I am headed out camping this weekend and decided to open carry my sig 229. I just recently got the gun and have only put winchester white box fmj ammo through it. so the question is go with what is underpowered, but I know works reliably, or go buy some self defense ammo and hope it works if I need it. I know ideally i should have put 100-200 rounds of good ammo through it, but i haven't gotten around to it. is cheapo wwb ammo that weak, or just less than ideal?
fmj or jhp
- Thread starter Recon7
- Start date
Love&Hate12
New member
There are three gun makers that I trust to feed just about any round out of the box.
Glock, Sig and H&K
Get any of the normally loaded factory JHP's and you won't have an issue.
I've even shot mags of different loadings such as 124GD+p, 147 Hydrashok, 127 rangert t +p+ in the sig and no hiccup what so ever.
FMJ is not weak but it does not dump it's energy or expand to make a greater effect on target and I would never take FMJ in a handgun unless it's all I had.
Glock, Sig and H&K
Get any of the normally loaded factory JHP's and you won't have an issue.
I've even shot mags of different loadings such as 124GD+p, 147 Hydrashok, 127 rangert t +p+ in the sig and no hiccup what so ever.
FMJ is not weak but it does not dump it's energy or expand to make a greater effect on target and I would never take FMJ in a handgun unless it's all I had.
I'm going to have to agree with Love&Hate12. I have heard great things about feeding reliability with Sig.
I dont think you should have a problem with the JHP's, as long as its name brand and factory loaded. I keep Corbon's Pow'R Ball 135gr in my G27 (.40) and it proves to be very reliable.
115gr Corbon is rated at over 1400fps...and would be worth looking into.
On the other hand, its always good to go with what you know. And in this case, you already know what will work.
I dont think you should have a problem with the JHP's, as long as its name brand and factory loaded. I keep Corbon's Pow'R Ball 135gr in my G27 (.40) and it proves to be very reliable.
115gr Corbon is rated at over 1400fps...and would be worth looking into.
On the other hand, its always good to go with what you know. And in this case, you already know what will work.
Best to have a round that you know works well in your handgun. I'm partial to Winchester Silvertips in my revolver, but did have a couple of failure-to-feed problems with them in my Marlin carbine today. The likelyhood that you'll actually need the gun is probably somewhere between slim and none, but I'd rather have anything that functioned reliably.
chrisandclauida2
New member
energy dumping is a myth and non issue. it isn't worth squat and has no effect on stopping someone.
think about your fist dumping its energy into someone you hit. you delivering the energy in your swing into what ever you hit.
to dump a bullets energy in the manner intended to deliver impact you would not want the bullet to penetrate but hit the body. much like the intended cause of less lethal rounds like bean bags and baton rounds.
bullets stop people thru a few avenues. one is they are conditioned to fall when shot thru watching all the movies and video games. otherwise bullets dont knock people back knock them down unless the body shuts down
the body shuts down a few ways. one is it bleeds out. two is a cns stop hit which is a target a size of a walnut behind the nose slightly lower than the eyes. three is the cns is over whelmed by pain and other signals. of the three only the second is a one shot stop and very difficult to make. even if you make pelvis hits and break it enough to cause a collapse you cant count on a fight stopper. shot placement is important cause shooting someone in the foot or ass or arm is not the most expedient way to induce the stopping of an attacker.
to answer your question hollow points do more tissue damage to get to the first and last stopping avenue thus is why they are used. that and the fact most fmj over penetrate. this said even the best hollow points can clog making their means to expansion mute.
i would pick hollow point ammo. this is because modern hollow point ammo performs the stop quicker unless you hit the off switch.
remember even dead men with half their head shot off will still be able to kill you. there is only one off switch, remember that. this the majority of time a head shot will stop all but the most determined attacker.
when someone is attacking they are almost primal meaning they usually aren't think several steps ahead like a chess game. their actions are driven thru instinct so if you stop higher brain functions Thu certain head shots they can still kill you.
i say all this to dispel rumor and theory that abounds. things like one shot stop. energy dumping blowing people off their feet shooting them and they fall. these and many others do one thing. their ideas when drilled into someones head can cause hesitation. double tapping then stopping,that hesitation can get you killed.
no matter what ammo you use remember no bullet caliber or gun is magic. only you dogged will to live and kill what threatens you and unrelenting attack when life is in danger will keep you alive.
shoot what your comfortable with. shoot till the threat is gone.
I'm sure some will argue that I'm wrong and that is fine. we all know the saying about opinions,mine included,everyone has one and they all stink but it doesnt matter how much till your eating in the bathroom. lol
there can be one shot stop formulas and power tables energy dumping scales etc. everyday a new idea will come along.
think about your fist dumping its energy into someone you hit. you delivering the energy in your swing into what ever you hit.
to dump a bullets energy in the manner intended to deliver impact you would not want the bullet to penetrate but hit the body. much like the intended cause of less lethal rounds like bean bags and baton rounds.
bullets stop people thru a few avenues. one is they are conditioned to fall when shot thru watching all the movies and video games. otherwise bullets dont knock people back knock them down unless the body shuts down
the body shuts down a few ways. one is it bleeds out. two is a cns stop hit which is a target a size of a walnut behind the nose slightly lower than the eyes. three is the cns is over whelmed by pain and other signals. of the three only the second is a one shot stop and very difficult to make. even if you make pelvis hits and break it enough to cause a collapse you cant count on a fight stopper. shot placement is important cause shooting someone in the foot or ass or arm is not the most expedient way to induce the stopping of an attacker.
