Guns not really the target here guys..

[Rob Pincus]

I hope everyone else is noticing that "Gun control" is NOT the main issue being talked about by most media and gov't officials.

I know how much we love to play the victim, but from Clinton's comments on the first day, to local politicans, to pundits on teh News shows right through Mrs. Clinton yesterday The rallying call has been the "Culture of Violence".

I have heard about 20 times more talk about cutting back on violent TV, music and movies than I have about gun control. Except for the Brady and Fienstien appearance on LKL a few days ago, almost no one has seriously mentioned it.

I think I've heard about the game Doom a lot more than I've heard about guns.

From what I see, we are not the main target here. Let's not get tooo defensive. I think it is the knee-jerk defensive position that lead the NRA to cancelling the show.. as opposed to taking the opportunity to make a positive, possibly pro-active, statement.

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-Essayons

 

[jimmy]

Rob--I expect you're right, and appreciate your post. On opening this morning's paper I was greeted by a virulent editorial cartoon claiming that children are being bloodily sacrificed on the altar of the Second Amendment. Like most of us, I've seen an awful lot of garbage like that in the press. So we're probably becoming oversensitive to it.

OTOH, as the memory of the real issues in the Colorado horror die down, I wouldn't be surprised to see the anti-gun zealots turn around the public perception of the event to suit their own agenda.

 

[DC]

Rob...
Logically you are correct, but you know damn well that is not how its going to play out by next week.
Read the letters to the editors, your local news and local radio talk shows.
As pointed out in other threads, the bombs have disappeared. It is guns and you know that the pols who talk culture and lack of parental influence today can't get support for legislation to censor vid games and the media....but come down hard on guns again and that is a couple hundred thousand votes.
The average person on the street is saying "Its guns".

Check out my thread on "Idiocy from NBC"

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"Quis custodiet ipsos custodes"

 

[Rob Pincus]

DC, I did read the post, in fact, it seems that those guys were defending the kids are victims, but I don't see where they actually attacked gun rights, except for cutting off and arguing with the pro-gun guy on the issue of responsibility.


Now here this:

I KNEW this was coming:

Dave Thomas, the DA in the Columbine Case, just blamed "Dungeons & Dragon's type Role playing" as the reason these kids were desensitized to violence.

Who the hell is this guy to call a press conference to lecture on the causes of teen violence? The way I see it, he should be researching the possible prosecution of conspirators and/or the parents, not blaming Movies or Games that millions of kids have played or watched and not been so "desensitized" that they dealt with a little name calling by blowing away a dozen kids.

 

[DC]

Rob...

I agree with you. However, and you know this, next week or next month all of the D&D, vid games, lackadaisical parents, just plain bad kids, etc will be forgotten and or ignored...it is and will be guns once again. The people on the streets are already blaming the guns and that is what the pols will listen to. Its a gimme vote getter.

This morning on my local radio station: you can call in and state your opinions....over 80% of the women were railing about guns...I called and defended guns in a very rational mode and mentioned all the bombs and the lack of parental notice. Then some other women called and vilified me!! Said with a mother like me, my son would grow up to be a killer. And I live in a rural ag county.....alas way too many LA yuppies have moved in.

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"Quis custodiet ipsos custodes"

 

[Rob Pincus]

You may be right about what will happen weeks from now. However, there has been much undercurrent talk of censoring and in other was restricting the amount of violence in gmaes and movies.. perhaps a whole new body of legislation will be brought forth...

In tha back of my mind I wonder if the NRA, et al, shouldn't try to jump on that bandwagon..

Then I wonder how I feel about losing 1st amendmen rights instead of 2nd amendment ones.

It is an ugly political situation no matter how we look at it.

 

[bookkie]

Rob:

You know that I respect your opinion, but things are already moving. CA yesterday passed a law in the assembly on gun control. An emergency measure. Did not hear exactly what it was dealing with... Also heard on the news this morning where Clinton will push for a waiting period in a couple of weeks as a result. He does not want to do it right now out of respect for the families.

Rest assured, there will be a full blown attack as a result. It has already started.

Richard

 

[Mike Spight]

Rob: You're correct about the other side seeming to lay off...I noticed the same thing myself, as have other posters. I tend to agree with bookie and DC...the #@%*storm is just building now...they will release it full force when the last child from Littleton is laid to rest. Like I suggested in another thread a day or two ago, now might be a good time to send a check to the RKBA organization of your choice. They're gonna be going through their funds like you know what through a goose for the next few months. By the way, I put my money where my mouth is about one hour ago when I sent a check to my RKBA organization of choice.

