Does this 9x19 exist?

Zak Smith

New member
To give a little history as introduction, when I finished grad school and moved out to Colorado to start working, I had no guns despite growing up shooting rifles, shotguns, and pistols during the summers at the family "farm", and hunting upland birds (Ha! What a joke! It's mostly slogging through swamps!), deer, and the occaisonal rabbit. When I discovered that I could get a CCW here in Larimer County, Colorado, and realized that I should become self-sufficient with respect to self-defense, I got interested in handguns. I have shot IDPA and "steel" matches in the last 3 or 4 years, and probably go through 8,000 centerfire handgun rounds per year.

Long story made shorter, I started with a USP40, got a Glock 27 next, then a Glock 19, then a Glock 32/23, then a CZ-75B-SA, then a Browning Hi-Power (9x19). (That's just the semi-autos.. :D )

To contrast the two ends of that spectrum:

The Glock is a near-ideal "self-defense appliance" -- nothing needs changing, as long as it comes with steel night sights, and they are ready to go out of the box. "Full" capacity magazines are available. The trigger is.. unique, but indubitably tractible. Evidence of this is that they can be competitive in IDPA and other "action pistol" competition.

The BHP, on the other hand, is the "original" wondernine. Designed by JMB, it has a simplicity of design that is attractive. This all-steel pistol is very slim in the hand (with good grips, e.g. Spegels), points well, and is relatively robust. It's also pleasing to the eye, which the Glock is, well, not. The BHP trigger leaves something to be desired. It can be tuned quite well in some respects (crispness and lightness), but its take-up and reset cannot be tuned to the level of a 1911 or even, dare I say, Glock.

My personal biases are that: I am biased against double-action or DA/SA pistols. I expect my trigger pull to be identical shot to shot, and C&L is the way to carry a pistol. I think a grip safety is redundant and just adds extra complexity and possibility for failure (e.g. a certain high grip can fail to disengage the safety). An ideal trigger would have minimal take-up, a 4-4.25 lbs "glass rod" break, and minimal overtravel. Trigger reset would be extremely short and very tactilely positive (i.e., you can feel it with your finger).

So my "ultimate" wondernine would be basically a BHP with a 1911-quality trigger. Does such a beast exist? Are there any double-stack 1911's in 9x19? With hi-caps available? Suitable for carry? It should be 100% reliable (as my Glocks and BHP have been) and eagerly digest European-spec 9x19. I have no problem paying for quality...

I realize that some may mention the CZ-75/85 line as fulfilling my request. I have experience with these owning a CZ-75B-SA and shooting a friend's CZ-85 Combat. Their trigger design is an improvement over the BHP's trigger design, however, it still does not match what is possible with a 1911 trigger. Take-up can be reduced somewhat, but not a lot or removed. Reset distance is relatively long and can only be reduced somewhat. There are also some sporadic reliability concerns with the CZ-75's regarding premature slidelock.

regards
Zak

PS- please no diatribes against 9x19 in favor of any other caliber. I agree that .45ACP has superior terminal ballistics per shot, and that a 1911 is most likely the "best" platform for launching it.
 

Jim Watson

New member
Well, STI will sell you a "2011" double column 1911 derivative in 9mm P. But I don't know if they were doing that 8 years ago and even if they were I doubt there are many pre-ban normal capacity magazines available. How about a nice single stack? I have one - a gunsmithed 1991A1 - that is a fine shooter. I will just have to get my business done in ten tries.
 

Zak Smith

New member
Yeah, I'm starting to look at some 9x19 1911-pattern guns, but lots of them look like competition guns - not something I can stuff in an IWB.

If I can find one with a grip and slide as slim as those on a BHP, it would definitely be attractive.

Any suggestions?

-z
 

Aerrin45ACP

New member
here is one I have
attachment.php

Jesus jumping christ, that is ugly.. what is that, the liberty bell on the bottom of the grip?
 

manimal78

New member
para ordnance

i saw a para ordnance pistol recently....impressed the hell out of me...it was a beautiful gun, and the trigger pull was the best i've ever felt...i think it was DA/SA, and the DA had a 4lb trigger pull(i believe; maybe it was 6lbs.)...i wish i could remember the exact model of this pistol...really nice gun though...might be what you're looking for.
 

Eric Larsen

New member
The P/O gun is the LDA. Very very nice trigger. They only come in 45/40? at the moment.
Why not get an STI and if the P/O 14/40 mags work in it..use it with a 9mm round. Youd have a very full capacity mag.
If it will work?...Dont know..just a thought
shoot well
 

GeneralChang

New member
Airhead45

The magwell is for competition. Make mag changes pretty quick.
Oops, I didn't get you name right;)

Since when is gun supposed to be pretty?

Anyway, Dave Dawson makes a variety of handguns that aren't as blocky or more concealable. Doesn't Novak have a custom High Power?
 

Zak Smith

New member
CastleBravo, I've played with a P7M13 and it's almost ideal, except the grip is too big for my stubby fingers. Same problem with the CZ-97.

-z
 
Top