How to make the 442 easy on the hands?

[Mastrogiacomo]

I have a S&W model 442 which I don't use at all since my first time out with it. I was blown away by how painful it was to use and how difficult it was to pull the trigger. I had a real time trying to keep the gun pointing straight each time. I've been tempted to get rid of it but it'd probably make a great back up gun. I got rid of the hard plastic grip and switched to a rubber one which I'm hoping will help. I'm considering having a gunsmith do something to the trigger so I don't have to go into weight training to pull the double action trigger. What modifications do you recommend? Any advice would be helpful. Thanks in advance.

 

[Litlman]

Check out the search function. Most info. states that you should stage the triger pull . I have found that I need to practice alot with the 442.




Litlman..................

 

[sox]

Mastro, there are alot of posts on this very topic. But, I feel your pain. I had a 342 PD Titanium once. Some things you can do:
Install a Wolff reduced power hammer spring-easy and cheap, this made a big difference for me. A grip that covers the backstrap, there is a 3 fingergroove grip from www.cdnninvestments.com for the J frame for 3.99. This is my all time favorite grip as it gives a better reach for your trigger finger, is slim actually, and covers the backstrap which helps to attenuate the recoil. Use USA .38 special 130gr loads, these are pretty mild and very tolerable. I think these 3 things will help out in a major way, and the grips and spring shouldn't set you back more than 15.00! Don't give up, good luck.

 

[Mike Irwin]

As for the grips, get a set of full-size Hogues, not the boot grips.

 

[Kentucky Rifle]

I have always wondered how different the recoil would be from a 15 ounce 442/642 and a 20 ounce all-steel model 36. Would five ounces less make such a difference with a .38 Special? Would someone who has fired both extensively give me their opinion please?

Thanks,
KR

 

[MikeJ]

Kentucky Rifle

I have shot a 36 extensively as well as a 37 airweight and there is a considerable difference in recoil. My 36 was a 3" version and I don't know if that made much of a difference or not. I now have a 640 (23oz.) and that is a joy to shoot compared to the 37. I generally shot standard pressure .38's through the 36 and 37 but keep the 640 loaded with +P's. One of the big advantages of the Centennial series is that you can get a higher grip hold than you can with the other models. I find this to really help control recoil and increase accuracy. The "trick" to shooting any of the J frames, in my opinion, is to have a very firm hold, as the recoil is fairly unforgiving if you don't. Happy Holidays, Mike

 

[Chris W]

Mastro,
The grip that works the comfort magic for me is the Pachmayr Compac (not the Compac Pro, just the regular Compac, which covers the backstrap).

Upsides: bigger, so it increases the trigger reach and puts a more natural part of the finger on the trigger; heavier, so it tames a little of the recoil (adds two or so ounces, which gives even more of an effect on my 12 oz. 340); fatter, so it spreads the recoil over a larger part of your hand.

Downsides: bigger, heavier, fatter--so I consider it useful only for play at the range or maybe a situation when I'm carrying in some mode other than pocket carry, which is almost never. Still, I'm glad to have a pair to use when I want to shoot .357s.

Cw

 

[Kentucky Rifle]

MikeJ...

Thank you. (I apologize for kinda "hijacking" the thread. It was rude.)
Well, I've gotta watch recoil a bit these days. Arthritis is a bit##. I think I'll just stick to my 20 ounce, all-steel J-frame. The ammunition I like best for defense is RBCD, and RBCD is loaded to standard pressures. My favoirte old J-frame should like those just fine!
I really didn't consider what those five less ounces would mean.

KR

 

[Mastrogiacomo]

@ Kentucky

I'm not offended. It's common practice to "highjack" threads I think. This is just how you get information and I've probably done it myself on occassion.

By the way, assuiming I decide to sell, I'm going crazy with these details I see on the web. How would I sell legally to a person? Do they need to send me a check with a copy of their gun permit? After which, would I send it through UPS ($10 I assume..) Thank you.

 

[SteelyDan]

Also, there is a little trick with the 442s. You pull the trigger about 80% of the way and you'll hear a click (there's an earlier click at about 30%; ignore it). At that point, stop and hold the trigger in place. Now finalize your aim and shoot, and the trigger won't be nearly as bad.

 

[M1911]

I've got a 642. As we've discussed previously, I did a spring and polish job on mine. That's improved the trigger somewhat. The front sight is still small and the rear sight is that pitiful groove. These aren't easy guns to shoot.

I've tried larger grips, and while they make it more comfortable, they also make it impossible to fit into the pocket of my jeans. Which defeats the whole purpose of the 642 for me. So, I went back to the factory grips. Sorry I don't have a better solution for you.

M1911

 

[marca]

I was having a real hard time getting the hang of my 442 and got some good advice, here on TFL and elsewhere. Here's what's worked for me.

Houge Bantam grips soften the bite from recoil. They're the same size as the stock grips on the 442/642 so the gun remains concealable. The grips are softer rubber with a bit of a palm swell and finger grooves. These have made a world of difference for me. I've even put Bantams on my Model 60 and my Model 640.

Start with lighter loads and work up. I practiced for a while with 110 gr ammo then moved to 125 gr.

Practice beginning at 10 feet then move out as you get the hang of the trigger.

Dry fire a lot. This seems to mellow the trigger pull.

I wish there was a way to put something like a Big Dot in place of the front sight. It would make quick, point shooting a breeze. I have a Big Dot on my 640 and like it a lot.

