I feel so violated......

[iso1]

Not to mention extremely PO'd.

I decided to download Webshots, and use a few of the great Mr. Oleg Volk's graphics as a rotating screen saver.

When I came in to work today, I was called on the carpet by my boss, and he reamed me a new one.

Seems some of the liberal pansy bedwetters here saw it, and made a fuss. Exactly what I intended to happen.....

The boss had already removed the screen saver, and I am now under penalty of being fired for any such repeat offenses.

There is nothing in the client company policy about this, and nothing in my employers policy. I believe that my Right to Free Expression has been seriously violated....and if I do get fired........

 

[echo3mike]

Sounds like a violation of your First Ammendment rights. Might make a good case for some hot-shot legal beagle, if you decide to go that route. Besides, why are your co-workers looking into YOUR cubicle anyway???

 

[Justin]

Bear in mind that this may not fall under the 1AM because it happened on private property. Since it's not the .gov telling you what to do, it's not really censorship.
Or at least that's the way I understand it.
However, if you feel as if you have been somehow, oh, mentally damaged, I'm sure that there's a lawyer out there who'd be happy to pursue further.
A disclaimer, I'm not a lawyer, no where near one, and I don't even watch the ones on TV, so I could be totally wrong.

 

[CITADELGRAD87]

Well, I AM a Lawyer

I specialize in employment disputes, and politically agree with you.

However, put yourself in the employer's shoes for an instant.

"Whackos" shooting up the place are a manager's nightmare, while ignoring ANY alleged "warning signs" would leave them open to $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ lawsuits in this second guessing for dollars society we have created.

Caliban is correct, your first amendment rights can be curtailed on private property, on a company computer. Ever read about guys getting canned for computer porn at work?

Lastly, if you live in an "employment at will" state, as I do, you can be fired for any reason or no reason, as long as the reason is not illegal. This one, IMHO, would not be illegal.

If you do get sacked, do yourself a favor and delete this thread. Planning to get yourself in trouble to prove a point will NOT garner sympathy from a jury.

If you are going to try to salvage this job, in a non confrontational manner, approach your boss and ask for a clarification of the policy. Point out that you feel it's unclear, and that you did not intend to convey any threat. DON'T do it an a know it all way. Talk to him about Oleg's work, and the emphasis on SELF defense, not harming others.

THIS IS NOT LEGAL ADVICE. I DO NOT KNOW YOUR PARTICULAR CIRCUMSTANCES.

[Edited by CITADELGRAD87 on 04-10-2001 at 05:04 PM]

 

[Horny Toad]

It isn't your stuff

iso1,

I hear what your saying, and I feel for you, but legally, you are probably on pretty weak ground. It isn't your computer. It belongs to the company you work for. As an email and network administrator, I have to deal with situations like this occasionally. I'm no lawyer, but "your" computer is company property, along with every bit of data stored on it. Even email that you send from "your" PC belongs to your company. There should never be any expectation of privacy when using company equipment. Does that stink? Yep, but I'm willing to bet that if you push the issue, you may find yourself in deep doo-doo.


Horny Toad

 

[AUTiger73]

iso1: Right or wrong, everyone has to answer to someone above them. Even though your Personnel Policies & Procedures doesn't specifically prohibit such things, the employer still carries a big stick. Let's face it: LIFE AIN'T FAIR.

Due to the recent demise of my boss I received a BIG promotion. Now I have authority over 7 coordinators and 60 employees, but must report to the Board of Directors. Instead of one boss, I now have many and some UNPOPULAR EMPLOYMENT RULES to enforce.

Many years ago the Board thought a "weapons free work place policy" would be a good idea. To my own detriment I spoke openly against that policy. Ironically I am now charged with enforcing that rule. Now what?

Well I have an unwritten policy pertaining to guns in the workplace: "DON'T SHOW,DON'T TELL, WHAT THE HELL?" If you going to pack your piece keep it to yourself.

Looking around I notice a number of suspicious "bulges" on some of my employees, some of which appear larger than the NAA Mini Magnum Revolver that I packing in my right hand pocket, - All the more reason for people to treat each other with mutual respect.

As to "free speech" issues, screen savers, etc., I personally like people that "speak their mind" - but in the real world that is beyond my control, freedom of speech is imagined, as is our other Constitutional rights. It seems that everything we say or do can be to our detriment.

