Kahr PM9 Range Report and Kahr Complaint

SAWBONES

New member
Had a chance to shoot my new Kahr PM9 briefly last week for the first time. I got it with factory-installed Meprolight Tru Dot night sights.

As usual, the Federal 9BP 115gr JHP (standard pressure) was the most accurate and precise of all loads tested.

In 300 rounds, there were no failures to feed, fire or extract.
The trigger is very good, IMNSHO, for a small CCW defense gun.
Like all Kahrs, it has a relatively long but smooth pull, and a correspondingly long reset, but these are not at all problematic to me in a defensive gun.
The standard magazine holds 6 rounds, and the extended floorplate mag (the gun comes with one of each) holds 7.
There were no functioning problems with the magazines.

This is also the first of four Kahrs I've owned that had the sights correctly regulated, that is, point of impact coinciing with point of aim. (Each of the others has required the rear sight to be drifted slightly left.)

Other rounds tried this first time out included only NATO surplus 124gr FMJ, Cor-Bon 124gr+P JHP, and Sellier & Bellot 115gr FMJ, so it's not a very broad sampling, and I'll have to try the Federal 9BPLE 115gr +P+ JHP, Pro Load 124gr +P JHP, and Remington Golden Saber 124gr +P JHP next time.
The tested rounds were all acceptably accurate, tested at 7 yards, that is, all were in the 1 1/2" bullseye, though the Federal 9BP made "one hole groups", while the others did not.

I don't own a chronograph, so can't comment on velocities.

Fit and finish are on par with my P9, that is, just fine. The slide is the standard matte stainless steel, with an even finish and no visible tool marks.
I don't think Kahr's polymer technology is quite up to Glock's yet, and rumor has it that the same outfit that makes Ruger's polymer frames also makes Kahr's, and they do look to be similar. Nonetheless, the frame has no defects, and hasn't broken, warped or changed fit in my brief exposure to it, and it makes the little dingus VERY lightweight to carry.
Compared to my Kahr MK9, it seems MUCH lighter in a pocket holster (Null and Action-Direct tried) or ankle rig (Null and Renegade tried), and even holding 7 rounds of 115gr 9mm JHP, it's lighter in the hand and in the pocket than my S&W J-frame Centennial 642 loaded with five rounds of Federal 158gr LSWCHP.

I like it.

Kahr is obviously having some QC problems lately, judging by my own experience* and that of others as posted on several gun-related Internet BBs, so take a critical look at gun fit and finish before you accept delivery on one of these little Moonie guns, but this particular model certainly fills a CCW niche for a lightweight "full power" (i.e, non-mousegun caliber) pistol well.
Best.

* I've sent a NIB Kahr MK9 Elite98 back to Kahr TWICE so far, for problems including stripped grip screw holes, ill-fitting grips, and a poor trigger, and each time I've had difficulty contacting Kahr and receiving the gun back in a reasonable time frame. I'm still waiting, currently at one month after the more recent send-back, two months the first time.
Nobody at Kahr will answer emails, and I've sent them to the "higher-ups" in the company as well as to the proletariat.
Long distance phone calls at my expense (six so far) result in being put on "hold" interminably, and often speaking to someone who eventually proves that they can't help, and who obviously speaks English as a second language (mentioned because they had difficulty understanding and communicating), as well as being told that "no one else was available" to help, and even when a return call from someone who CAN help is requested, I've only actually gotten a single call-back, with resultant promises but (so far) no results.

Kahr owes me (and every customer) better service in dealing with a repair-replacement issue for a gun with a MSRP of nearly $700!
They need to get their quality control and personnel problems fixed PRONTO if they expect to remain viable in today's marketplace, instead of adopting the "ignore 'em and they'll go away" approach.
Why have email contact information available if you won't respond to customers?
Why advertise a "lifetime warranty" if it takes multiple efforts and prolonged wait times on the part of customers to receive proper and satisfactory service?

Guess I'll add this missive, FWIW, to the long list of emails I've already sent to Kahr, and will be posting it on several other BBs as well. Any followup I get will be posted, as well.
 

