Heads Up: NFA Branch Declining All Forms with Errors

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Tom Servo

Staff
The overriding priority for NFA examiners at the moment is reducing backlog.

Previously, if there was an error on a form, it would be returned to the dealer. The dealer would make or have the correction made, and the form would be returned to the NFA branch. That's no longer the case.

I've spoken with two examiners on this, and the new approach is not to waste time waiting for corrections. For the time being, any form with any error whatsoever is being declined, and the tax is being refunded. That means going back to square one and resubmitting from scratch.

Review your submissions carefully, or you could end up wasting a great deal of time.
 
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Mobuck

Moderator
BATFE tries to discourage NFA ownership in every step of the process. Long wait times, endless hooraw and hassle, and total arrogance but citizens still put up with it.
 
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Theohazard

New member
Mobuck said:
BATFE tries to discourage NFA ownership in every step of the process. Long wait times, endless hooraw and hassle, and total arrogance but citizens still put up with it.
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Not always, otherwise we would still be at an 11 month wait for Form 4s. Instead it has dropped to under 4 months in most places.
 
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dogtown tom

New member
Tom Servo The overriding priority for NFA examiners at the moment is reducing backlog.

Previously, if there was an error on a form, it would be returned to the dealer. The dealer would make or have the correction made, and the form would be returned to the NFA branch. That's no longer the case.

I've spoken with two examiners on this, and the new approach is not to waste time waiting for corrections. For the time being, any form with any error whatsoever is being declined, and the tax is being refunded. That means going back to square one and resubmitting from scratch.

Review your submissions carefully, or you could end up wasting a great deal of time.
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Not always.
Just last week I received an error notice on a Form 3. The transferor forget to type in my city and state as the transferee. Nothing refunded, nothing sent back to square one.



Mobuck BATFE tries to discourage NFA ownership in every step of the process. Long wait times, endless hooraw and hassle, and total arrogance but citizens still put up with it.
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You could not be more wrong. You are so wrong I suspect you have no real experience with ATF NFA Branch at all.

The long wait isn't an ATF plot, it's due to the sheer volume of Form 1's, 3's & 4's being submitted. ATF (like any government agency) doesn't have the ability to simply go hire extra help, it has to be budgeted. Throw in the occasional sequester and staffing problems occur.

"Endless hooraw and hassle"??? Poppycock to say the least. Only in respect to the attempt by ATF to speed up the process by initiating an online submission option for NFA forms.......it just didn't work. Slowly ATF NFA Branch is getting it up to speed. Form 1's for trusts are taking less than 30 days. Compare that to several years ago......Form 1's took several months.

ATF NFA Branch doesn't hassle, but is more helpful than they really need to be. When you post nonsense about the supposed "hassle" you make yourself look foolish to those of us who deal with the NFA Branch every week.

The same poppycock! applies to your claim of "total arrogance"..............I've been a licensed dealer for more than six years and have yet to meet or speak with an "arrogant" ATF employee. They have been friendly, courteous, helpful and that goes double for the NFA Branch.

If your only knowledge of ATF behavior is from the actions of a few enforcement agents, you should familiarize yourself with the ATF employees in Industry Operations.
 
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Bartholomew Roberts

Moderator
ATF denies forms for "errors" that are not errors at all. I've seen ATF deny forms based on a misunderstanding of trust law that had no effect on whether the transfer is legal. If they start denying forms with errors (real or imagined), that is going to bite them on the ass.

Having said that, I just dealt with a Form 4 with a legitimate error and the examiners here were helpful and did not deny it.
 
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Tom Servo

Staff
ATF denies forms for "errors" that are not errors at all.
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Yep. I've had a couple of real annoyances with errors in the NFRTR.

On the current matter, one case involved an application on behalf of a trust. It was disapproved because the yes/no questions hadn't been checked in section 13. This comes after we'd been advised that none of page 2 need be completed if the application is filed on behalf of a trust.