to answer your question hollow points do more tissue damage to get to the first and last stopping avenue thus is why they are used. that and the fact most fmj over penetrate. this said even the best hollow points can clog making their means to expansion mute.
i would pick hollow point ammo. this is because modern hollow point ammo performs the stop quicker unless you hit the off switch.
remember even dead men with half their head shot off will still be able to kill you. there is only one off switch, remember that. this the majority of time a head shot will stop all but the most determined attacker.
when someone is attacking they are almost primal meaning they usually aren't think several steps ahead like a chess game. their actions are driven thru instinct so if you stop higher brain functions Thu certain head shots they can still kill you.
i say all this to dispel rumor and theory that abounds. things like one shot stop. energy dumping blowing people off their feet shooting them and they fall. these and many others do one thing. their ideas when drilled into someones head can cause hesitation. double tapping then stopping,that hesitation can get you killed.
no matter what ammo you use remember no bullet caliber or gun is magic. only you dogged will to live and kill what threatens you and unrelenting attack when life is in danger will keep you alive.
shoot what your comfortable with. shoot till the threat is gone.
I'm sure some will argue that I'm wrong and that is fine. we all know the saying about opinions,mine included,everyone has one and they all stink but it doesnt matter how much till your eating in the bathroom. lol
there can be one shot stop formulas and power tables energy dumping scales etc. everyday a new idea will come along.
wolfy692005
New member
i have the sig p239 and i shoot JHP's though it all the time no problem... rangers to be honest.
i would not go with out JHP IMHO
i would not go with out JHP IMHO
chris,
I don't think anyone will argue with you, just wonder whether you actually answered his question!
No doubt on choosing HP once it is proven in your weapon, but I would take the FMJ for now and KNOW it will work. Something about carrying an unproven system gives me the willys...Sig reliability reputation or not.
I don't think anyone will argue with you, just wonder whether you actually answered his question!
No doubt on choosing HP once it is proven in your weapon, but I would take the FMJ for now and KNOW it will work. Something about carrying an unproven system gives me the willys...Sig reliability reputation or not.
TacticalDefense1911
New member
If you are protecting yourself from animals take the FMJ. If it is people you are worried about take a defensive hollowpoint load. As for the energy dumping/neutral shock theory, that is a discussion for another day, but I do take issue with someone saying it has no affect on stopping someone.
If there is someplace at your destination where you can practice with your gun, take enough JHP to test and use if they work. But also bring some FMJ just in case.
If there is no place at your destination where you can practice with your gun, take FMJ because you know it works.
Whatever "faults" FMJ may have compared to JHP, it was used successfully prior to the introduction of JHP. Just because JHP may be an improvement over FMJ does not mean FMJ is worthless.
If there is no place at your destination where you can practice with your gun, take FMJ because you know it works.
Whatever "faults" FMJ may have compared to JHP, it was used successfully prior to the introduction of JHP. Just because JHP may be an improvement over FMJ does not mean FMJ is worthless.
Easy answer. Dump your sig, get a wheelgun. Then you can do both at the same time!
In all seriousness though, my Taurus is stocked with 158gr SJHP. I have never drawn it in anger, but if I do, I trust the .357 to do the job.
Now, my backup gun a CZ-70 (with better sights), I carry FMJ in. I'm dubious about the penetrating ability of the little .32 ACP, so I'm comfortable with the lack of expansion in favor of penetration.
In all seriousness though, my Taurus is stocked with 158gr SJHP. I have never drawn it in anger, but if I do, I trust the .357 to do the job.
Now, my backup gun a CZ-70 (with better sights), I carry FMJ in. I'm dubious about the penetrating ability of the little .32 ACP, so I'm comfortable with the lack of expansion in favor of penetration.
azredhawk44
Moderator
Recon7:
You chose correctly, IMO.
You never tested JHP reliability, and you intentionally mentioned that you were going out hiking, which implies furry, toothed critters. This is traditionally the domain of magnum revolvers... .357 and .44, with a healthy respectful nod for the .45acp and .45LC. With the advent of the 10mm, the automatic has made some headway into critter management.
9mm was meant for people, not critters. I'm not a 9mm basher... I keep a 9mm loaded at home for defense.
If you didn't have anything else, you were a step ahead of the game carrying SOMETHING. But FMJ will be your ammo of choice when carrying in the woods. The ideal round to carry is not a hollowpoint, but rather a flat-nosed and hard round that doesn't expand at all, but crushes bone rather than being deflected by it, and still feeds reliably in your gun. Hard to find in 9mm without handloading.
You chose correctly, IMO.
You never tested JHP reliability, and you intentionally mentioned that you were going out hiking, which implies furry, toothed critters. This is traditionally the domain of magnum revolvers... .357 and .44, with a healthy respectful nod for the .45acp and .45LC. With the advent of the 10mm, the automatic has made some headway into critter management.
9mm was meant for people, not critters. I'm not a 9mm basher... I keep a 9mm loaded at home for defense.
If you didn't have anything else, you were a step ahead of the game carrying SOMETHING. But FMJ will be your ammo of choice when carrying in the woods. The ideal round to carry is not a hollowpoint, but rather a flat-nosed and hard round that doesn't expand at all, but crushes bone rather than being deflected by it, and still feeds reliably in your gun. Hard to find in 9mm without handloading.