Guide rods?

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fyrestarter

New member
Since people rarely reply in "The Smithy", I thought I'd posit this question here. I'm thinking of replacing the standard 1911 spring guides with full-length guide rods. Why? Who knows. My question is, has anyone experienced any marked improvement in accuracy with full length guide rods in their 1911s? And, if I do make such a change, would it be better to go with the once piece or two piece models? And is there anything else I'd need to change? Thanks.
 
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blades67

New member
A full length guide rod won't make a properly fitted 1911 more accurate. The fit of the locking lugs (barrel to slide), barrel to bushing and bushing to slide will make or break the guns accuracy for the most part. A full length guide rod will extend the life of your recoil spring many times beyond standard plug and guide.

I prefer a one-piece guide rod. I dislike two-piece guide rods as they require that you have and Allen-wrench to field strip the pistol and they have a nasty habit of becoming loose at the worst possible time and sending half the rod down range. In either case the replacement guide rod will come with the required open-faced spring plug and it is a simple remove & replace operation.
 
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Majic

New member
Basically you will get to spend money on your pistol and show it off to your buddies. Functionally you won't be getting nothing except to make disassembly a little harder and a tiny bit of extra weight up front.
 
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Arc Angel

New member
:rolleyes: Well, I guess it’s true confession time. I have full-length guide rods in all of my semi-auto pistols. Are they an advantage; well, some people would say; ‘No!’ My personal experience has been that they seem to improve reliability and smooth the pistol out between shots.

Do they prevent, ‘spring kink’? A lot of people, including Rob Leatham don’t think so. I’m, also, aware that Charlie Petty and Dean Speir don’t recommend them; and these guys, usually, know what they’re talking about. Still, some of the best pistolsmiths in North America have seen fit to install them in my pistols; and, after many years and many thousands of rounds, I’ve never had a problem.

The real question is; ‘If I had it to do over, again, would I do it?’ On the Glocks the answer is easy: I’d switch to Wolff Gunsprings all steel guide rods in a heartbeat. Full length guide rods would, also, go into my Browning P-35’s. As for the Colt 1911’s, well, probably not. If Rob Leatham can live without them, then, I wouldn’t spend the money twice. The only unresolved question I have in mind is, ‘What’ happens to the frame with 22# springs and hot hard ball ammo? Here, there might be an advantage to a full length rod. The well-known gunsmith who built my IPSC pistols, apparently, thought so; and, as I've said, in 20 some odd years of use I've never personally had a problem. ;)
 
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Majic

New member
‘What’ happens to the frame with 22# springs and hot hard ball ammo?
Click to expand...
As there is no room for the spring to do nothing but compress and relax in the frame tunnel, what else could happen?
 
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JohnK

New member
As Blades67 said if the link and lugs are fit properly it won't help. If they're loose something like Wilsons Group Gripper can make it quite a bit more accurate, it did in my cheap Norinco 1911. In that case though the link is relaced along with the full length guide rod which includes a small spring that puts tension on the link making the barrel engage the lugs better. THAT is what makes the full length Wilson Group Gripper make some 1911's shoot more accurately.

A friend of mine on the US Army pistol team said they used full length guide rods for a while but doesn't anymore. They didn't find any significant advantage to using them on their custom fitted match guns. So, I have one on my Norinco but I wouldn't bother if I had a Kimber, Ed Brown, Heinie etc.
 
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AngusPodgorney

New member
Arc Angel, how do you know that Rob Leathem does not like or use FLGR's? I'm not doubting you but a couple weeks ago I was in a store and I told the little lady that FLGR's wren't necessary and she went down the list of all the people she "Knows" in the shooting sports that use them. First on her list was Rob. I would love to see something in print somewhere.

Thanks,

Ed
 
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fyrestarter

New member
From Springfield's Web site, regarding the specifications on Leatham's TGO 1:

National Match 2 Piece Full Length Stainless Steel Guide Rod

http://www.springfield-armory.com/TGO.shtml

Assuming that Leatham designed the gun to reflect equipment that he actually uses, it stands to reason then that he does, in fact, use Full-length guide rods. Although I doubt that adding them to my Colts is going to help me match Rob's accomplishments.

Couldn't hurt, though :)
 
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Arc Angel

New member
Arc Angel, how do you know that Rob Leatham does not like or use FLGR's? I'm not doubting you but a couple weeks ago I was in a store and I told the little lady that FLGR's weren't necessary and she went down the list of all the people she "Knows" in the shooting sports that use them. First on her list was Rob. I would love to see something in print somewhere.
Click to expand...

Assuming that Leatham designed the gun to reflect equipment that he actually uses, it stands to reason then that he does, in fact, use Full-length guide rods. Although I doubt that adding them to my Colts is going to help me match Rob's accomplishments.
Click to expand...

:eek: Yup, you guys are correct; and here’s the proof:

http://www.ambackforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=1540&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

Sorry, don’t know where I got that from. I'll try to be more careful in the future. Thanks for helping me get it straight. (I hope this doesn't have a negative impact on my credibility with beautiful women!) :eek:
 
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Denny Hansen

Staff Emeritus
I can live without 'em. First, I've never seen a 1911 malfunction due to a "kinked" recoil spring--never. Second, with a FLGR you have two male parts running in and out of two female parts and the barrel tilts downward (breech end) as it unlocks. Unless the person who assembled the pistol knows what he was doing, and that's becoming more and more rare, they can cause problems.

There was a time when the 1911 was the single most reliable pistol available--and then people started "fixing" them.

Denny
 
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Brian D.

New member
I tend to think of 'em like "dealer-installed rustproofing" or floormats for a nominal upcharge. ;) One 1911 I use for games only, 9mm set up for speed steel, has a two piece rod installed purely to add a bit of weight. Dang thing tries to unscrew itself once a match (85 rounds or so), always gotta remind myself to tighten the thing down between stages. Honestly, if this match involved shooter movement or a l-o-n-g horizontal sweep of the target arrays, I'd take it out to reduce the heft.
 
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M2HB

New member
Those sure are nice guns Rob Leatham designed for SA. Are they supposed to be like the guns he uses? If so, I noticed that they are all in 45acp. I thought he shot 38 super in the matches. Just Curious!
 
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