I have a 3" SP101 and I'd like to convert it to DAO. I'm okay with cutting off the hammer spur. I just need to know where the single action notch is on the SP-101 so I can remove it. Has anyone done this who can also photograph the hammer (removed from the gun) with this mod so I can compare it to my own? Thanks
How do I "Bob" a Hammer for true DAO?
- Thread starter November
- Start date
Johnny Guest
Moderator in Memoriam
A couple of items for your consideration - - -
November, is there any reason you want to deliberately give up the chance of EVER making a thumb-cocked shot with your little resolver?
The presence of the SA notch has absolutely nothing to do with the relative smoothness of the DA trigger pull. The removal of the hammer spur precludes the possibility that the hammer might ever accidentally be cocked.
As I recall, back in the late 'sixties, Los Angeles PD converted all their K-frame .38s to DA only. They had a spate of really stoopid cops who waved handguns in the face of suspects who didn't need shooting. The suspects, aware that they probably would NOT be shot, started "dissing" the kowboy kops. The KKs must've figured, "OKAY, then - - maybe it'll impress 'em more if I thumb cock this thing and they can watch the cylinder rotate and the see the bullet noses . . ." Well, this IS pretty scary. But hey, you gotta have your FINGER ON THE TRIGGER to show how irrational and out of control you are, right?
The inevitable occurred. More than once. In a typical bureaucratic over reaction, the powers-that-were decided to make it impossible to cock revolvers. The whole thing was a failure of training, combined with total lack of judgment. Tragic. Idiotic.
I dunno. If I were responsible for arming several thousand cops, and only marginally gun-savvy myself, I might choose that course of action. Being better trained and a subscriber to the theory of personal responsibility, I'd take a different course: I'd teach the officers that the sidearm has specific purposes, which do NOT include silly intimidation. I would also remind them: If you kill or injure someone while needlessly performing an act clearly hazardous to human life, you will, without fail, be charged with Voluntary Manslaughter or Aggravated Assault/Serious Bodily Injury. Everyone on the same page.
If the time ever comes you want to swap off or sell a particular revolver, it'll bring fifty to a hundred bucks less without the SA feature. Ask your favorite dealer.
Besides, I like to shoot handguns at long range. Hundred yard hits on a silhouette target are makeable with a two-inch Chief. I'd bet your three-inch SP101 would do better. I've tried shots of opportunity at 80 yards or so at coyotes in the pasture. Other scenarios are not beyond imagination.
I am a big believer in spurless hammers for belly guns. I have three of my own. I believe in keeping my options open, though, and each of these have the single action notch in place.
Clearly: Your gun, your preference.
Best,
Johnny
November, is there any reason you want to deliberately give up the chance of EVER making a thumb-cocked shot with your little resolver?
The presence of the SA notch has absolutely nothing to do with the relative smoothness of the DA trigger pull. The removal of the hammer spur precludes the possibility that the hammer might ever accidentally be cocked.
As I recall, back in the late 'sixties, Los Angeles PD converted all their K-frame .38s to DA only. They had a spate of really stoopid cops who waved handguns in the face of suspects who didn't need shooting. The suspects, aware that they probably would NOT be shot, started "dissing" the kowboy kops. The KKs must've figured, "OKAY, then - - maybe it'll impress 'em more if I thumb cock this thing and they can watch the cylinder rotate and the see the bullet noses . . ." Well, this IS pretty scary. But hey, you gotta have your FINGER ON THE TRIGGER to show how irrational and out of control you are, right?
The inevitable occurred. More than once. In a typical bureaucratic over reaction, the powers-that-were decided to make it impossible to cock revolvers. The whole thing was a failure of training, combined with total lack of judgment. Tragic. Idiotic.
I dunno. If I were responsible for arming several thousand cops, and only marginally gun-savvy myself, I might choose that course of action. Being better trained and a subscriber to the theory of personal responsibility, I'd take a different course: I'd teach the officers that the sidearm has specific purposes, which do NOT include silly intimidation. I would also remind them: If you kill or injure someone while needlessly performing an act clearly hazardous to human life, you will, without fail, be charged with Voluntary Manslaughter or Aggravated Assault/Serious Bodily Injury. Everyone on the same page.
If the time ever comes you want to swap off or sell a particular revolver, it'll bring fifty to a hundred bucks less without the SA feature. Ask your favorite dealer.
Besides, I like to shoot handguns at long range. Hundred yard hits on a silhouette target are makeable with a two-inch Chief. I'd bet your three-inch SP101 would do better. I've tried shots of opportunity at 80 yards or so at coyotes in the pasture. Other scenarios are not beyond imagination.
