44) right outta the sky.

Bart Noir
 
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Buzzcook

New member
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piper_J-3

In Europe, the final dogfight of WWII occurred between an L-4 (piper cub) and a German Fieseler Fi 156 Storch. The pilot and co-pilot of the L-4, Lts. Duane Francis and Bill Martin, opened fire on the Storch with their .45 caliber pistols, forcing the German air crew to land and surrender.
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Oops, looks like I should have specified Europe.
 
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Dragon55

New member
OK since this was NOT the last dogfight of World War 2..... just the last one that happened in Europe... (although cudos on the use of the .45's) I wonder now what was the actual last dogfight of WWII?????????

I'm guessing it could have occurred over China or maybe Korea.
 
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Buzzcook

New member
I was looking up the Piper Cub. That's what led me to post the question.
Since I noticed my error I've tried to google up an answer without any success.
 
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Dragon55

New member
Yeah me too Buzz... and I'm getin' a headache. Believe it or not I have the oldest licensed lady pilot in the US at a little airport less than 2 miles from me. Mrs. Evelyn Johnson... I think she's at least 90 by now. She knows all kinds of flying trivia. When I'm out there again soon I'm gonna ask her. I bet she will know or know someone who does know. If I find out I'll report back.

More.... she's actually 99 and has logged more miles than anyone still alive.
 
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Bart Noir

New member
I recently read an article about that very event and don't remember it being the last dogfight.

But I do remember that the US crew landed and captured the 2-man German crew, as one tried to run away. The other one couldn't since he was shot in the foot, and the US flier who shot him dressed the wound.

Quite unusual all the way around.

This article was in the August 2008 edition of Flight Journal, which is a fine magazine. The article is rather accurate since it is mostly interviews with the two GIs. It happened on April 11, 1945 and they wounded one of the Germans and put a hole in the fuel tank, forcing the Storch to land. No mention of it being the "last dogfight" but it was close to the end of the Euro-fighting.

For gun content in this thread, 1911 were used to bring down the aircraft and an M1 Carbine was used to capture the German fliers.

One line read; "I flew with my knees as I put a fresh magazine into the .45." :D Sounds like the old cavalry days, holding the reins in your teeth while you reload.

Bart Noir
 
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Buzzcook

New member
WWI started with pilots using small arms against each other. I doubt that a 1911 was one of them, it is possible though.

I just think it's interesting that WWII's air war ended in much the manner that the first one started, with small arms from unarmed aircraft.

I found this link for the last dogfight of WWII. Not sure how trust worthy it is.

http://search.barnesandnoble.com/Seafire-F-III-vs-A6M-Zero/Donald-Nijoboer/e/9781846034336

Products of vastly different design philosophies, the Seafire F III and the A6M Zero were never intended to meet in combat, and never should have. Yet the harsh necessities of war intervened and these two planes were pitted against each other in the last dogfight of World War II, high above the Japanese home lands.
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Small arms against aircraft in North Africa.
http://www.lonesentry.com/articles/defga/index.html

In one instance in Africa, an eye-witness reported the destruction of three Italian planes in 5 minutes by small-arms fire. In another case, the Germans claim to have brought down a Soviet plane with an automatic pistol.
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(Note. The British, in their defense of Tobruk, proved that small-arms fire can be effective against low-flying aircraft. In one period, rifles and Lewis-type machine guns accounted for nearly half the bombers brought down. One captain rigged a twin Lewis gun outside his office and was officially credited with six planes shot down.
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Don't underestimate the ability of a bunch of guys with Enfields to seriously wreak you Heinkel.
 
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44 AMP

Staff
Its possible

WWI started with pilots using small arms against each other. I doubt that a 1911 was one of them, it is possible though.
Click to expand...

Can't give any proof it ever happened, but we did prepare for it. In Small Arms of the World (Smith&Smith) there is a photo of a 1911 with an extended magazine and a "cage" arrangement around the pistol, intended to deflect the fired cases, and keep them from puncturing the fabric of the biplane.

Can't say about the very last dogfight of WWII, but considering that the war wasn't officially over until the signing of the surrender document (on the BB Missouri) in September, it would almost have to be somewhere in Asia.

According to some sources, several Japanese pilots considered final sorties in the hours between the announcement of the cessation of hostilities, and the hour they went into effect. As a result of concern over this possibility, the US fleet recieved orders that during those hours, any Japanese aircraft approaching the fleet were to be shot down, "in a non-hostile manner". :D
 
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BobbyT

New member
Considering all the Japanese who supposedly stayed camped out on the craphole islands they'd "conquered" for decades after, I'm going to guess the final dogfight of WWII took place between whatever rustbucket they could get airborne and whatever Vietnam-bound soldier they came across.

It was probably ended by his M16 :p
 
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WIL TERRY

New member
Interesting.

I do know a fellow who's plane was shot down the last day of WWII. He spent the rest of his life in a wheel chair.
 
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Mike Irwin

Staff
Darn it, AMP beat me to the 1911 example.


But, during WW II, apparently the American military ordered several hundred Model 8 Remingtons in .35 Remington with armor piercing bullets and extended magazines to be used by air crews.

It's not thought that any were used, and it's not known if any were actually delivered.

The French, however, took several hundred Model 1907 rifles from Winchester. These apparently were very popular with French air crews.
 
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