That was about two weeks ago, so it was considered an outlier. Last week, another application was rejected because the customer forgot to send a copy of his trust.

I spoke with Kyle in Martinsburg and was told that it's simply easier for them to reject applications outright than wait for corrections.
 
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Mobuck

Moderator
They have been friendly, courteous, helpful and that goes double for the NFA Branch.

If your only knowledge of ATF behavior is from the actions of a few enforcement agents, you should familiarize yourself with the ATF employees in Industry Operations.

Whatever you say , Dude. Your experience seems to be far different from mine.
 
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Theohazard

New member
Mobuck said:
Whatever you say , Dude. Your experience seems to be far different from mine.
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Regardless of different personal experiences, it's definitely not true that the ATF "tries to discourage NFA ownership in every step of the process", otherwise they wouldn't have put such an effort into cutting wait times in half over the last year.

Also, if you don't want to use the quote function, at least put your quoted text between quotation marks, otherwise posts like your last one can be pretty difficult to understand.
 
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Mobuck

Moderator
It seems I have struck a nerve with some folks. I apologize for the comments since it's my "opinion" not documented fact.
I've deleted the rest of my post since no doubt, BATFE is monitoring such venues.
 
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Machineguntony

New member
I called ATF on Friday, and they just approved my form 4 after 13 months. LOL. I'm not exaggerating. The ATF first sent a letter requesting clarification, then they sent a letter notifying me of a duplicate submission, then they sent an error letter, then they sent a second error letter. It was finally approved Friday.

And during the same call, as I asked about my other form 4s, they notified me that an error letter had just been sent on one of my pending form 4s. Arrrrrgg.

The good news is that wait times are significantly down. I submitted a form 4 on a trigger box about three months ago, and it was approved 9 days ago, as of the date of this writing.
 
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RodTheWrench

New member
I picked up all 3 of my suppressors on Friday. The stamps arrived just under the 4-month mark. They were done under a Trust.

I think a competent FFL should be able to make sure the right forms are submitted, completed properly.
 
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CCCLVII

New member
I have had help on all 4 of my suppressors 3 From the dealers and 1 from a friend that has more NFA items than I do and some how I always get an Error. I have been doing them the old fashioned paper way. I know the wait is longer but call me paranoid I like having a stamp for proof if the grid ever goes down lol.
 
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JMC

New member
Heads Up: NFA Branch Declining All Forms with Errors

I don't believe this is the case 100% of the time.
My Brother just had a F1 returned for a couple of simple errors. BATFE gave him 30 days to correct the errors and return the F1.
They didn't return his check or say anything about no being approved.
He made the required corrections and mailed it back the next day or so. ;)
 
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Sure shot wv

New member
Here's some of my experiences for everyone regarding this matter. To date I've never had a problem with a from 4 however I did with a form 1 back in the end of November. Here's my story,

In august I sent in a paper form 1 through a trust for an SBR. I was talking to my local class 3 dealer and he said what he had been doing is listing all the calibers that would be used as an SBR on the form 1. So that's what I did, under caliber I listed 22lr, 5.56nato, 9mm, and 300 blackout. Fast forward to the end of November and I got a letter and 2 form 1 forms sent back to me from the ATF. They said I could only list one caliber on the form. I called my buddy and told him what was going on. He called the ATF and got the scoop for me. So I called the ATF to verify what he had been told and here's what they said. If you are going to be using additional calibers or configurations of the SBR only list one on the form 4. Then send in 2 copies of a separate list titled additional configurations with caliber, barrel length, overall length etc. so that's what I did. It was approved on December 23rd and I got my stamp on the 29th I think.

Anyway my point being the ATF was helpful and I didn't have to start the process all over. Total time was a little over 4 months with that error. My last 2 form 4's have been done in just over 3 months. So far all seems good with me. Granted all things are subject to change but for now the ATF is doing ok in my book.
 
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