Girls and Guns

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KyJim

New member
Have you ever noticed how the guys here fall all over themselves to help the ladies on firearms questions? :) For example, a lot of posts at http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=414947

It reminds me of some undercover auto repair investigation stuff I was involved with a number of years ago. We sent Joe Average into City A and several places tried to rip him off (most were honest).

Then, figuring crooked garages would take advantage of a woman even more, we sent a female with a car into City B. The problem is she was young, attractive, and wore short shorts. Guys came spilling out of the garages to help. :D Didn't find any cheaters that day.
 
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Glenn E. Meyer

New member
There are several feminist oriented pro gun books. One thing they mention is that when they go to the range, guys flock to them and lots of time, proclaim their ignorance as the women know more. They also want to get touchy to help them with their 'grip' - which off course necessitates a huggy position.

It creeps them out.
 
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sserdlihc

New member
I didn't respond to the thread because I didn't feel as though I had anything to add. After reading through the thread I didn't find to be "a lot of posts". No more so than any "newbie" post.
 
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dnr1128

New member
An attractive woman will get attention no matter what she's doing, but even more so when she's with a firearm. Most men find a woman with a gun sexy.

I can only speak for myself, but I would feel uncomfortable "helping" a woman with her grip in any way other than manipulating her hands. I wouldn't be wrapping her arms around her or anything like that. I wouldn't do that with a guy, and I won't do it with a woman.
 
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johnwilliamson062

Moderator
I love how old married men get all upset about younger single guys being overly nice to a woman who might share some interests.

The poster in that thread:
1. May or may not be attractive. She didn't post a picture.
2. Is divorced and refers to herself as a "chick." I don't know any women my age who use the word "chick." My guess as to her age was that she is about 35 to 40 as that term was popular in late 80s early nineties teen movies. I am 25. Even if she has the looks she probably isn't interested in dating a 25 year old.

OF course, I made all of these evaluations as I read the post, so you do have a point, as I would not have looked into the info presented to guess an age on a male poster. Even so, I figured there was not much chance I would date her and I still replied. I generally try to be helpful and positive to any non-WASP looking person I run across in a shooting situation. I do a fair amount of 2A lobbying and not having "minorities" always hurts us. besides the overriding theme of the posters preceding me was buy a tiny 38/357 snub, which I thought was a terrible idea.

If I were 35 and living in Arkansas maybe I would have offered to meet her at a range and let her try some of my firearms. Replying to a post with what you think is helpful information is a far cry from getting "huggy" with a stranger at the range. I wouldn't get "huggy" with my GF at the range.

Also, did you grow up shooting or did you have to break in to the sport at some time in your life?
I think people who grew up shooting don't realize how difficult it is for EVERYONE to pick up shooting later in life without LE/.mil/romance pushing you that direction. You show up to most gun shops/ranges with no idea what you are talking about and people there are anything but helpful.

I did not live in a place where I could own a gun until I moved into an apartment off-campus at just shy of 20(parents wanted no guns in the house, I didn't know anyone who was a shooter well enough to leave my guns with, and obviously dorms don't allow guns). OSU had a pistol and rifle club. 22s in the ROTC building range and I joined those clubs and went as much as I could although it always seemed I had classes. Picked up some safety and a little experience but not much, so it was even a little easier for me than for most.
Buying my first gun from a gun shop was probably the worst retail experience I have ever had and I expect it to be the worst experience I EVER have. I was to varying degrees ignored, bullied, disparaged, etc. It isn't like I just went to one store either. No one was helpful, everyone tried to sell me something totally different then I asked about b/c they had it in stock, I was told all sorts of incorrect info that I then checked on and found to be false.
 
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Moriah

New member
You're pretty good at your guesses, JW062... I'm 30, born in 1980. :)

I received several PMs in response to that thread to take care and be careful who I trusted, and it was good advice that I plan to take.

Thanks for the warnings about the "touchy-feely" people. I'm not exactly the kind of person who likes having my personal space invaded by strange men... prime example was when I was having a bad day at work. A very sweet male coworker of mine patted me on the back -- but I didn't know him all that well and wasn't expecting it at all so it startled the heck out of me. I turned around and hissed "Don't TOUCH me!" ... poor guy, was just trying to help...

I'm planning on going to the local firing range tomorrow night for a class that they have for women as an intro to handguns -- it's pretty much free, just the cost of targets, firearm rental if you don't have one already, and a box of ammo. My hope is that if anyone is going to have to help me adjust my grip, etc, that it'll be the instructor and not just J. Random Guy.

I don't know if I'll be the only one in the class tomorrow night or not, but if they offer such a class they likely have a few female regulars there. One good thing about us girls when we're in predominately male environments -- we stick together, and generally warn other women about people who are creepy or bad news. Hopefully there won't be any warnings that need to be passed on to me, but if there is someone to watch out for I'll likely hear about them pretty quickly if I make friends with the ladies there.
 
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Sefner

New member
A local indoor range here has a Ladies Night twice a month. It is two hours. During this time, no men are allowed in the range, blinds are pulled over the windows (to prevent peeking SOs), and the instructors are all experienced females. The cost is only $14 plus ammo and the girls can shoot as many guns as they like from the case. Hearing and eye protection included. Every male who has taken their SO to try it has said it was a gift from God. Why? Females are not reticent to shooting. They are reticent to shooting with males. There are varying reasons for this (as I'm sure Glenn can attest to). Introducing females to shooting with just females removes all of those reasons. The feedback has been awesome. It gives girls a chance to find out what gun/caliber fits them the best (as opposed to a guy picking it for them God forbid), learn some self-defense theory, and some range time. Also the ladies like it too :D

Every range should do this. Contact your ranges and try to set something up.
 