I am a big believer in spurless hammers for belly guns. I have three of my own. I believe in keeping my options open, though, and each of these have the single action notch in place.
Clearly: Your gun, your preference.
Best,
Johnny
Investigate further....
If it were me, I would investigate if I could buy the parts for the DAO SP 101 seperately from Ruger, economically, and then you could have it both ways.(A resale bonus)
I assume they use CNC for interchangeability on their guns. Years ago I just sawed off the spur and refinished the back of the hammer. Then I could still (maybe not super safe) at the range, start the hammer back with the trigger and cock with my thumb when it was clear of the frame-pointing down range the whole time! Just for testing load accuracy. But CCW was not a reality for this state way back then, anyway.
If it were me, I would investigate if I could buy the parts for the DAO SP 101 seperately from Ruger, economically, and then you could have it both ways.(A resale bonus)
I assume they use CNC for interchangeability on their guns. Years ago I just sawed off the spur and refinished the back of the hammer. Then I could still (maybe not super safe) at the range, start the hammer back with the trigger and cock with my thumb when it was clear of the frame-pointing down range the whole time! Just for testing load accuracy. But CCW was not a reality for this state way back then, anyway.
Geoff Timm
New member
You might just e-mail Ruger and ask if they will do the job, and how much it will cost.
Geoff
Who goes with the low energy solution.
Geoff
Who goes with the low energy solution.
Thanks for all the replies. Ruger won't sell the hammer by itself, but they will install one. I just don't like the idea of sending it off when I can do it myself. Numrich doesn't have any either. Sometimes, a sp101 hammer will pop up on eBay, so I'll keep my eyes peeled. Johnny Guest, I don't know that I follow you. Are you suggesting to just cut off the hammer spur, but keep the single-action notch? That sounds like an accident waiting to happen (even if I only use the single-action notch at the range). In answer to your first question, I shoot revolvers more accurately in double-action mode and that's the reason for the modification. In any case thanks for your input (didn't know about the LAPD thing). Thanks again.
Johnny Guest
Moderator in Memoriam
Leaving the SA notch
Years back, I spent some thousands of rounds, and some months of intensive practice to become pretty darned good at DA firing, both using the sights, and point shooting. I slavishly studied every word I could find in print, by Bill Jordan, Ed McGivern, and Elmer Keith. That notwithstanding, I can still make more precise shots at longer ranges using SA fire.
Certinly, individual abilities differ. If you are able to make consistent hits at long range, if you are able to evaluate relative accuracy of a given load, shooting DA, then my hat's off to you, and none of the above applies . . . .
Johnny
Yes, exactly. Accident prone? With the spur removed, there's no way the hammer can become cocked unless you deliberately do so. I put my thumb against the rear of the (spurless) hammer and lift it slightly with the trigger. When I hook my thumb over the top of the hammer, I take my finger off the trigger and haul the hammer back to cock. This is neither more nor less hazardous than having a spurred hammer at full cock - - The trigger pull is now three to five pounds, rather than a dozen or so pounds, and the trigger needs be moved only 1/8 inch or so to fire.
Years back, I spent some thousands of rounds, and some months of intensive practice to become pretty darned good at DA firing, both using the sights, and point shooting. I slavishly studied every word I could find in print, by Bill Jordan, Ed McGivern, and Elmer Keith. That notwithstanding, I can still make more precise shots at longer ranges using SA fire.
Certinly, individual abilities differ. If you are able to make consistent hits at long range, if you are able to evaluate relative accuracy of a given load, shooting DA, then my hat's off to you, and none of the above applies . . . .
Johnny
Johnny Guest
Moderator in Memoriam
Decocking the despurred hammer - - -
shep854 - - I use a modification of the same technique recommended for lowering the hammer of a single action autopistol:
Place thumb of the non-shooting hand in front of the hammer, with the thumbnail against the hammer nose (firing pin.) Hook firing hand thumb over the top of the hammer. Press the trigger and allow the hammer to move forward about a quarter-inch, under firm control of both thumbs. RELEASE FINGER PRESSURE against the trigger. Ease the hammer to rest. This is actually safer than lowering the hammer on a single action revolver or autopistol, in that those types usually have a "half cock" or loading notch, and the trigger must be held back while the hammer is lowered farther.
The release of pressure on the trigger engages the internal safety system, so that, even if the hammer drops, it will not fire the revolver.
Alternative technique: firmly "pinch" the hammer with thumb and first finger of the non-shooting hand, with the finger pads between hammer and frame. Continue as above.
Needless to say, either technique needs be PRACTICED WITH AN EMPTY FIREARM. Equally needless is the mention of pointing the muzzle in a safe direction. Always makes me shudder watching some movie cowboy hero who's been holding a cocked SAA on someone, and then discovers this is a non-hostile. The hee-roe then lowers the hammer while still pointing the muzzle at the friendly!
