Dont Understand: DA RULES!

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Varmint Eviscerator

New member
Ok I see RUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUULES and rules and more rules concerning firearms-I however, have not a clue as to what half of them pertain to and in what circumstances do they qualify?
1) CCW, I understand the conceiled part-why cant you wear the gun "out"?
2) Caliber-above .50 is a no-no, then what about 60dynamite, 70nitro and 75 double rifles?
3) Adding to that, how come you can have a muzzle loading HOWITZER but you cant have a cartridge loading weapon over 50????
5) What's the 500ft from someones residence law? What happens if someone calls the Police and you're 100% legal (2000+ft away) with backstop and everything in the middle of the day???
6) can you get your own FFL, and can you order stuff right to your own door? Not for retail either or does it have to be???
7) What qualifies as a weapon? If you load a shell in a gun, but the shell is actually an adapter that shoots 22 ammo-is that a weapon???
8) Laws of war- how come no "expanding/fragmenting bullets" yet our bullets have a cannelure to "break up" upon impact-I sure as heck call that fragmentation!
Help a very confused individual who is messed up with bueracratic BS:barf: :eek: :D
Chase
 
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mete

New member
CCW - The reason is that it would frighten the sheeple. Here in NYS it MUST be concealed and I agree. We had a shooter in a mall a couple of years ago, what do you think would be the reaction of most people if you were carrying openly in a mall ???....FFL - that is for people who have a 'business' of buying and selling guns and ammo !!
 
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Varmint Eviscerator

New member
Well, dont you think that frightening BG would be a good deterance???:D
I once saw a ccw,didnt bother ME;) the guy was wearing sweats and when he bendt down the magazine protruded slightly, you wouldnt a guessed unless you knew guns!
Chase
 
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deadin

Moderator
I’ll take a stab at some of these questions.

#2 & 3: Restrictions on bore.
“They” felt the need to regulate how big a gun could be owned without regulation. .50 Cal was chosen. It could have been .60 or .45. It just happened to be .50. As for the oversized ones you mentioned, I really don’t know how they pass the test. Maybe someone else here has an answer.

#5. The 500 ft. rule.
Once again, this is an arbitrary number picked by somebody. This isn’t even a “fixed” number throughout the country. (Some jurisdictions have 1000 ft.. I’m sure there are others.) As for your shooting “100%” legally and someone calls you in. You will probably get a visit from the local LEO just to make sure you are “100%” legal and nothing else should happen. If something else does happen, you have a right to contest it.

#7. What is a weapon?
Read the definition at the ATF site or your local state regulations. As for an adapter, if it is capable of firing the cartridge outside of the rifle/pistol it is intended for, I think it would qualify as a “weapon” (Every adapter I’ve seen aren’t capable of this.)

#8. expanding/fragmenting bullets.
I believe the rule on this is part of the Geneva Convention and is intended to outlaw bullets that are “intentionally” made to expand/fragment. The cannelure is intended to receive the crimp, not to cause it to fragment. (Besides, I’ve always heard that it is better to wound an enemy that to kill one. Kill him and it take a couple of guys to bury him (if at all) and then they can go back to combat. Wound him and it take stretcher bearers, doctors, nurses, etc. and he becomes a burden on the enemy to care for him.)
 
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Wild Bill Bucks

New member
I sympathize V.E.

Wouldn't it be nice to live about 100 years ago, when everybody carried a side-arm? Where a man tipped his hat to a lady, and held the door open for her. Where he could step out the door and target practice in the back yard without having neighbors complain. Where men didn't rape 9 year olds, didn't beat their wives, and had respect for each other, as well as their elders.

Back in those days I'll bet people were a whole lot freindlier, because the guy you were being a smart ass to, was packing also. It would be pretty hard to bully your way through party, if every body at the party had a gun to.

Most of the rules, were set out by people who don't have a clue, about what makes hunting, and shooting, a sport. They think every time they see something they don't like, there ought to be a law against it, or a rule to cover it.

It's to bad that things are like the way they are, but I look at what you guys have to deal with in NY and it makes me glad I'm still in Okla.(even if we are 100 years behind):eek:
 
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tyme

Administrator
1) CCW, I understand the conceiled part-why cant you wear the gun "out"?
2) Caliber-above .50 is a no-no, then what about 60dynamite, 70nitro and 75 double rifles?
3) Adding to that, how come you can have a muzzle loading HOWITZER but you cant have a cartridge loading weapon over 50????
6) can you get your own FFL, and can you order stuff right to your own door? Not for retail either or does it have to be???
7) What qualifies as a weapon? If you load a shell in a gun, but the shell is actually an adapter that shoots 22 ammo-is that a weapon???
8) Laws of war- how come no "expanding/fragmenting bullets" yet our bullets have a cannelure to "break up" upon impact-I sure as heck call that fragmentation!
Help a very confused individual who is messed up with bueracratic BS
Click to expand...
1. What?

