Duty weapon and CCW, Suggestions?

[Mike86]

Since I'm trying to get on with the local police reserves and they don't like the idea of my Taurus 608 I'm in need of a pistol. After a little shopping I'm leaning toward the Ruger P944 decocker (.40 S&W). I've shot 9mm's and found the recoil to be nothing compared to my wheelgun but I've never had the oppertunity to shoot .40 or .45 cal which are the two calibers I've narrowed it down to (no 9mm's). The pistol will also be used as my and my wifes carry gun depending on the situation. We both really liked the feel of the Ruger in our hand compared to the Glock, Sig, and Beretta. S&W's are not an option as with the Hi-Point. To make it that much more complicated for me to use it as a CCW it has to be compact enough to be easily hidden because I'm only 125 lbs (27" waist).

Can anybody offer a good comparison for recoil in those two calibers to my .357 or suggestions for other manufacturers/models?

 

[The Walrus]

How about a CZ-75BD? Decocker, DA/SA, and 15 rds available when you need it most.

Alternately, for something smaller, a CZ-75 PCR or the CZ-75 P-01 when they become available in a couple of months.

 

[Modifiedbrowning]

If you can shoot a Walther P99 in .40 cal. It has adjustable grips so should work for both of you.

 

[Mike86]

Yeah, I've been wanting to look at the CZ's and never thought about a Walther, so thank you for the suggestions, I'll check into them.

Should I make it that much more complicated and say I want ambi safties(sp?) since my 10 year old son is a southpaw?

 

[branrot]

Ruger autos seem to be built like tanks, but I've never liked them because I feel that they are designed for someone with bigger hands than me. You should make sure that this is not a problem for you or your wife.

My 2 .40's are the Glock 23 and the Sig 229. If you don't like either of those, and the Walther doesn't suit you (it's an excellent gun), you can also check out the HK USP series, either compact or full sized. Somewhat less popular are the bigger bore Berettas like the 96 and the Cougar.

 

[Blue Duck357]

If I understand your question you will be using the gun as both a exposed duty weapon and a concealed carry arm. If so I'd guess a compact model would be good for both roles, though maybe not best for either.

I had a Glock 23 mentioned above and it was a good but not great gun for me. Too much recoil, muzzel blast for my taste and too little accuracy compared to my 19- but hey that was just me you might love it. Sig 229 is also available in .40 and the extra weight might bring the recoil down a bit, but muzzel flip will be worse due to the higher slide. G-30 might be a bit small for duty carry but has a good reputation, and I found the one I shot to actually be much easier on me the the 23. Just the first three compacts I would look at off the top of my head.

Ruger has a good reputation but it's in all practical respects a full size gun. I've carried full size concealed year round but it takes work and most people tend to sell for something smaller when they get bored with the hassel.

Be sure to check and see if your Department has an "approved list" as most do. Oddly though I hear good things about them, I've never seen a CZ on any approved list anywhere.

Just my 2 cents, Blueduck

 

[Arub]

I have both the Ruger P944DC (decocker) and a Glock 23. The P944 is very reliable and accurate. Recoil/muzzle flip not bad. Downside is long double action trigger pull on first shot and a DA trigger resistance around 12 to 13 lbs. Single action pull is about 5 to 5.5 lbs. Can be concealed with an IWB holster. May be a hair large for the wife.

The 23 is smaller, lighter, and just as accurate as any other pistol going in the non-customized market. It's a little easier to conceal than the Ruger. Trigger pull comes in at between 5 and 5.5lbs, can be lightened with a 3.5lb connector, but the 3.5lb connector is not recommended for defense and police work. An accidental discharge is too easy in a stress filled situation with the lighter trigger pull. The Glock costs about $125 or so more than the P944.

Both calipers are a concern for the wife. They're both a little more snappy than a 9mm. If she can handle a .357 (608 a .357magnum?) with magnum loads she should be able to accomodate either caliper.

 

[Pointblank2K]

I have to put my two cents in for the Ruger...I own the P94 .40cal and it's the most reliable accurate gun i've ever owned...could never quite figure out the difference between the P94 and the P944? My P94 has a decocker...DA/SA...what's the difference? if anyone knows I would enjoy the feedback...they are big and built like a tank... I trust my life to mine,
Tony.

 

[Mike86]

Arub, I really appreciate the input.

Yes my wife handles the 608 just fine with some really hot .357 handloads. I'm actually the smaller of the two of us so she'd be the one that would actually be trying to conceal it on some (but not all) of our trips out when we'd be bringing a weapon. I have several ideas for her to be able to hide it succesfully. (read: fanny pack with built in holster)

I ruled out the Glock mostly because it's ugly and a compact, I'm looking for a medium frame if you will and The Glock 23 was just small enough in our hands to be uncomfortable. I'll admit, most of our gripes could be eliminated with the right grips.

I'm still not opposed to a .45 ACP, anybody have any input on those in terms of recoil or size?

 

[asleepinTucson]

If hand size and grip are an issue and Ruger is your preference, try their 45s. The p-90 and p-97 are single stack 45s than have a thinner grip and profile.

I have two rugers in 9mm and 45ACP and I am very pleased with them. I conceal them during winter months but the summer months belong to my Glock 27 and 38Spl snubby.

 

[dsk]

My vote would go to the HK USPc .40 Compact. It is nearly as small as the Glock 23, and its method of operation is much safer. It also has a grip size and shape that should be agreeable to almost everybody. As far as being ugly however, you'll have to decide what's more important to you.

 

[milcaztra]

If you prefer the Ruger to the Glock, Sig, and Beretta; I'd still try the .40 CZs....... wonderful ergonomics........ decocking models available. CZs are definitely one of the most comfortable pistols made. The .40 caliber models have full length slide rails for additional strength.

