Interesting...The 1911 Is Its Own Tool Box

Joe_Pike

New member
I ran across this quite some time ago but looked it up again a few days ago while talking with someone about 1911s without barrel bushings. In the guns original configuration I guess it is possible to do a complete disassembly without using any tools other than its own parts and a cartridge.

http://www.sightm1911.com/lib/tech/toolbox.htm
 

Rangerrich99

New member
Yeah, this is the principle reason I can't buy a bushing-less 1911. I was taught at a very early age that 1911s are meant to be a tool-less gun, meaning no tools required to disassemble it. Needing a paper clip just to get the slide off is basically heresy in my little universe.

I have shot a few bushing-less 1911s in both .45 auto and 9mm, and they are nice, but I can't talk myself into owning one.
 

tony pasley

New member
Their will be many false teacher saying that they are followers of Saint John M. Browning. They try to lead the faithful away by perverting the true way.
 

1911_Hardball

New member
Their will be many false teacher saying that they are followers of Saint John M. Browning. They try to lead the faithful away by perverting the true way.
Genesis 19-11


1. In the beginning there was the 1911, and it was good. And behold the Lord said, thou shalt not muck with my disciple John's design for it is good and it workith. For John made the 1911, and lo all of his weapons, from the designs which I, the Lord, gave him upon the mountain.

2. And shouldst thou muck with it, and hang all manner of foul implements upon it, and profane its internal parts, thou shalt surely have malfunctions, and in the midst of battle thou shalt surely come to harm.

3. And as the ages passed men in their ignorance and arrogance didst forget the word of the Lord and began to profane the 1911. The tribe of the gamesman did place recoil spring guides and extended slide releases upon the 1911 and their metal smiths didst tighten the tolerances and alter parts to their liking, their clearness of mind being clouded by lust.

4. Their artisans did hang all manner of foul implements upon the 1911 and did so alter it that it became impractical to purchase. For lo, the artisans didst charge a great tax upon the purchasers of the 1911 so that the lowly field worker could not afford one. And the profaning of the internal parts didst render it unworkable when the dust of the land fell upon it.

5. And lo, they didst install adjustable sights, which are an abomination unto the Lord. For they doth break and lose their zero when thou dost need true aim. And those who have done so will be slain in great numbers by their enemies in the great battle.

6. And it came to pass that the Lord didst see the abomination wrought by man and didst cause, as he had warned, fearful malfunctions to come upon the abominations and upon the artisans who thought they could do no wrong.

7. Seeing the malfunctions and the confusion of men, the lord of the underworld did see an opportunity to further ensnare man and didst bring forth pistols made of plastic, whose form was such that they looked and felt like a brick, yet the eyes of man being clouded, they were consumed by the plastic pistol and did buy vast quantities of them.

8. And being a deceitful spirit the lord of the underworld did make these plastic pistols unamenable to the artisans of earth and they were unable to muck much with the design, and lo these pistols did appear to function.

9. And the evil one also brought forth pistols in which the trigger didst both cock and fire them and which require a "dingus" to make them appear safe.

10. But man being stupid did not understand these new pistols and didst proceed to shoot themselves with the plastic pistol and with the trigger cocking pistols for lo their manual of arms required great intelligence which man had long since forsaken. Yet man continue to gloat over these new pistols blaming evil forces for the negligent discharges which they themselves had committed.

11. And when man had been totally ensnared with the plastic pistol, the lord of the underworld didst cause a plague of the terrible Ka-Boom to descend upon man and the plastic pistols delivered their retribution upon men. And there was a great wailing and gnashing of teeth in the land.

12. Then seeing that the eyes of man were slowly being opened and that man was truly sorrowful for his sinful misdeeds, the Lord did send his messengers in the form of artisans who did hear and obey
the teachings of the prophet and who didst restore the profaned 1911s to their proper configuration, and lo, to the amazement of men they didst begin to work as the prophet had intended.

13. And the men of the land didst drive out the charlatans and profaners from the land, and there was joy and peace in the land, except for the evil sprits which tried occasionally to prey on the men and women of the land and who were sent to the place of eternal damnation by the followers of John.
 

James K

Member In Memoriam
FWIW, it is not the sear spring segment with the little tip that is used to remove the magazine catch lock, it is the spring segment from the other side which is used for that purpose.

