How Do You Feel About Profiteering?

[Guyon]

Are you an adherent of free-market economics to the point that you overlook instances such as the one below?

Personally, I find it reprehensible that some vendors are choosing to price gouge on certain items, given the current atmosphere. I understand basic supply and demand principles, but I, for one, will remember tactics like the image below when it comes to future business.

Most ridiculous in this particular case is that CTD suggests that MSRP on these magazines is $59.96. Price listed on the Magpul site (even though Magpul is currently not taking orders) is $14.95. So not only is CTD benefiting from the panic; they're actively deceiving buyers in order to add to it.

 

[Technosavant]

If you can get it, so be it. However, you also need to remember that you want to make not just THIS sale, but the next one as well. If I think you're putting the screws to me, you'll not get another sale out of me, if you even get this one.

 

[dipper]

I hate it.
If someone tries to "gouge" me or is taking part in profiteering, I will NEVER do business with them again---EVER.
I can understand/except a small SLIGHTLY higher mark-up at times--say 5% or so--but these people that think know is the time to add 50% on their prices won't get one thin dime out of me.

 

[danweasel]

I love free market economics. I can't wait until hurricane season starts again. I feel like a scumbag only paying $2.90 for a gallon of gas. I wish we could over react to a presidential election everyday! Yay!

Seriously though, I agree with you guys above. I hate all forms of profiteering. From oil to medical care/drugs to food to ammo and guns this is getting ridiculous. I wish I could corner the market on something people couldn't (or shouldn't) live without! Did the price of this stuff really inflate that fast or did lazy ass people just decide that it is easier to bend over and take it? Wouldn't want to look like a socialist and mess with somebodies profit margin now would we? Record profits at that. I just hope it doesn't come out that ALL the EBR and EBR accessories makers (and all gun mfgs I guess) have decided to forget about (nice language) the little people and start acting like every other corporation has been acting lately.

I just wish I could tell Exxon Mobile to shove it and take my business elsewhere.

 

[danweasel]

Never Buy A Thing From Ctd Again.

OK I am back and more calmer now.

CTD has always had a bad aura about it. It is the whole Walmart, pushing low priced junk, crappy service, and low employee wages like only a big corporation can offer versus the little guy who is in the business because he loves it kinda thing. Now it's worse than that. They are jacking up prices and posting bald-faced lies about it to make it seem like they are on our side? This is an open, spit it your face, @#$% you to gun buyers and owners everywhere. If you buy from this place EVER again you have no pride, no concern for your fellow firearm enthusiast and no soul. So how 'bout that?

Same thing has happened with a million different smaller markets. Don't let it happen here.

 

[bigalshootmupper]

It's theor choice if they want to jack up the price. Not a good way of doing busines though. If other vendors keep their prices the same, sure in the short run they will not profit as much as the gouging vendor. But in the long run, people will remember who did dirty business and didn't. I just hope people have enough morality to do the right thing and not just choose the cheapest price. Again, in the long run, a business that does the right thing will profit the most in the long run.

 

[Wildalaska]

Scum. I will NEVER do business with them again

WildiusedtogetsurplusclothingAlaska ™

 

[Tom2]

Maybe they should change their name to LOWER THAN DIRT!

 

[Sevens]

I'm annoyed also, but there's TWO PARTIES in this

The market is a self correcting situation. While the folks jacking this stuff up is a real boner, it's a two-part problem. There is NO PROBLEM without both halves of the problem.

The second half of the problem are the renobs who are buying.

If nobody buys, the problem doesn't exist.

Anyone here who tells me that they need an AR-15 magazine more right now or a week ago wednesday than they did two months ago is full of it. Unless you just broke all your magazines or someone dropped an AR in to your lap without magazines, you should have bought them before the election.

Gas stations that jack people sideways is a whole different issue. These are magazines... it's not milk, electricity and oxygen. This is not a commodity that everyone in the country needs on a day to day basis.

For sure, I'm not saying that you guys don't have a right to be angry. I say, get ******, let them know, boycott their asses. (BUT DO LET THEM KNOW! Boycott without an e-mail isn't letting them know)

All I'm saying is that if we didn't have all the freaked out gun owners buying all this stuff up, this would be a one-week problem that corrects itself immediately. The retailers would jack stuff up, nobody would buy, the retailers would correct it.

 

[Sarge]

Well said, Sevens. You can get hosed on any product available if you don't watch yourself.

 

[dipper]

You're right Sevens, BUT, it is the mindset of the gougers that I dislike.
I'm all for a free market but I don't care for the the type of person that has such a severe character flaw and won't ever do business with them for any reason.