 

[Erik]

I recommend getting whichever pistol that your comfortable with that has (in order):

The slimmest slide width.
The slimmest grip width.
A good trigger reach. (With and without gloves. SA's are ideal, but you may or may not be able to consider them.)
Night sights. (Add 'em if you have to.)
A barrel length between 4 and 5 inches.
At least a 7+1 capacity.
An unloaded weight that you prefer between 20 and 40 ounces.

Let us know what you decide on.

 

[Chemistry]

The Ruger P94 is a heavy and bulky pistol. If you are going to try to use it as a concealed carry weapon, be prepared to spend lots of $$$ trying to find the right holster that will allow you to do so.

You stated you did not like the Glock, but have you had a chance to try the Springfield XD in the .40? For law enforcement, it has a 12 round capacity.

http://www.springfieldarmory.com/prod-xdpstl-xdetails.shtml

Other guns you may want to try:

HK USP (Full size or compact)
Sig P229
Sig Pro 2340

Any of the above mentioned guns are going to be easier to carry that the Ruger.

 

[Mike86]

Well I looked at a "Baby Eagle" today, I wish I would have gotten the exact model # but I didn't. I'm pretty sure thats what I'm going to be getting just what variation. I do know the one I looked at is a compact, 3.7" barrel, or 3-1/4" grip (can get a 3-3/4"), 1-1/8" slide width, and comes as both steel or polymer frames. The polymer frame is only 25 oz's, steel frame about 39 oz's. Available calibers are 9mm, .40 and .45 ACP. The specific one I saw today was .40 and all three have 10 rnd mags, although I don't know if higher capacity ones are available for LEO's.

Have any of you heard anything bad about the those?

Thanks for all the input and keep it comming.

 

[sundance43.5]

Why not get something with a name and a warranty? You've heard all of the positives about Ruger. I own a Ruger P90 and find it to be one of the best guns I've ever fired. It's accurate, reliable, and soft to shoot, even with +P loads. What more could you want?

Go Ruger!!!

Chris

 

[Powderman]

Purchasing your own firearm for duty can be kinda pricey. I know this.

You say that size is a concern, and you find the G23 just a bit small. Have you tried the G22? It is just a hair larger. It is, well, kinda between mid and full sized, at least to me.

The Ruger is a good choice. I carried a P90 for a while as a duty gun. Very nice. Extremely accurate, too--outshot a lot of the match guns I have fired, with very soft recoil for 230 grain ball.

As a beginning Reserve Officer, I would highly suggest carrying what your Department carries--unless you really have reservations concerning caliber or choice, or unless your Department has a liberal carry policy.

For a duty gun, are you mandated to carry double action? Or are you able and willing to train with a single action auto?

 

[chaim]

If you like the Baby Eagle definately check out the CZ. The Baby Eagle is a CZ clone with some minor changes (I believe the safety is slide mounted on the Eagle) and the CZ will be better quality.

If you want a compact version of a service pistol (one you can use as a service pistol yet, as a smaller guy, still conceal) they have two options. The CZ 75 Compact is the compact version of the CZ 75 (go figure). It is DA/SA with a safety that allows you to carry in condition one, "cocked and locked" (there is no decocker, you must decock it like a revolver). The CZ 75 PCR is the same gun but with a decocker, no condition one option, and it is alloy so it is lighter. On both the safety or decocker is framed mounted (where it should be ). Both are high quality, accurate and affordable guns.

Also, you should check out the Taurus PT 911/940/945. These (except the slightly larger PT 945) are about the same size as the CZ 75 Compact or PCR. They have a great safety that allows condition one carry and it can be used as a decocker (you can carry decocked with a DA first shot with the safety on or off). The metal framed Taurus autos are very good guns. The 911 is 9mm, the 940 is .40 and the .945 is .45acp.

I had a Ruger P89. It was a good gun but it isn't particularly refined. Depending upon what you are used to you may or may not like it. It will last as long as anything and I'd bet you'd never have any trouble but it just isn't very nice. Also, even the compact models are quite large. With your size if you want to conceal it on occasion I wouldn't even consider going larger or heavier than the P95 (9mm) or P97 (.45acp). The P94 is about the same size (just a tad bigger) and it is a .40 but it is heavier (the 97 and 95 are polymer framed the 94 is alloy).

Last, the SIG 239 is a good size for concealment and available in 9mm and .40 and it may be big enough for duty use. The P229 is a little bigger but also pretty compact. I don't think anyone needs to be reminded of the quality SIG builds into their guns (or the price).

 

[Arub]

Pointblank2K:

P94 is the designation for the 9mm model, P944 is the designation for the .40S&W. Mine is the KP944D (K=stainless slide P944=.40S&W D=decocker). A KP944 is stainless slide, .40cal, manual safety and a KP944DAO is the double action only model. No 'K' indicates blued model.

 

[Mike86]

Powderman, my department is real liberal about all of their policys for reserve officers. Firearms have to be 9mm, .40, or .45 ACP but exceptions can be granted by the range officer. We're submitting my .357 just to see if it gets approved but I don't really want to carry around a 4 lb revolver all day even if it is only 2 or 3 days a month. Besides, I've been wanting a .40 for about 5 years now and my wife is finally letting me get one. Price isn't a real concern for whatever I get, she gave me about a $550 limit that should cover it. If I don't have one right away they have 4 loaners, 2 .45's and 2 .40's so I can shop around untill I aquire my own.

I'm definatly going to look at the CZ's but it will be about two weeks before I get to (we have to travel out of town for the nearest dealer CZ dealer).