Jim

P.S. I suggest that those who believe the 1911 was solely the product of JMB's genius, look at the records and see how much was "suggested" (demanded) by those junior officers who did, after all, know a bit more than JMB about how military pistols were actually used, who suggested many of the changes, including a pistol that could be disassembled using only its own parts for tools. Browning, don't forget, had submitted the earlier double link guns (which needed a shop to disassemble) and thought they were perfect.

JK
 

bbqncigars

New member
That's all well and fine, but JMB still is still the designer for those changes. Suggestions are not implementations. The Master designed the actual gun. It's easy to say I think that it should work THIS way. It's a lot harder to actually make it work that way.
 

vba

New member
If the bushing is not tightly fit it is easy to take a 1911 apart without tools. I know because I've done it many times.
 

44 AMP

Staff
In the guns original configuration I guess it is possible to do a complete disassembly without using any tools other than its own parts and a cartridge.

it's not a guess, its a fact.

What?? does not EVERYONE know this???? :D:rolleyes:

I read the linked article, and I disagree with a couple points, and the Author left out a couple things,.

For one thing, I use the firing pin as the punch, not the hammer strut.
If you check, you will see that the dimpled (concave) end of the Mainspring housing pin is a PERFECT fit for the tip of the firing pin.

Another is that any man who can remove the safety BEFORE removing the mainspring housing is a better man that I.

And, to remove the magazine catch, using the sear spring, the catch MUST be depressed (and held), and the "screw" in the catch only turns 1/4 turn, (its not threaded)

The way I was taught to do it, complete disassembly of the 1911/1911A1 requires one "tool". That tool is anything that can be used to depress the firing pin so the firing pin stop can be removed.

A pencil, a rifle bullet/cartridge, the stiffened end of a bootlace, a twig, the tongue of about any buckle, a splinter of wood, a toothpick, the fork in your mess kit, anything that fits, and odds are really high that a soldier will have access to SOMETHING that will work.

After you get the firing pin out, you can detail strip the gun using only its parts for tools.

Do you know any other pistols that can do this???
I don't.
 

amd6547

New member
Glock offer similar tool-less disassembly. As an old 1911 guy, it's one of the things that endear them to me.
 

SIGSHR

New member
The Browning High Power disassembles without tools, and I always found a magazine worked fine to loosen the bushing on a 1911.
 

SA1911

Moderator
The 1911-A1 is an amazing handgun. I've mounted Alexa to mine. It makes coffee in the morning, gets my breakfast started, does Roomba, then we go shooting.
 

RickB

New member
When I was at SHOT some years ago, a guy had a display of 1911 grips that were modified to contain an allen key, and it could accessed without first removing the grips.
After digesting how silly it was to modify the grips to contain a tool that you wouldn't need at all if you just left all the slotted parts alone, it got me thinking about modifying the grip panels to contain parts that you might lose while working on the gun - firing pin stop, firing pin/spring, mag release lock and spring, hammer and sear pins, etc. - all of which could be stored in recesses cut in the back of the grip panels.
Then, the gun would not only be its own toolbox, but its own parts kit.
 

batmann

New member
I like the 1911 style, but I have never had one that would run all types of ammo.
Mine was a Colt which at the time, was the best out there.
I haven't tried the NEW and IMPROVED versions that run into the thousands of dollars, but they certainly look nice.
I am always reminded of something I heard long ago, 'A 1911 is something you show your friends, a Glock is something you show to your enimies'.
I will keep my plastic block thank you. I have a Glock 22 (.40 S&W) that has well over 2500 rounds through it and it has yet to have a malfunction even though I seldom clean. It is embarrassingly reliable.
I'm not trying to troll, just my thoughts and opinion.
 

RickB

New member
I've never owned a Glock, but better, I've seen dozens of them in the hands of others at UPSPA and IDPA matches over a twenty year period.
If my 1911 ran like others' Glocks, I wouldn't be a 1911 fan, either.
 

44 AMP

Staff
I always found a magazine worked fine to loosen the bushing on a 1911.

I forgot to mention that, because I normally just use my fingers, but yes, the curve of the magazine baseplate matches the curve of the barrel bushing. Another coincidence? I think not...
 
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