Case in point.
Some years ago I went to buy a generator at a local motorcycle/lawnmower/go-cart etc. dealership.
It was a time when generators were in big demand in various parts of the country.
The salesmen had his prices jacked way up and explained to me that he "could load up his truck with his generators and take them to Florida" and get more than he was asking for them here locally.
I told him he should do it and walked out.
Since then I have purchased 2 generators, 2 lawnmowers, a go-cart and a motorcycle---and nothing was purchased from him.
I saw him at a local bike night and he asked were I purchased my bike since he sold the same brand---I told him and also told him that I wouldn't buy a spark plug from him and if he needed more business " to load up his trucks and head to Florida"---he got the message but none of MY money!!

 

[Mike_NY]

"Profiteering" and "gouging" are bogus euphenisms based on collectivist notions that the consumer has some god given right to dictate to the producer/seller how much something "should" cost. That's not the way capitalism works, and it's a damn good thing.

When there are shortages, high demand, or even urgent need, it's the opportunity for profit that makes products available. "Fair" prices are meaningless if there's no product to buy. Pay the asking price or don't buy it, those are the consumer's choices.

Outlaw "profiteering" and see how long you wait for portable generators and bottled water after the next bad hurricane. Profit, sometimes even huge profit, is the reason things get where they're needed. That's a good thing.

 

[Mannlicher]

it is amusing to read a thread that slams free interprise, and the free market system, for folks making an increased profit in a time of short supply, and heavy demand.

I thought we were capitalists!

Evidently many gun owners don't understand market dynamics. One way to look at supply and demand is when you are asked to work OT at the job.
Demand is your boss saying there is OT availible, and he needs folks to pick it up.
Supply is you, having extra time to provide, and putting in for the OT.
Now, if offered time and a half for the work, do you 'profiteer' and take the extra money, or........ or do you say, "heck, I wasn't doing anything tommorrow, count on me to do the work, and I'll only charge ya regular pay".

 

[dipper]

How far do you want to take your capitalism Mike NY ?

If you are a diabetic and something happens to the insulin supply should your local pharmacy triple the price?? Do you want to live?? Heck, maybe NOTHING happens to the supply--maybe the drug company just wants MORE profit.
I mean, free market and all---the pharmacy owes you nothing and well, if you can't afford the drugs you need well, tough beans right??

How far do we go---I guess some would say it is alright to gouge on some products and not others.
Maybe someone needs a generator to keep a home dialysis machine running or a heart monitor for an infant.

When a company has product sitting on the floor and they jack up the prices because there is suffering or hardship in our country and they feel it is time to cash in, SORRY, they're scum to me----that ain't capitalism by any definition, it is just plain old UGLY greed and I would rather see THAT type of person starve.


Mannlicher,

"Evidently many gun owners don't understand market dynamics. One way to look at supply and demand is when you are asked to work OT at the job.
Demand is your boss saying there is OT availible, and he needs folks to pick it up.
Supply is you, having extra time to provide, and putting in for the OT.
Now, if offered time and a half for the work, do you 'profiteer' and take the extra money, or........ or do you say, "heck, I wasn't doing anything tommorrow, count on me to do the work, and I'll only charge ya regular pay"

Apples and Oranges---not even a close comparison!!

 

[danweasel]

Demand is your boss saying there is OT availible, and he needs folks to pick it up.
Supply is you, having extra time to provide, and putting in for the OT.
Now, if offered time and a half for the work, do you 'profiteer' and take the extra money, or........ or do you say, "heck, I wasn't doing anything tommorrow, count on me to do the work, and I'll only charge ya regular pay".

Huh? This makes no sense. A very bad attempt at analogy.

Do you work for CTD? Now in a capitolistic (probably not a word) system we are supposed to buy things and not worry about the price? Or about the ethics of the seller? "Don't boycott 'em! What are you? A socialist?"

As with most things, you have to use you brain and put things to the common sense test. Common sense will tell you that LYING to consumers to make a buck is wrong. I don't do business with rip-off artists, except oil companies and healthcare providers, out of neccessity.