All this above, admittedly, entails some faint hazard of a sudden loud noise. As said by the oft-quoted Russian guy, "Ees GON! Ees DANGEROUS!"
The whole thing is a matter of training and practice. Not for everybody.
Best,
Johnny
shep854 - - I use a modification of the same technique recommended for lowering the hammer of a single action autopistol:
Place thumb of the non-shooting hand in front of the hammer, with the thumbnail against the hammer nose (firing pin.) Hook firing hand thumb over the top of the hammer. Press the trigger and allow the hammer to move forward about a quarter-inch, under firm control of both thumbs. RELEASE FINGER PRESSURE against the trigger. Ease the hammer to rest. This is actually safer than lowering the hammer on a single action revolver or autopistol, in that those types usually have a "half cock" or loading notch, and the trigger must be held back while the hammer is lowered farther.
The release of pressure on the trigger engages the internal safety system, so that, even if the hammer drops, it will not fire the revolver.
Alternative technique: firmly "pinch" the hammer with thumb and first finger of the non-shooting hand, with the finger pads between hammer and frame. Continue as above.
Needless to say, either technique needs be PRACTICED WITH AN EMPTY FIREARM. Equally needless is the mention of pointing the muzzle in a safe direction. Always makes me shudder watching some movie cowboy hero who's been holding a cocked SAA on someone, and then discovers this is a non-hostile. The hee-roe then lowers the hammer while still pointing the muzzle at the friendly!
All this above, admittedly, entails some faint hazard of a sudden loud noise. As said by the oft-quoted Russian guy, "Ees GON! Ees DANGEROUS!"
The whole thing is a matter of training and practice. Not for everybody.
Best,
Johnny
Hi November,
Usually I try not to point out other alternatives when somebody asks about an unusual method of doing something outside the mainstream, but you have me curious.
I'm not knocking your question, but I don't understand why you'd want to do it.
Usually, rendering a revolver DA-only is done for liability reasons, as mentioned above. Removing the hammer spur is done to make it less likely to snag on clothing. If liability's not your concern, and you just shoot the gun better in DA, it seems the easiest way to go would be to just shoot it DA as it exists. Removing the hammer spur & SA notch will have zero affect on the triggerpull, and will lower the re-sale value on it in most areas if you ever decide to sell it, also as mentioned above. The lack of a hammer spur also affects your choice of holsters for the gun. I have one S&W L-Frame .357 with the spur removed, and I wouldn't do it again on anything larger than a pocket revolver. When I was first testing the gun after it was customized, I was shooting for accuracy in SA mode by doing that partial trigger-cocking trick, and it worked fine till I over-triggered it & the gun didn't do my thumb any good at all when it fired before I was ready for it to fire. I personally like to retain an SA option, even though it's not critical for close-up defensive use. Just my preference & others do like DA only guns.
As a part of the never-ending search for knowledge, I'd be interested in hearing more about your reasoning.
Denis
Usually I try not to point out other alternatives when somebody asks about an unusual method of doing something outside the mainstream, but you have me curious.
I'm not knocking your question, but I don't understand why you'd want to do it.
Usually, rendering a revolver DA-only is done for liability reasons, as mentioned above. Removing the hammer spur is done to make it less likely to snag on clothing. If liability's not your concern, and you just shoot the gun better in DA, it seems the easiest way to go would be to just shoot it DA as it exists. Removing the hammer spur & SA notch will have zero affect on the triggerpull, and will lower the re-sale value on it in most areas if you ever decide to sell it, also as mentioned above. The lack of a hammer spur also affects your choice of holsters for the gun. I have one S&W L-Frame .357 with the spur removed, and I wouldn't do it again on anything larger than a pocket revolver. When I was first testing the gun after it was customized, I was shooting for accuracy in SA mode by doing that partial trigger-cocking trick, and it worked fine till I over-triggered it & the gun didn't do my thumb any good at all when it fired before I was ready for it to fire. I personally like to retain an SA option, even though it's not critical for close-up defensive use. Just my preference & others do like DA only guns.
As a part of the never-ending search for knowledge, I'd be interested in hearing more about your reasoning.
Denis
Johnny, I remembered reading an account by a gunwriter who tried to lower the bobbed hammer on a revolver, and catching his thumb between the frame and hammer, under the firing pin. According to the account, he needed help to get loose.
A snag-free hammer with SA capability is why I prefer a Bodyguard.
According to the account, he needed help to get loose. A snag-free hammer with SA capability is why I prefer a Bodyguard.