Eric Larsen

New member
Its a bloody shame anyone has to put up with that..let alone from Kahr...maybe the rumors are true, it honestly seems QC and support are going out the window to an extent. Its a real downer for me...as a long time supporter of Kahr arms. In my experience the guns and service have been nothing but top notch all of the way. The older guns are the ones to get..I havent heard ANYTHING about the K/fullsize guns in the way of quality issues...maybe thats the way to go.
Shoot well
 

nthe10ring

New member
meassage to kahr

I have one of the PM9"s and in all fairness to the little gun, it shoots great, over 300 rounds through it without a glitch, but ever time i look at the frame to slide fit,and way it diverges from parallell, and tapers away from the fit it should i have, it just p@##@# me off.
I called Kahr on the 7th of this month, the day I got the gun and enquired as to what could be done. The tech was very nice, and stated that he had also noticed this problem on the few PM9's that he had seen, and evidently the problem lay in the pressing of the frames. When I enquired as to what would be done if and when they rectified the problem, for those of us who purchased the first release guns, he said that as long as it did not relate to safety, nothing.
This little gun is in the price range of a Sig, and you can bet your bippy that they would never realease a gun that fit this poorly. A gun should not only function but should have some modcum of fit and finish as well. After all we like em to look good also. If I wanted this type of fit i could have bought a much cheaper gun. My little Keltec P-32's slide to frame fit is far better than the Kahr. I have several polymer guns, glock 27, sig pro- h&k compact, and keltec P-32 all of these guns fit perfectly. Whats Kahrs problem? For a company that based its original release of guns on quality of fit and finish using CNC equipment, they have definately lost sight of their original claim to fame with the polymer guns. Its a damn shame to, this could really be a nice package, you could have it all, size , functiion, a good caliber, smooth trigger, and last but not least, fit and finish, however its going to take a lot more work in the FIT AND FINISH department.
Lets hope by the time they wise up and do something that their customer base has not departed to other manufacturers in search of someone that holds their product to a higher standard.
Jerry
 

22lovr

New member
Thanks for sharing.....

I was, at one time, considering a PM9 as my next full-time carry piece but because of the negative feedback on this forum, I have crossed Kahr off the list.......for a couple of reasons:

I guess I'm used to North American Arms and Kel-Tec customer service. It doesn't much matter to me how appealing, ideal, or popular the PM9 is; there are alternatives out there.

It seems as if there is a deterioration in quality control for such a pricey little gun. All of this is simply the perception I get lately from Kahr owners and yes, I have handled earlier model MK9's which were things of beauty, so I can't dismiss the entire Kahr line.

Oh well, there is still so many choices.
 

leftover

New member
Don't be fobbed off by Kahr. Cosmetic defects are as much a warranty issue as any other. The company advertises their products as the best quality you can buy at any price. If they fail to meet your reasonable expectations of their product, then you can sue them.

Don't forget that many so called 'cosmetic' defects may be indicitive of other underlying technical problems, and/or may develop into serious problems over time / use.

Unfortunately it's going to take several lawsuits before they realise this, so go right ahead and sue them - I will be if they don't meet my expectations soon (see other posts)
:mad: :mad:
 

SAWBONES

New member
Hi leftover;
I've read your posts about the problems you've had with your Kahrs, and although none of mine have had the frame casting imperfections that your photos so nicely showed, my experience in dealing with Kahr has mirrored yours almost exactly, that is, THEY IGNORE THE CUSTOMERS WHO HAVE COMPLAINTS!

What good is a so-called "lifetime warranty" when no one at Kahr provides satisfaction for customers' complaints, or at best takes several months to address a problem?

What are advertising claims of precision CNC maching worth when your $700 gun has crappy casting or crappy polishing or crappy fit?

"Teething pains" of a relatively-new business venture aside, they ought to REPLY TO CUSTOMERS' EMAILS and to REPAIR OR REPLACE DEFECTIVE GUNS PROMPTLY!

Otherwise their guarantees and claims of high quality count for NOTHING.
Essentially, they're LIES.

I'm still waiting for my repaired/replaced MK9, and/or for some response from the Kahr management to whom I've sent emails.

I really do wish the company well, and hope they become a thoroughly successful venture (a wish or attitude I hold toward all sidearm manufacturers in this country and all other free countries), but customer satisfaction has to be given a higher priority than is currently the case, and quality control will have to improve significantly from what is currently present, or Kahr's reputation (and eventually, sales) WILL suffer.

A good reputation for customer service is a valuable thing for a company to have.
Kahr doesn't have it.

Compared to Glock, Kimber, Springfield Armory, Ruger, Sig and even H&K (who is notorious for slow responsiveness to customers) or the traitorous and much-maligned S&W, Kahr's customer service currently falls far short.
Hopefully they will redeem themselves, but like you, I'm not optimistic.
Best.
 

leftover

New member
Well Sawbones, you'll probably be sent the MK9 that I first sent them several months ago - you'll just have to wait while they repair it :D

If anyone out there gets MK9 GC 1822, then it's a re-worked gun. Let's just hope they re-worked it well ! :rolleyes:
 
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