Keep a low profile and BEST OF LUCK!

 

[Jeff OTMG]

What CITADEL said. I had a problem with my current client blocking internet access to the gun sites here at work. Before saying anything I researched the corporate internet use policy. This is what I found:

"The XXXXXX systems may not be used for illegal activities or for any purposes contrary to the policies or best interests of XXXXXX. No use shall contain profanity, vulgarity, sexual content or character slurs. No use shall make rude or hostile reference to race, age, gender, sexual orientation, religious or political beliefs, national origin, health or disability. Abusive behaviors are also not permitted. Abusive behavior includes the utilization of XXXXXX's information systems to harass others in some way, for instance, sending computer mail that is abusive, obscene, threatening or a nuisance."

My position was that I was not conducting an 'illegal activity' nor was anything 'contrary to the policies' of the company. HOWEVER, the internet use standard SOFTWARE was implying a 'character slur' (by blocking guns and porn) and I considered the prohibition 'rude' and a 'hostile reference' (due to the fact that the babysitter software had ALL firearm related sites grouped under the Violence category) to my 'political beliefs'. The software was 'harassing' to me and was a 'nuisance'. On my third day I approached the network guy to discuss the problem and file a complaint. It was forwarded to the legal department with three choices:
1) Remove the babysitter software that was in violation of corporate policy.
2) Fix babysitter software to allow access to gun related sites.
3) I leave.
I was allowed to contact SurfWatch (babysitter software company) and told the content director that their software was in violation of our corporate policy. They had already received numerous complaints and were in the process of placing guns in a category separate from violence. That solved my problem. Check your employee manual, if you did not violate corporate policy, as CITADELGRAD87 suggests, discuss the problem with your boss. Have him explain the situation to the freak that what you are doing is not in anyway illegal nor is it in violation of corporate policy. If he won't do that ask them to update the employee manual to include your situation. There is a restriction at many facilities that completely prohibit the introduction of non-company software onto any computer hooked to the network. That would include your screen saver. If this doesn't work and you are being singled out and treated differently contact your local labor board, they may have a mediation and arbitration group available to you. If there is a stringent computer use policy you can always leave copies of Combat Handguns on your desk or put up a Colt LE poster showing a SWAT team about to do an entry while holding M-4's. Just check policy before you do this, don't want to break any rules, but you can't have companies violating your political beliefs either.

 

[Oleg Volk]

Citadelgrad is right.

Their company, their rules. Some rules we must break but consider cost/benefit ratio first. You can always draw people out one by one and talk to them elsewhere and elsewhen. I know that sucks but that's also reality and arguing with it won't get you far.

Thanks for spreading the images around, though. Although I no longer show any evidence of my photos at work, enough people asked me to be on the list for updates as they come up and I have taken co-workers to the range. Could teach them the basics with an air gun as a hobby, then sneak in political significance.

 

[JimDiver]

Excuse the typos.. I have a hurt paw...

I am not a lawyer and I don't play one on TV.

I had a similar problem with CheckPoint's Net Nanny. It seems that all, if not most, of the nanny software groups firearms as violent content. I talked to MIS and got the majority of them re-classified and have no problems now...

I work with a few liberal ninnies and they have tried to complain (anon) to management about my firearm related shirts, reading material, and the like. I solved it by making it perfectly clear that anon complaints are baseless and have no substance if the offended person does not have the balls to bring the problem to me first... After all we deserve to discuss it first.

(Some twit actualy got upset that I set up a voter registration card stand... Told him where to stick his complaint too... After all, it's providing a service IMHO.)

It's too bad if they do not like your views. But part of living in the US means you have to be able to stomach things you disagree with (to some extent). To many, being part of the "gun culture" is part of who you are. It's the like belonging to a religion, or being overweight, or the like. It's not something you can easily change.

Make it clear the person took it totaly out of context and made a frivilous accusation. If they complained about your use of the 1st, and did not bother to give you the common courtoseyt of bringing the problem to you first, then what are they going to complain about next? That someone's cross necklace offends them? or someone's yarmulke or turbin (sp?) is offensive?

Suggest to the boss that someone who is so intollerant of your views and expressions is a potential liability. After all, who's to say your boss is not the next person who might offend the person in question?

I will shut up now.. I am rambling.......