 

[thaddeus]

Rob,

I have been trying to find the good side of things too. There are a lot of people that are saying that it is silly and absurd to blame guns.
But, I see a storm brewing. I can't read all the posts here so someone may have already posted this, but check out this report below. It verifies exactly what DC is saying. It says verbatim that Clinton is about to unleash a new wave of gun control acts next week.

http://cnn.com/ALLPOLITICS/stories/1999/04/22/reno.littleton/

May God help us,
thaddeus

 

[Rob Pincus]

I may indeed be looking for a good sign, but in the end the legislation will likely come.

It would suck if we end up in the ultimate fight for our guns because of a few kids who couldn't handle their self-determined position in the social hiearchy of the high school.

 

[Paul B.]

Thaddeus. I just got off the phone with a member of CCRKBA soliciting donations. Chuckie "****h**d" Schumer has introduces legislation for a 10 day waiting period on all firearm sales including gun shows and private sales as well.
It's time we started fighting back hard guys. We keep compromising our gun rights away, as a a piece of wood gets whittled down, so do our rights.
Paul B.
COMPROMISE IS NOT AN OPTION!

 

[.]

The bottom line from the crystal ball is:....
See the "BOHICA" thread.

 

[jimmy]

Clinton and Schumer both know that a waiting period would have had no more effect on the Colorado carnage than the man in the moon. A waiting period is completely irrelevant.

These guys have just been waiting for a tragedy to occur so they could roll their long-prepared proposals out in front of the public. Real opportunists, milking the misery of others for what it's worth to their agenda.

Regardless of how anyone feels about guns, these two little Macchiavellis--that is, Clinton and Schumer--should be despised for what they're doing.

[This message has been edited by jimmy (edited April 23, 1999).]

 

[Keith Lerwick]

Lets blame the society for the way people relate to one another. There seem to be no love in the world for our fellow man.

I don't think games and TV caused those children to act the way they do. If it really desensitizes a person how come all of those kids in CO that witnessed this are about crazy with grief. The fact is that this society breeds unstable people who can't cope with reality or either can't function as a part of society. If we want to blame someone, blame the parents for not recognizing the signs that these children had problems


GOOD OLE CONSEVATIVE FROM TN
Keith

 

[Paul B.]

You know Keith, on the average, you might be right. But, what about the kid who is borderline unstable? Who, for some reason or other prefers to live oin a fantasy world, where in a game like WolF 3D, he is THE hero, killing all the Nazis, including Der Fuhrer himself? Can it not be possible, that he might slip from reality (from playing a game) to a fantasy, killing all the imagined enemy,(the kids that pick on him at school)? He's playing the game for real.
And the title of this thread notwithstanding, guns are the target. Slick Willie, on the tube, in a sound bite today, said he was going to try and get more gun legislation. Chuckie Schumer is drafting a bill to inflict a 10 day waiting period on all gun sales, to go along with all the Brady BS already in effect. This would not only include dealer sales, but gun shows, and non gun show private sales. Big brother strikes again. We're in trouble, folks.
Paul B.

COMPROMISE IS NOT AN OPTION!

 

[Rob Pincus]

Okay I officially admit that I must have been a little nutzo when I convinced myself that the liberals were going to take this one out on anything besides guns.

Clinton reiterated plans to make private gun transfers illegal in his weekly radio addresst his morning.

 

[Rob Pincus]

FWIW,

The first lawsuit to come from Denver has been from a group of parents against many media interests, including the makers and distributors of the film "Basketball Diaries."

 

[Grayfox]

Most of you are looking at this as an either, or situation. The way I see it both the First and Second Ammendments are about to get trashed. I think we're all in deep trouble here.

 

[DC]

The deal maker will be when Sarah Brady publically comes out against Hollywood and publically supports lawsuits and legislation regulating movies, etc

Can you say kill the golden goose? Won't happen, most of HCI money is from Hollywood.
Hollywood will not support any threats to the 1stA. Hollywood is the bulk of liberal money and strength. 1stA is how they got rich.

For at least a number of years, there will be no legislated threat to the 1stA...legislation does not include civil suits and Executive Orders

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"Quis custodiet ipsos custodes"



[This message has been edited by DC (edited April 25, 1999).]

 

[Jonny525]

Actually everyone needs to bring it down a little bit farther. All of this legislation and critisism is all about one thing. Our freedom. I don't care whether its about guns of media or whatever the heck they want to get rid of. It all has to do with our freedom. Our right to bear arms or our right to watch what we want. The only way to fix it is to start at the bottom. Parents have to teach their children not to watch violent shows and above all teach them how to use a gun safely. Our society has lost a lot of freedom. I would like to challenge everyone to read the Declaration of Independence and compare us and our government to the colonists and their oppressors. I'm not saying its time to rise up because we can fix ours. We have representation. Just read it and ask yourself who you think was more oppressed? Them or us?