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KyJim

New member
Moriah --
Don't be put off shooting by my post. Shooting is a great skill to have and a lot of fun to practice.

I love how old married men get all upset about younger single guys being overly nice to a woman who might share some interests.
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Upset? Nope. I'm an old married guy and was just making an observation. Maybe a little envious? Hmmm....:)

Also, did you grow up shooting or did you have to break in to the sport at some time in your life?
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I pretty much grew up shooting. I learned on BB guns, a .22 pump air rifle, and a .22 Remington TargetMaster rifle (single shot). I'm old enough to remember spending a couple weeks with my cousin one summer and we went to the YMCA in downtown Indianapolis where we would shoot .22 rifles in a range in the basement. I didn't shoot handguns much until I was an adult.
 
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chris in va

New member
I don't treat women any differently than any other individual. If they need help and ask for it, I'll be happy to oblige. Otherwise it's just another day at the range.
 
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5.56RifleGuy

New member
The only time I have said anything to any lady on the range (other than my wife) was when her boyfriend/husband type person didnt bother to tell her about slide bite or why its not a good idea to have your thumb back behind the slide.

well, strike that. Also, when a young lady was shooting with no safety glasses. Id had to see someone lose an eye.
 
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Moriah

New member
Don't be put off shooting by my post. Shooting is a great skill to have and a lot of fun to practice.
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Oh, I'm not -- and I hope I didn't come across too weird by relating the whole personal space thing. It's kind of a joke up where I work, because yeah, I'm not fond of being touched by coworkers, tho I've never responded like I did to that poor guy because the set of circumstances (my Irish temper riled plus the startle value) never happened again. But I'm good friends with that guy now, and he is allowed to hug me. (It just took me knowing him a year.... heh)

I don't know many women who would appreciate this.
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For me, it depends on the situation, honestly. I may be slightly unique in that while I work in a male-dominated field (I'm a computer tech and there's only one other female in my entire building), I also was raised here in the South. I have no issues at all with courtesy being shown -- for example, I always thank people who hold doors for me, and I hold doors for others regardless of their gender. Courtesy and politeness are good.

If someone treats me like I don't know what I'm doing in a situation where I do, and it feels like it's because I'm female, I'll get a bit irritated (although I do try to have the courtesy not to show it)... but I also don't profess to know things I don't, and right now handguns qualify under the "stuff I don't know" category. :) So if someone offers pointers under the presumption that I don't know what's up, they're going to be right and I'm going to take those pointers with a smile and a sincere thank you -- even if they are presuming my ignorance has to do with being female. I'm an equal opportunity learner. :)
 
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dabigguns357

New member
It's about respect as an idividual,man or woman.I don't help unless there is an unsafe practice or i have been asked.

My wife and i went to pick her out a gun,most of the time i would say nothing unless she asked.I want her to feel like she can make her own decisions and that she's smart enough to make the right one.I did what i could to teach her and then got some outside help.Now she feels better and i'm proud of her.She went from hating guns to shooting and now she even carries.Funny thing about it all,it's the only time i didn't have to lift a finger to help her,i wished she would not let me help her more often:D

Show them you care and give them their space,it works every time.
 
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pgdion

New member
They also want to get touchy to help them with their 'grip'
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Yea, you know, I've always found that odd. Just like the tennis coach teaching form in the movies. When ever I try to help someone it's always watch how I do it and then tell them to try the same. To me demonstration is the best way to teach along with an explanation of why. Closest I've come to any touching is sometimes you have to actually grab the tool (tennis racket, gun, ect) and twist it or hold it to the right position. Or here's a good one, sometimes with younger Boy Scouts and trying to teach them the proper hand shake, you have to actually move their fingers to the right spot. Otherwise they just don't get it. :rolleyes:
 
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UniversalFrost

New member
They also want to get touchy to help them with their 'grip' - which off course necessitates a huggy position.

It creeps them out.
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yeah I took my wife out recently to shoot (she is getting to be a really good shot) and some old guys came over and attempted to "train" her. whilel i was over at the rifle range and she was at the pistol range.

Luckily a buddy of mine was the Range Officer that day and he gave me a quick call and I hurried over to shoo them away. I walked up as she was telling them off and I spoke up that they needed to quit bothering my wife. The last club meeting i was suprised to see one of the guys there and I told him if he tired that crap again I would make sure he never shot there again. We got into a heated discussion and the club president came over. i told him the issue we were dealing with and the president booted him on the spot due to unbecoming behavior he displayed while attempting to basicly get a free feel on my wife.

I really hate it when guys try to do stuff like this to women. it creeps them out and also gets their husbands and boy friends mad, plus it scares women away from ever coming back. only time i have ever tried something similiar was years ago when I was "teaching" a girl to play pool (she came onto me first). :D
 
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The Expert

New member
They also want to get touchy to help them with their 'grip' - which off course necessitates a huggy position.

It creeps them out.
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That's really wacky. When I help friends that are guy grip the gun right I never have to get "huggy" with them. Heck, when I coach my WIFE I've never had to.
 
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