Levergun for bad eyes...

[Coop de Ville]

Hi All,

Had my Marlin 336 (30-30) converted awhile back into a Cowboy. Real nice looking now with a 24" octagonal barrel and all. Anyway, I must come to the conclusion and finally admit that I do not shoot well with iron sights. Despite practice, I just plain don't shoot as well as I do with a scope.

I contemplated a tang sight (already tried williams and XO receiver sights) but am not convinced that it's going to help all that much. I wear glasses and contacts and find that I shoot to the right with glasses but centered with contacts (I do have astigmatisms).

To me I can't stand a scope on a levergun... just can't do it. But, I recently saw repro Malcolm scope that, at least, can fake for a period scope... Question is that I don't see any for Marlin 336 in 30-30.

Does anyone know of a model for the Marlin or any other ideas?

Thanks,

-Coop

 

[chris in va]

You really might want to go ahead and consider the tang sights. I also have astigmatism, and a peep allows me to see the sight and target in focus. Otherwise I have to use a red dot, which might look a little funny on your levergun.

 

[fisherman66]

The El Paso straight tube Weavers don't look as objectionable as modern scopes on a cowboy gun. I peeped my 30/30 and I don't think it helped my accuracy as much as speeded up my target acquisition. A frame or tang mounted aperture increased the sight radius, but that's about as magic as the peep gets. Snap shot speed is it's real additive ingredient.

 

[3StrikesNC]

I know it's not cowboy, and I completely understand about "no scope", as I shoot military rifles with no scopes permitted.

But anyway, I thought you might like to see my "reach out and touch" Lever Action (.444 Marlin);

http://i202.photobucket.com/albums/aa112/6045gcnc/444MarlinRight.jpg

I love it.

 

[Tucker 2]

I know what you mean about scopes and levers... but. I put a Bushnell red dot on my Marlin 1894c. It has a small tube is short and sits close to the receiver. Four reticles, 12 intensity settings, I've had it a few years, I think I paid 200$..

 

[Swampghost]

I understand your views about scopes on levers but there comes a time for some when you just have to cave in to common sense or hang it on the wall.

I wear glasses and am scoped. Propriety be hanged, I'm still poking holes in things and having fun.

 

[ursavus.elemensis]

For goodness sake, they're YOUR rifles to enjoy. Unless these are collector grade rifles, if you need a scope to enjoy shooting the rifle, get a scope on it.

I agree about the scope not being the ideal look for a lever gun, but with my visual issues, I have two choices: Figure out a way to scope a rifle, or never shoot the rifle. I collect Winchester model 94 flat bands from the war years. They are my pride and joy to hold, to look at, to cycle the lever. But I rarely ever shoot them, because I simply can not use iron sights of any kind including peep, tang, etc with my vision. I've tried everything I can think of, including ghost ring rear sites, etc. I can't make it work. And, since these are my collector pieces (MY collector pieces; others can collect whatever they want), I do not want to drill or tap for side mounted scope mounts which don't work for me anyway since I am left handed. So, when I want to go shooting, I shoot model 94AE's, in 30-30, 357 Mag, and 44 Mag with scopes mounted. For me, they shoulder, point, and shoot very naturally with the scopes I've selected. I go for the smallest diameter and shortest length that makes sense optically.

My grandfather brought back a 7.7 Jap rifle from his Pacific war service in the Navy. I tried shooting that rifle a bunch of times with the stock iron sights. At over a dollar a shot, I got tired of not being able to see the target through the sites and wasting money to just get frustrated. Finally, although I really, really did not want to alter that special rifle, I bought a scope mount that replaces the rear site assembly without drilling or modifying the rifle. Now I've got a nice Burris scout scope on the rifle and I enjoy every shot I take because every shot I take is a shot I make. Sure, it looks a little "different" compared to how it looked when carried by some Japanese soldier who was no longer using it when my grandfather picked it up, but what do I care? This is a rifle that is worth a hundred bucks, maybe two hundred to the rest of the shooting world, but it is worth all the money in the world to me because I got it from my grandfather and he got it off the beach in the Pacific so many years ago. I don't care how silly it looks to have a scout scope on that rifle. I get to shoot the rifle now and enjoy it, and before putting the scope on, I could not do that.

 

[gb_in_ga]

How 'bout this for a solution?

