I don't get carbines?
- Thread starter EnoughGUN
- Start date
stagpanther
New member
Gives people something to argue about on forums.
A handgun round in a carbine barrel typically gets a boost in velocity & terminal energy.
It also increases the practical shooting range of the caliber beyond a handgun (greater likelihood of a hit farther out).
It also makes a good companion to a handgun in the same caliber.
For situations where a 7mm Mag is not needed, it can offer good range without overkill.
I have 16-inch carbines in .357 & .44 Mag.
Both are 100-yard guns (more, if I wanted to push) perfectly suitable for deer, hogs, bear defense, and so on.
Both are very handy to carry, lighter than full-length rifles.
The concept appears quite understandable to me.
Denis
It also increases the practical shooting range of the caliber beyond a handgun (greater likelihood of a hit farther out).
It also makes a good companion to a handgun in the same caliber.
For situations where a 7mm Mag is not needed, it can offer good range without overkill.
I have 16-inch carbines in .357 & .44 Mag.
Both are 100-yard guns (more, if I wanted to push) perfectly suitable for deer, hogs, bear defense, and so on.
Both are very handy to carry, lighter than full-length rifles.
The concept appears quite understandable to me.
Denis
A carbine is a short rifle. Caliber is irrelevant.
Not all carbines are in pistol calibers.
Pistol caliber carbines can be fired at indoor shooting ranges.
Pistol caliber carbines have enough stopping power for many. A 9mm carbine can reach .357 mag velocities. That's nothing to sneeze at.
.22 lr shortages are still in full force in many parts of the country. A 9mm carbine is a reasonable substitute.
Some people like ammo and even magazine compatability between their pistol and carbine.
Not all carbines are in pistol calibers.
Pistol caliber carbines can be fired at indoor shooting ranges.
Pistol caliber carbines have enough stopping power for many. A 9mm carbine can reach .357 mag velocities. That's nothing to sneeze at.
.22 lr shortages are still in full force in many parts of the country. A 9mm carbine is a reasonable substitute.
Some people like ammo and even magazine compatability between their pistol and carbine.
I get .357/44 mag versions, that seems reasonable. I was thinking more about the more military style ones in 9mm/45 non magnum pistol rounds. Looking at a ballistic chart the velocity gain between a 5 inch and 18 inch barrel is 100-200fps on a 9mm. That seems insignificant.
Having a companion to your pistol that has better range and the same ammo I can see but at that velocity gain not much more range and using the same mags is nice but is diff ammo that big a concern? Plus you could just get a rifle almost identical but firing a rifle round with even greater power and range.
those are some good points though guys, I guess it depends alot on personal needs and what aspects are more important to you.
Having a companion to your pistol that has better range and the same ammo I can see but at that velocity gain not much more range and using the same mags is nice but is diff ammo that big a concern? Plus you could just get a rifle almost identical but firing a rifle round with even greater power and range.
those are some good points though guys, I guess it depends alot on personal needs and what aspects are more important to you.
Last edited:
A lady friend of mine has a Beretta CX4 storm for a house gun. She's not really a gun person, is not going to practice enough to be competent with a handgun and doesn't want to deal with the recoil of a shotgun. 13 rounds of 9mm in a short, easy to use package makes sense to me.
tahunua001
New member
well lets see here.
1. you have less noise, means less hearing loss long term if you're using in the field with no hearing protection on.
2. less recoil, means faster followup shots and less rubbing your shoulder the next day.
3. ammo weighs less, can pack more with you.
4. greater challenge if you're into hunting.
5. ammo is easier to come by.
6. ammo is cheaper.
7. people tend to practice more when they have readily available and affordable ammo so people tend to be better practiced with a pistol cal carbine.
those are all off the top of my head.
looking at the insignificant increases in velocity in a pistol over a rifle, here's just a little food for thought. out of a 9mm pistol, a person could get a 147GR bullt travelling just at about 1000 FPS, so if a person were able to get an extra 200 FPS out of that cartridge that is an increase in velocity of 20%. since velocity has never killed anything ever, calculating velocity does nothing to show performance. so lets look at ftlbs in energy. at 1000FPS a 147GR projectile generates about 365FTlbs of energy at the muzzle. increasing to 1200FPS generates 470 FTLBs of energy, a very noticeable increase in the pressures created, allowing for greater penetration and expansion.
1. you have less noise, means less hearing loss long term if you're using in the field with no hearing protection on.
2. less recoil, means faster followup shots and less rubbing your shoulder the next day.
3. ammo weighs less, can pack more with you.
4. greater challenge if you're into hunting.
5. ammo is easier to come by.
6. ammo is cheaper.
7. people tend to practice more when they have readily available and affordable ammo so people tend to be better practiced with a pistol cal carbine.
those are all off the top of my head.
looking at the insignificant increases in velocity in a pistol over a rifle, here's just a little food for thought. out of a 9mm pistol, a person could get a 147GR bullt travelling just at about 1000 FPS, so if a person were able to get an extra 200 FPS out of that cartridge that is an increase in velocity of 20%. since velocity has never killed anything ever, calculating velocity does nothing to show performance. so lets look at ftlbs in energy. at 1000FPS a 147GR projectile generates about 365FTlbs of energy at the muzzle. increasing to 1200FPS generates 470 FTLBs of energy, a very noticeable increase in the pressures created, allowing for greater penetration and expansion.