 

[Mastrogiacomo]

Actually I have installed Hougue rubber grips (don't know if I spelled that right.. ) You're right, it does make it harder to conceal but for me, I wouldn't put a gun in my pocket so I don't mind the grip. If I could carry, it'd probably be close to my body. With the boot grips, for my right hand, the pinky always hung lose. I clearly didn't like the grip it came with and this larger one has groves for the fingers and feels more comfortable. I've debated about selling mine but now I don't know. It is an excellent home denfense gun and would make a great backup gun as revolvers never jam. I almost regret not getting a gun with a hammer but I thought I'd be wiser not to have anything that could snag or get caught. I'm curious what a trigger job would involve (and cost) and how much of a difference it'd make if I had them also replace the spring with Wolf reduced recoil.

 

[sox]

Mastro, those Hogues are a great choice. Two more quick things: If controllability becomes an issue, don't give up with the J frame. I have found that each 5oz. of weight does make a pretty significant difference in felt recoil. For example: SW M337PD 10.9oz. painful, M38 15oz. tolerable, M60 20oz. comfortable with most loads, Ruger SP101 25oz. enjoyable. I also forgot to mention earlier that a shooting glove will help with range sessions. Good shooting.

 

[Mastrogiacomo]

Thanks for the advice and the info everyone. I think given what I've heard about the pros and cons of selling, it isn't likely I'd get what the gun is worth. Moreover, I probably haven't given the the revolver a fair shot -- no pun intended. I imagine if I had bought a .38 with a hammer it wouldn't have made much difference given that the size and weight would still factor in with the recoil. The 442 would make a great back up gun if needed once I have a little work done on it. I've The painful grip is gone, I'll keep my eyes open for a decent pair of shooting gloves, and break it in with several more rounds. Once I've got a little money set aside, I'll look for someone to do something with the trigger and replace the spring. Thank you again for the very helpful advice. I'll certainly miss this forum when it's gone....have a safe, healthy, and very happy holiday people!

 

[Tamara]

I imagine if I had bought a .38 with a hammer it wouldn't have made much difference given that the size and weight would still factor in with the recoil.

Or if you'd bought a steel-framed one.

It kinda cheeses me off when some dude behind the counter at a gun store pitches an AirWeight .38 J-frame (Or, worse, one of the new Scandium .357s) to a small woman who has never shot before.

"Shore, honey, .38's a good little woman's gun, and look how small, cute and light this is! Ain't it cute? You'll never feel it in your purse."

News flash, Mr. Gunshop Commando: DAO Airweight J-frames really aren't the best choice for novices who haven't had much exposure to muzzle blast and recoil. I believe you'd mentioned, Mastrogiacomo, that you'd noticed that they kick a mite? It's not that .38 is a viciously recoiling round, inherently, it's that these little ~15 ounce guns don't weigh anything, have room for about two-and-a-half fingers on the grip, and the muzzleblast is happening two inches in front of your knuckles. On top of it, you're fighting the unfamiliar nature of a long, DA trigger pull. Not a recipe for building confidence.

I always used to steer new shooters to medium frame revolvers, because (given the same caliber) the larger gun will have less kick.

 

[M1911]

Actually I have installed Hougue rubber grips (don't know if I spelled that right.. ) You're right, it does make it harder to conceal but for me, I wouldn't put a gun in my pocket so I don't mind the grip.

I always use a pocket holster. Put the gun in the holster first, then holster and gun together into the pocket. That way, the trigger guard is covered at all times.

Personally, I don't really see the point to a J-frame snub nose if it isn't carried in a pocket or on an ankle. After all, if you're going to carry a J-frame in a belt holster, you can just as easily carry a 3" Model 60 (stainless steel J-frame) with real sights. Much, much easier to shoot than a 642 or 442.

M1911

 

[Greybeard]

Yep, the factory grips that come on the lighter j-frames can be a recipe for unpleasant experiences. I've had several j-frames and the only one that still has original (wood) grips is the very old (all steel) Model 36. Even with just the "groove" for a rear sight, its single action trigger lets me put 5 of 5 on a pie plate at 50'. The only way I've been able to duplicate that with S&W's new chitty action on DAO 340 is after 2 trips to gun smith for trigger work and addition of Crimson Trace "overmoulded" laser grip. Sorta pricey, but the overmoulded CT laser grip made quick longer distance accuracy possible - and greatly tamed the recoil at the same time.

 

[Mastrogiacomo]

It's funny but when I was looking at the .38's that were trying to push me towards the light weight gun telling me what a great seller it is, they're "flying off the shelves," what a wonderful home defense gun it is, ladies love this because it doesn't weigh them down, etc. I really didn't have the money and the model they showed me had a hammer, which I didn't want and so I passed over it. Thank God! I got off easy. Since then I've come to realize weight in a gun is a GOOD thing. I'm so glad that the allure of light weight handguns has never left me star struck. I'll take a good heavy revolver or pistol any day. Hopefully when I get a little work on this revolver after the holidays I can chalk up the whole ordeal as "How I learned to stop worrying and love the gun."

 

[Tamara]

Truthfully, one of these days you'll go back and shoot that 442 and wonder what all the fuss was about.

Trust me, I never thought I'd own a snubnose .44 Magnum. They used to scare me to death, now it's one of my favorite guns.