You already have a Marlin in .30-30 that you are justifiably reluctant to modify from its classic form. And yet you come to the realization that your eyes aren't going to let you keep using the sights you are using, right?

Well, have you thought about just -- getting another Marlin .30-30 and configuring it as a shooter with optics, and keeping your nice octagonal barrel rifle in its current classic configuration?

It isn't like Marlin .30-30s are all that rare or expensive, ya' know.

 

[Mr Odd Six]

Coop,

Do like we do with out smoke poles

Knock the rear sight off, then tape it further up the barrel until you get a good eye relief.

Then reattach it.

Be it dove tailed or screwed in.

Not having ever messed with a lever gun, I dont know how the sights fit on

 

[a7mmnut]

How about one of the low profile "reflex sights" from Millett, Burris, C-More, etc.? Smaller than a true dot and even quicker to use with both eyes open.


-7-

 

[dmazur]

You might consider a Merit adjustable aperture peep for a receiver sight. You can adjust this to match light conditions and, with adequate light, you can crank it down really small.

While I haven't done it yet, you can get "diopter inserts" for certain peep sights, like the NM sights on the Garand. These are available in different strengths, like reading glasses, and help you get the front sight looking sharp and black.

Don't give up. (Getting old isn't for sissies... )

 

[Old Grizz]

Coop,
I know what you mean about scopes on leverguns but with failing eyes from age I have found it neccesary to scope a few of them. I do own one made by Henry that I refused to scope but I couldn't hit a thing with the buckhorn that was on the rifle. I installed a peep sight in the existing dovetail made by Tim Skinner with an .096 apature in it and made my groups shrink to 1" at 50yds. You may want to take a look at what he has, it may help?

www.skinnersights.com

 

[Coop de Ville]

gb in ga,

My original plan was to take it and chop it down to 16", add a synthetic stock(maybe), and a forward scout scope. It would replace my ar-15 as my handy rifle.

But then I saw a cowboy, and, oh well.

Thanks all for the ideas, I'm gonna look around.

-Coop

 

[h2oskikrazy]

Just how bad is your shooting with open sights? I would generalize by saying that most anyone will generally shoot better with a scope than open sights-especially at longer ranges. Even at 50 yards with a rimfire, I can significantly shoot better with a scope than open sights and I grew up shooting open sights. I simply can not see the target detail well enough or see the previous bullet holes to be able to put the next shot in the same hole without magnified optics at 50 yards+. Only at 25 yards can I shoot similar groups both scoped and open sights and even there the scope may play a factor although my rifles are from two different manufactures so I can not say without a doubt that is the case.

Shooting open sights is a different challenge than shooting scoped. If you like shooting open sights, just do that and don't expected groups similar to scoped shooting.

 

[L_Killkenny]

I much prefer the feel of a lever gun with open or peep sights. I much prefer shooting guns with a scope and relize it's better across the board. Only you can make the decision but If you want an opinion I say scope it. You (i.e everybody) will shoot better and it will thus be more fun. It's already drilled and tapped yes? Why is it even a question. If you are worried about the looks search around and see if you can find an older scope that still functions nice. Try it for a few range and hunting situations and if you don't like it take it off.

 

[kbuck]

I almost hate to admit this, but I put an Eotech on my Marlin 336. Is it the ugliest thing now in my safe? Yes. But it is the fastest to acquire a moving target of any sighting system I can think of. Easy to see circle and center dot. Both eyes open, faster than getting the bead on a shotgun to follow a bird.

 

[dogngun]

I tried Williams peep sights several years ago, and went back to the old style folding buckhorn rear sight from the factory. I could see it better and pick it up very fast.


mark

 

[Coop de Ville]

My issue is being able to focus on the front sight. I strain my eyes focusing on the front sight and my eye gets tired quickly... I'm not able to keep focus for any extended period of time.

Is this the common problem?

-Coop

 

[dmazur]

Yes, keeping the front sight "black" is the problem. (At least, reading about older shooters and NM Garands showed that to be true, and my experience agrees.)

The adjustable peep (like the Merit) offers a non-optical solution, and surprisingly works quite well with small aperture. There's a term for the optical effect of looking through a pinhole, but I can't remember it. The problem with this solution is, it only works when there is plenty of light.

Here's a link to the guy that makes optical inserts. As you can see, he will work with just about any peep sight, including tang sights, so you should be able to get a good solution for a lever-action rifle.

BJones sights