German square-off: Walther P99 vs. HK USP compact. Is the HK too hot for Walther?

[defox]

How do you think the 'have it all' striker-fired gun (P99) measure up to the 'have it all' hammer fired gun (HK USPc).

Currently Walther is preparing to attack the HK USPs dominance in the German marketplace and the mid-premium market worldwide. A recent price reduction for the P99s have however shifted its positioning into the Glock price segment. Is Walther on a two-prong attack or were the USPs too hot to handle?

 

[Tamara]

Interestingly, Glocks cost more than USP's in der Vaterland.

When you factor global pricing in, things get weird, fast.

I think that in the US, HK was faced with low sales on the initial introduction of the USP, so moved it upmarket vs. the Glock and captured the Rainbow Six-tac-team market. Walther, despite having arguably one of the best entries in the parade, is faced with the same marketing problems that FN and Steyr (and SIG with their SIGpro, to a lesser extent) had; being late to the prom, and therefore having difficulty in gaining market exposure in the face of the HK and Glock juggernauts.

The price drop, combined with the James Bond marketing blitz, is a good first step.

 

[Rovert]

Tough question, but both the H/K and Sig are terrific guns. Hope to add one of each to my collection sometime soon. As to the Glock line, I'm not 'anti-Glock', but I, for one, would like to see the market 'unbrainwashed' and stop the lemmings from running off the cliff.

Bond, schmond... the P99 is just a great gun

 

[Mr. Pub]

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While the HK USP is a nice gun (I owned a full size in .40), I can't forgive HK for going backward in time by incorporating 1911 like features like hammer-fired, DA/SA and manual safety in order to supposedly kiss up to American customers. Their web site said that the USP was designed with input from the American consumer.

I don't imagine that these features are that popular in Europe - just guessing though.

.

 

[Tamara]

Heh...

Bond, schmond... the P99 is just a great gun

Tommy Lee Jones, Schmommy Lee... never mind...

Us TFLers can apparently make our own educated gun choices, but apparently some folks need a movie star's endorsement to get their synapses jump-started.

 

[dsk]

While the HK USP is a nice gun (I owned a full size in .40), I can't forgive HK for going backward in time by incorporating 1911 like features like hammer-fired, DA/SA and manual safety in order to supposedly kiss up to American customers. Their web site said that the USP was designed with input from the American consumer.

Yeah. Those damn Yankees don't know ANYTHING about guns. Especially what works. It's not like they ever get to actually hold one, 'ya know.

 

[Rovert]

LOL!

Tamara, I'm with you. WGAF what some joe blow actor says is good. As if anyone in Hollywood Kalifornia can actually OWN a real gun!!! Truth be told, I didn't even know this was the 'Bond' gun until after I bought it. I get my advice from TFL!

Although, there were some interesting sidearms in Men In Black.

 

[rogerdodger]

i like the P99 much better than the USP in 9mm.
I like the USP better in .40 Than the P99

P99 is awesome in 9mm
doesnt seem as smooth in .40

 

[Tamara]

Mr. Pub,

I can't forgive HK for going backward in time by incorporating 1911 like features like hammer-fired, DA/SA and manual safety in order to supposedly kiss up to American customers.

What's the diff between striker- and hammer-fired as far as "high-tech" goes? Both have been around since the dawn of time. If you want a USP with a smooth, snag-free profile, get one with a bobbed hammer; the backside's as smooth as any Glock or P99. As far as the "manual safety" goes, that's optional, too. You can get a decocker, or go lever-free with a DAO.

A completely modular fire-control system strikes me as pretty high-speed and not 1911-like at all.

As far as "kissing up to American customers", how many USP's sell to civilians in Europe versus how many sell to civilians in the US?

Addressing the lion's share of your market isn't "kissing up", it's just good bidness sense.

 

[Gunhead]

Well, the situation as I see here in Europe:

- The Walther P99 is unpopular (not a too good choice for sport), low sales, very few LE agencies adopted it. The P22 is also unpopular because of the quality (zinc alloy slide), and you can buy a lot better .22 pistols for that money.

- The HK USP is gaining ground against the Glock (better sport models, I see more and more shooters in the matches with HKs), a number of LE agencies, SWAT/CT teams adopted it,

The Walther has no other option but to lower their prices if they want to stay in the market.

 

[mussi]

The police of Kanton Basel-Land uses the HK USP compact 9mm. They didn't choose a SIG, although the 228 is a bit smaller and at least as good.

 

[Mr. Pub]

Tamara

What's the diff between striker- and hammer-fired as far as "high-tech" goes?

I believe that this deserves a separate thread. I will create one in the general handgun room.

If you want a USP with a smooth, snag-free profile, get one with a bobbed hammer

Why bother? If you take away the minor advantage a hammer-fired system may have of manual cocking & decocking, then why bother - just go striker-fired.

Addressing the lion's share of your market isn't "kissing up", it's just good bidness sense.

Nothing wrong with listening to the consumer, however, left on their own they will always revert to what they know, what they are comfortable with. Sometimes a company has to introduce new features that weren't requested in order to change the ground rules as did Glock. It took guts, but it helped them to capture a large chunk of the market.



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