 

[Hal]

I think everyone is ovelooking a very important point here. According to iso1's post this isn't at his place of employment, but at a third party site. That makes it a whole different ballgame.

There is nothing in the client company policy about this, and nothing in my employers policy.

Seems some of the liberal pansy bedwetters here saw it, and made a fuss. Exactly what I intended to happen.....

Issues aside, sorry bud if you were an employee of mine, and you purposly set out to annoy a customer, you'd be history. I doubt if any court would find sympathy with your cause in that light, and in fact just the opposite might happen. Your employer might have grounds to go after you for costing him business. We ran into a similar situation at a customer site over their no smoking policy and 3 of our engineers. Final verdict was our 3 engineers were ordered off site, even though they complied with the no smoking policy. When you do contract work, you're at the whim of the customer. Right or wrong.

 

[ArmySon]

Last year, I finally got fed up with having gun sites blocked. So, I went to the department manager and complained. Frankly, I told him that firearms do not fit into the category of "abusive, vulgar, threatening, illegal" (pointing out the company policies). He tried to blow it off by saying there's nothing he can do since it's corporate policy.

Well, that answer didn't satisfy me so I gave him the same options as Jeff, have the policy changed, get me in contact with the worldwide MIS security director or I leave.

Now, since I'm the only individual in my group that programs Visual Basic, AS/400, C++ and Novell certified in addition to being the only one that knows a thing about our local database, it gave me some leverage.

To make a long story short, I ended up talking to the MIS security director and got the situation rectified.

THEN, one day I was surfing through Wilson Combat's web site when some shmuck a couple of cubes down must've walked by. He had the audacity to walk into my cube and give me an earful and said he was going to see the manager.

The situation was resolved quite easily. I told him that if he's offended by me viewing and reading firearms related material, I would be vocal about his offensive gong music and Buddhist tapes that he plays. Since employees are not to 'push' their religions upon others, he knew that he was violating company policy. Personally, I could careless if he worshipped King Tut or Barbie Dolls. It was just my example of him pushing his personal opinions upon others.

Afterwards, he left and I never heard a peep from him. In the following months, the sound from his cube was lowered by quite a bit.

I'm not saying that you should go make a demand. I don't know your situation or job skills. Just think things over carefully before you jump the gun. Scuse the pun.

 

[Oleg Volk]

Choose your fights very carefully.

 

[EricM]

Sounds like a violation of your First Ammendment rights. Might make a good case for some hot-shot legal beagle, if you decide to go that route. Besides, why are your co-workers looking into YOUR cubicle anyway???

No first amendment protection on private property. To the original poster, you got what you expected, so why are you complaining?

To ArmySon: I'm surprised you are allowed to do non-work related surfing at work.

 

[RHarris]

You don't have certain "rights" in the work place on their time and using their computers. That doesn't mean we all agree with that idea. I do wonder how the company treat a similar situation involving anti-gun material. They should at least be consistent.

 

[Cougar]

Computers at work

Where I work, the employee has no 'rights' with his issued computer. That's right. The computer is the company's property and they have the right to restrict the software stored in it. Since our computers are also hooked up to a rather large network, the Computer Information Service Department (Computer geeks) perform 'housecleaning' duties every so often and delete any unauthorized programs or software from the system. No screen savers allowed. No personal photos as wallpaper. Internet access is monitored by our security department (your internet 'history trail' is copied to Security). All games are prohibited. Violations of policy gets the employee a warning. Repeated violations gets your computer priveleges revoked (network passcode is revoked). No computer access, no work gets done...no work gets done, you're fired! Actually, your immediate supervisor may log you on and closely monitor your computer usage. Screw up again and you're history.

 

[iso1]

Yes, I intended to make people fuss. I dind't expect censorship.....although I suppose I should have.

There is no nanny software on the computer. I can access any site. Although, they do monitor the traffic.

After all, if people are allowed to (and do) put up pictures of their kids, or put up cartoons that insult politicians, or have a screensaver that scrolls John 3:16, or other such expressions, I should be able to express myself as well......

 

[Ironbarr]

iso1 - use the Elian Gonzales photo - that should be "useful".

Son - "testing" is the name of the game, right? Gotta keep ALL things working.

 

[houndawg]

If people worked when they were at work, there would be no problems. I wish I had a job where I could surf during work time.