Last edited:
Absolutely. How much range do you really want?
For self defense, even a shotgun offers more range than you will likely need (or be able to justify in a court of law).
Pistol ammo is generally cheaper than rifle ammo. We are very lucky right now that rifle ammo has dropped as much in price as it has.
I'm assembling a Beretta Storm 9mm carbine project now.
Light, short, compact, extremely maneuverable with either hand if the other's incapacitated, good onboard capacity boosted by a 2-mag stock pouch, optic sight easily makes it a hundred-yard shooter IF it has to go that far.
More realistic at 50-75 yards, with much improved odds of a defensive strike at that distance than a handgun.
9mm ammo in my chronographing has gained up to 200 FPS with some loads, which is nothing to disparage.
Excellent grab & go for car gun.
Denis
Light, short, compact, extremely maneuverable with either hand if the other's incapacitated, good onboard capacity boosted by a 2-mag stock pouch, optic sight easily makes it a hundred-yard shooter IF it has to go that far.
More realistic at 50-75 yards, with much improved odds of a defensive strike at that distance than a handgun.
9mm ammo in my chronographing has gained up to 200 FPS with some loads, which is nothing to disparage.
Excellent grab & go for car gun.
Denis
Last edited:
armoredman
New member
Scorpion, not QUITE carbine.
Velocity of various handloads and factory loads chrono out to be a minimum of 100 FPS faster in the 7.5 inch barrel. I find it easy to use and more accurate than my pistols, plus, as used for HD, it comes with that 30 round magazine...and while I hope I never need round number one, I have to say if I need round number 30, I want it to be there. When I get up in the middle of the night, I am not wearing spare magazines on my PJs. Plus it is darn fun.
This is a carbine, BREN 805 carbine, 5.56mm. Absolute joy to shoot, gonna be a coyote slayer when I get the load dialed in and the time to go 'yote bustin'.
Velocity of various handloads and factory loads chrono out to be a minimum of 100 FPS faster in the 7.5 inch barrel. I find it easy to use and more accurate than my pistols, plus, as used for HD, it comes with that 30 round magazine...and while I hope I never need round number one, I have to say if I need round number 30, I want it to be there. When I get up in the middle of the night, I am not wearing spare magazines on my PJs.
Plus it is darn fun. This is a carbine, BREN 805 carbine, 5.56mm. Absolute joy to shoot, gonna be a coyote slayer when I get the load dialed in and the time to go 'yote bustin'.
It is insignificant. There is a reason why pistol caliber carbines have all but disappeared from use by the military and LE. They still have a following among some as range toys or in some cases for home defense. But most professionals who actually use a gun agree with you. As a hunting option the 357 and 44 magnums do see enough of a gain from longer barrels to actually be of some use.
The carbine length AR's in 223 and other calibers have all but taken over for this use.
stagpanther
New member
I did a 9 x 25 glock conversion with a lone wolf 8.5" cut/crowned barrel--should be able to drive a barnes 90 gr 9mm bullet at 2000 fps--I could see a handy little carbine being effective--especially since it has a slight shoulder you can headspace off of.
Seems most points either way are presented here. For me, it's a fun factor. Maybe I would use a pistol caliber carbine in self defense. Doubt I will use one in war time, unless it is 'civil'. Hunting with one is rare unless a varmint happens to come by. But when you go to the range, the pistol cal. carbine always turns out to be the most fun.
Casting your own bullets is also a factor since you don't wince so much throwing 200 rounds.
Casting your own bullets is also a factor since you don't wince so much throwing 200 rounds.
Jayhawkhuntclub
New member
If you don't get pistol caliber carbines, you must not get 22LR rifles either.
I have an AR9. Since I pour my own I can shoot it for about half of what a box of 22LR goes for now days. It's the most fun gun I own. If feels like an AR, but with less noise and cost. And I can shoot it at the pistol range.
I have an AR9. Since I pour my own I can shoot it for about half of what a box of 22LR goes for now days. It's the most fun gun I own. If feels like an AR, but with less noise and cost. And I can shoot it at the pistol range.
turtlehead
New member
Never thought about .22lr like that. But you're right.
I collect pistol caliber carbines. This same thread has come up from time to time.
My reason is that they are cheep to shoot and a lot of fun.
Inside of 100 yards most of what I have are accurate and like the Kriss easy to put one on a target at 100 yards with a red dot. For defense under 100 yards I would take my Kriss over my AR any day.
armoredman
That scorpion is it an SBR? I like it!
My reason is that they are cheep to shoot and a lot of fun.
Inside of 100 yards most of what I have are accurate and like the Kriss easy to put one on a target at 100 yards with a red dot. For defense under 100 yards I would take my Kriss over my AR any day.
armoredman
That scorpion is it an SBR? I like it!
Last edited:
armoredman
New member
Nope - it's a pistol still. That's the Thordsen's Cheek Rest kit, works very well.