2. Guns over .50 caliber may not be destructive devices if they are determined to have a sporting purpose. A .50BMG weapon, for instance, is technically over .50 caliber, but is classified as an ordinary rifle because TPTB decided that .50BMG has a sporting purpose.

3. There are a bunch of silly rules that don't make much sense. In this case, cannons not firing fixed ammunition, and manufactured before 1898, are antiques, not guns. See question M28 at http://www.atf.treas.gov/pub/fire-explo_pub/qa.pdf
In fact, you may want to read the entire FAQ.

6. If you're asking whether you can get "your own FFL," the answer is no, since you probably want to buy modern guns and you probably don't want to run a storefront or deal with zoning issues or the cost of a FFL license and SOT costs. If you have a more specific question about FFLs that indicates you know something about the different classes of FFLs, the answer might change.

7. What?

8. The relevant treaty, which the U.S. never signed, is the 3rd Declaration of the 1899 Hague Conference. Actual applicability and interpretation is up to government lawyers. It's all built on air.
 
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Dave Haven

New member
2. Guns over .50 caliber may not be destructive devices if they are determined to have a sporting purpose. A .50BMG weapon, for instance, is technically over .50 caliber, but is classified as an ordinary rifle because TPTB decided that .50BMG has a sporting purpose.
Click to expand...
Same goes for the .577 Tyranosaur, .577 Nitro Express, .600 Nitro Express, and .700 Nitro Express. And "spud guns".
 
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maas

New member
california has a none 50 or above law. (i think thats what it is) a local gun store owner built a .60 caliber rifle to hunt elephant with. he sent pick to the atf and the confirmed that it is a legal sporting rifle. scary thing is i think it only weights about 8.5 pounds.
 
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deadin

Moderator
scary thing is i think it only weights about 8.5 pounds.
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"The Great White Hunter fired his 4-bore at the elephant.
They both fell down.
The first to rise will be declared the winner and the losers possessions will be distributed equally among the local inhabitants."

I don't remember were I read this, but it fits with a "light" big-bore.:D

Dean
 
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Big Mac

New member
Wild Bill, people back then did horrible things as well. There were child molestors (who are not a new thing at all) and people probably beat their wives more back then since it was socially accepted. It would be nice to go back to the days where you could buy your guns through the mail and if you wanted a Machine-gun, go right ahead. We must fight an uphill battle to regain our rights in full.
 
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Wild Bill Bucks

New member
You guys are probably right, but it sure sounded good when I was typing it.:eek:
I grew up in the 50's in a small neighborhood, in McAlester, Oklahoma. I don't ever re-call locking a door, or closing a window, or ever hearing of someones mother taking a beating. We would never have been disrespectful to anyone or their property. There was only two cars on the whole neighborhood, and the same two guys owned a TV.(for what it was worth in those days). Total houses in the neighborhood might have been 70 or 75 houses.
Moms would all get together on the week-end and order groceries, because the nearest grocery store was 5 miles away, and they would load up and go buy groceries. One or two of the moms would have close to 30 kids at a time in their backyard playing while the other moms went shopping. No one worried about somebody coming along and running off with one of their kids.(maybe because we were so mean):eek:

You could squirrel hunt at the end of the block, so the only gun fire anyone heard was one of us hunting, and nobody paid any attention to it.

OK OK I'll quit rambling- just meant it seemed to be a better time when there weren't so many Ruuuules. And people seemed to get along a whole lot better.:)
 
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Bud Helms

Senior Member
I think it's a reference to many states' and counties' ordinances that prohibit discharge of a weapon within 500 ft of a residence, but it's kind of difficult to tell.
 
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skeeter1

New member
6) can you get your own FFL, and can you order stuff right to your own door? Not for retail either or does it have to be???
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I looked into getting a FFL, but it costs you $200 up front, and you have to show that you've bought/sold 5 firearms/year. After that, it will cost you $90 for every three years.

For more information, look here:

http://www.fflkit.com/

My FFL is currently brokering a transaction for me and charging $20. It's not worth it to me to get my own FFL. I maybe buy/sell 1-2 firearms/year.
 
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dakotashooter2

New member
Where men didn't rape 9 year olds, didn't beat their wives, and had respect for each other, as well as their elders.



Such a nice time never existed.
Click to expand...

Of course the woman could shoot the man for beating her or mollesting a child and not end up in court or jail.
 
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