 

[Ruger4570]

Dipper, this is a real hard question for anyone to answer. I sure feel bad for the person needing medical supplies, but then, most have insurance to cover it. There are those with no insurance, but there are programs in place to help them too. Nothing is perfect, and I, along with most people hate to be taken advantage of.
The bottom line is that is OUR form of Government and I sure would hate to see the other type,, Socialism.
When gas went through the sky, I consolodated trips, drove only when I had too. During the Coffee shortage, I stopped drinking so much coffee.
We ALL know in the recent past gas prices were going up daily even though the stations already had the gas in the ground, they were just following the market. Even today I do a local search on who has the best gas price and it sometimes is 25 cents a gallon difference. Guess what, I don't buy my gas from them. Some do, I don't.
They can have whatever price they want, I always have the choice of NOT buying their products.
I read all the commotion about Exxon-Mobil profits and all the related crap. Of course they made lots of money, they are selling a product we all now need. I have never heard anyone complain about how much Bill Gates makes in profit. No complaints lodged against Wal Marts profits.
The nice thing about our form of society is that there is always OTHER choices to do business with.
Do I like high costs, hell no, but I am a realist.
When I and my partner had our home building company, it was hard to be totally competitive with all markets. Sure, we could have used cheaper materials, cheaper labor and found ways to get to a price point. We deceided not to bother, we built quality homes. Actually we were fortunate we maintained that premise as we never had to advertise and were always busy from folks that heard about us and wanted a quality product.
People will always go to the best product once they learn slipshod businesses are not a bargin in the end

 

[Sevens]

"Profiteering" and "gouging" are bogus euphenisms based on collectivist notions that the consumer has some god given right to dictate to the producer/seller how much something "should" cost.

The consumer has every right to dictate the how much something "should" cost, it's just that he has only ONE true way to do that, and that is to vote with his wallet.

It's just like the snacks at the movie theater or the pro sports venue. It's an absolute rape, four bucks for a bottle of water. There is a reason these prices continue even to this day: When was the last time you went to the movies and you didn't see anyone buying any of the snacks? When was the last time you went to a ballgame and nobody was dropping $3.75 for a 3-hour old & cold wrinkled hot dog?

People stand in line to pay those prices, and so those prices exist.

When folks STOP, the prices drop like a rock.

In this country we have a lot, a whole helluva lot of folks who handle their finances in a horribly ignorant manner. It's not all bad... because of these people, some industries exist that otherwise would not, and some other industries thrive when they otherwise might not. Check cashing stores, buy here/pay here used car lots? Consumer credit companies? Financially challenged Americans are part of a working economy. Those businesses aren't illegal and they aren't immoral, but they absolutely feed on people who don't care enough to know better.

If people knew better, if they cared enough to learn, if they were a little less lazy and a little smarter on the whole, a lot of these things would re-adjust.

I see cotton candy for $3.50 and I laugh at it. Sure, it's a difficult moment when I have to fight off my 5 year old daughter when she sees the stuff, but I can do it. If everyone could do it; if everyone did it, cotton candy would cost $1 at ball games.

Consumers can dictate a lot, but consumers are quite often lazy and ignorant and short sighted. There's a lot of money to be made when THOSE people are your clients and customers.

 

[vox rationis]

If you are a diabetic and something happens to the insulin supply should your local pharmacy triple the price??

Actually when the supply is extremely low, if prices don't increase, then a few hoarders will be able to clean the rafters and horde the goods before anyone else has a chance to buy the stuff. So in that sense "price gouging" can be a protective mechanism against out of control hoarding by a few.

Now in extreme life or death situations the government does have mechanisms in place, such as FEMA, to make sure that people don't starve or die due to not having needed medications etc, but that is hardly the case here, when considering a few vendors reacting to the laws of supply and demand, and asking a high price for very scarce commodities such as high cap mags. It isn't like the govt has to step in and ration mags .

Some vendors have reserved a number of highly sought after mags, for example, that are in extremely low supply and increased the price keeping many people from buying them, yes, but at least in this way, these scarce items are still available to be purchased, albeit at a much higher price, if you really really need some now. If not, wait until the supply and demand equation becomes more favorable, pure and simple.

 

[Mike_NY]

dipper,

Dream up all the heart wrenching anecdotes you like, it doesn't change the fact that YOUR NEED does not entitle you to MY STUFF. It really is that simple. Don't like it? Drill your own oil, make your own drugs, and hammer out your own AR mags.

If your life depends on uninterrupted power, you ought to thank the generator seller who still has one for you to buy BECAUSE he "jacked up" the price. The greedy "scum" saved your life.

There will always be people who can't afford necessities. That's where VOLUNTARY charity comes in. Otherwise, well, life sucks...then you die.

That's how far.

......Mike

 

[22-rimfire]

As a consumer you have the right to refuse to buy at that price. Prices will come down. If they don't, then they don't.

If someone offered you $2000 for an AR you paid $1000 for, would you sell it to him for that or would you say... how about $1050 with the mags?