It's not loaded

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AzShooter

New member
While waiting for a lane to open at our local range I was sitting in the lounge. Three older gentlemen came in and were signing up to shoot. One takes his gun out of his holster to show his friend and ends up pointing it directly at me.

I yelled for him to put it away. His answer was " It's not loaded". I reminded him of the first rule : all guns are loaded. He laughed that off.

It wouldn't have surprised me as much if it were a new shooter but these three guys were in their 70s.

I apologized to the range staff for over stepping my bounds yelling for the guy to put the gun away and they told me everything is all right. I followed the rules even though they didn't catch it this time.
 
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deserted

New member
I was in a sporting goods store one day, down at the end of the gun counter eyeballing pistols. I felt a funny feeling on the side of my head and turned to see a guy looking through a scoped rifle right at me. I told him to not point that thing at me. He laughed and said "It's not loaded". I said, "Mine is loaded. You have about two seconds to consider that fact". He slunk out. The clerk tells me he has never seen that "customer" again.
 
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MrBorland

New member
AzShooter said:
It wouldn't have surprised me as much if it were a new shooter but these three guys were in their 70s.
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It seems like most of the safety violations I see are older guys "who've been doing like this for 30 years", and not very open to correction. The last one I saw argued with the range owner ("doin' it longer than you, etc"), and refused to change. Revoking his membership was the owner's only recourse, but doing so might save a life (and/or a lawsuit) in the long run.
 
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JWT

New member
I cannot agree with MrBorlands comments regarding most safety violations being mostly 'older guys'. While I have seen violations by the geriatric crowd, I've noticed even more by the younger, more inexperienced shooters at the range. Age has little to do with common sense and adherence to rules and regulations, except perhaps with minors IMO.
 
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g.willikers

New member
Reason to get training.
Sloppy gun handling is just the result of the lack of it.
Most folks seem happy just picking it up as they go along.
Not nearly good enough.
Real training cures sloppy gun handling, in addition to lots of other short comings.
 
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Aguila Blanca

Staff
Age is not the problem, arrogance (meaning an "I know all I need to know" attitude) is the problem, and that knows no age limits.

A couple of years ago the indoor range where I shoot instituted a requirement that ALL shooters must possess a pistol permit (my state requires an NRA Basic Pistol class as a prerequisite to the permit), or proof of having completed some formal handgun safety training class. For those who don't have it, the range offers a one-hour basic safety class.

They had a screw-up one day and four people (two couples) showed up for their scheduled (and pre-payed) safety class, and the regular instructor was nowhere to be found. I had just finished shooting and the owner knows I'm an NRA Basic Pistol instructor, so he asked me to do the class rather than send four new customers away mad. I agreed.

The two guys were recent veterans. It was obvious throughout the classroom portion that they were bored and weren't paying attention. The ladies, on the other hand, DID pay attention, and it was clear even in that very truncated session that they were getting information their "highly-trained" significant others had never bothered to explain to them.

Then we went down to the range for some live fire. Not surprisingly, the girls shot MUCH better than the guys, and committed fewer safety blunders.
 
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K_Mac

New member
Age is not the problem, arrogance (meaning an "I know all I need to know" attitude) is the problem, and that knows no age limits.
Click to expand...

Ain't that the truth! Some of the most careless shooters I know think they have been around so long that they are somehow just a little above the rest of us regular folks. A friend I've known for years once lectured me on the dangers of appendix carry while carelessly pointng an "empty" revolver at me. We no longer shoot together, and our friendship isn't what it once was...
 
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Shimpy

New member
Just because he was older doesn't mean he's experienced. With the way today is with crime and terrorists he may have just come to the conclusion that he and only him will protect him.
 
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Gunplummer

New member
I worked around guns for quite a few years in the military. Lot of guys were shot with .45's. The amazing thing is most of the shooters just stood there and said "It wasn't loaded!"
 
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HiBC

New member
The four rules provide multiple layers of safety. Generally,the human fallibility of making just one mistake won't prove fatal. It takes two.
Such as 1) Its not loaded 2) Allowing the gun to point at another person.

I'm not trying to justify being sloppy or careless. That's not OK.

We all ought to be humble enough to accept that as humans,we are fallible.

Which is why we all have to look out for each other,and speak up. It should work to say a simple,courteous "Sir,your muzzle? "
The "Its not loaded"response is inexcusable. The appropriate action? Range officer explains to them why they are leaving immediately,no matter who they are.
If they plead "Lack of training" ,that can be remedied...off the range.

But if they knew better,and it was attitude,then 86 them.
 
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StrangeBird1911

New member
those most at risk

My surgeon's nurse was talking to me about table saw injuries. She said that they never see anyone new to using a table saw; only people who have enough experience that they were comfortable around the equipment.

So let's all act like we're beginners.
 
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2ndsojourn

New member
From deserted:
"He laughed and said "It's not loaded". I said, "Mine is loaded. You have about two seconds to consider that fact". "

I like that one, and will use it should the need occur. I don't know about the two seconds warning though.
 
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shootbrownelk

New member
I don't know if it's against the law to point a gun at someone (brandishing?) but I do know that doing so, even with an unloaded gun could prove fatal.
 
4

44 AMP

Staff
In most of the world, (that I know of) pointing a gun at someone is considered an unfriendly act. In many places it is considered a criminal act.

Loaded OR NOT!

We often read about how the police shoot (and often kill) people who point guns at them (or what they believe is a gun).

The gunshop sniper wannabe would do well to consider that, and that a private armed citizen might also think their life was in danger.
 
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rjinga

New member
Two days ago, I was at a 100 yd outdoor range when two other shooters showed up. I got the impression that this was their first time at this particular facility (you know the way people look around at a place they're seeing for the first time). We exchanged a few pleasantries, set up our targets, and called the range "Hot."

Shortly thereafter we called the range "Cold" and guy #1 opened the gate and headed out to check his target. I was about to go onto the range too when I saw guy #2 walk over to the shooting table where both of their rifles were located. I politely told him that this facility required all the shooters to stay back behind the big yellow line painted on the floor whenever any other shooters were out on the range. He appeared to be very embarrassed, apologized, and hurried over to the bench behind the yellow line.

When I came back off of the range, I went over to both guys and explained to them that the reason I was so familiar with that particular rule was because the range officer had come over the PA system to admonish me for violating it on my first visit.
 
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Shimpy

New member
My dad taught me that there is no such thing as a "unloaded" gun. Treat all guns as if they are loaded and you will train yourself to never make a mistake of pointing a loaded gun at someone.
 
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Pahoo

New member
The Muzzle has the last word !!!

In our training class, we have a scenario where we hold up a firearm and ask the students if they think it's loaded or unloaded? You get mixed replies or none at all. Some feel that just because they are in a classroom, we surely would no have a loaded firearm. Then we ask them the same question after giving them, our word that it is not loaded. "Most" will agree because as an instructor I surely would not lie. ...... :rolleyes:

By the end, they all agree that it's loaded until it's cleared and finically proven so to each and everyone. .... :)

Be Safe !!!
 
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locnload

New member
When I first came to Colorado in the late 70s, I had to go through a "Hunters Safety Course" as my home state did not have that law. We had a great instructor, and he made a point of telling the class that when you hand someone a gun you should open the action showing it clear, and the person taking it should be sure that is done before accepting it, and also closely inspect it and insure it is clear once they have it. A little later in the evening, he handed a 22 bolt action rifle to a teenage kid, and as he reached out to take it, the instructor pulled the trigger and set off a blank cartridge. It really burned into everybody's mind what he had said, especially the teenagers.
 
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