Does Anyone Have Any Experience With .307 Winchester?

[patrickt66]

Hi Guys,
I just got a great deal on a Winchester 94XTR AE in .307 and love the concept. I plan on reloading for this and was thinking of using the 150 gr. Starfire bullet. Would this be an appropriate choice? Can you use the same dies as .308 Win? Any anecdotes are appreciated.

 

[Tom Matiska]

I’ve been having a love-hate affair with the cartridge for 13 years. To keep from writing a book, I’ll write several short stories.

The round is basically a .308 case with a 30-30 rim. I use the same shell holder as I do for loading the 30-30, and the same dies as I do for loading the .308. DO NOT use the same load DATA as the 308 for the 307. Thicker case walls and deeper bullet seating limit 307 case capacity. Use only loads that were published for the 307.

Because the 307 has a wider shoulder than the 30-30, some of the more blunt 30-30 bullets will barely clear the 12 O’clock of the 307 chamber when they slide up the ramp.
They may bounce high enough to jam if you slap in the second shot quickly. Don't find out the hard way your favorite load jams when you need that quick second shot. Best stick with loads published in major manuals.... more on that later.


Tom

 

[Tom Matiska]

The .307 “Big Bore” ‘94 has a heavier barrel and weighs a good pound more than the standard 30-30. I’d stop short of calling it too heavy, but it’s not quite as sweet to tuck under the arm as the standard ‘94. It seems I can’t use it too many days in row without wanting to use the lighter Win 30-30 or Marlin 44 Mag we have in the family.

The extra barrel weight does pay dividends in accuracy. Impact point varies little between 150’s and 180’s, groups don’t move up or down two inches when the magazine tube is
empty or full, and the groups don’t open up as much when the barrel gets warm. It is a much better offhand shooter than its skinny barreled 30-30 cousin.

One problem I never expected was the 4 groove rifling that Winchester switched to doesn’t like some bullets. You would think rifling to be a no-brainer these days, but I
discovered otherwise.

Tom

 

[Tom Matiska]

My first hunts were with Win 150gr factory loads. My first three kills were close range shots that produced devastating single shot kills. When you drive a blunt 30-30 bullet at .308 speeds the result is a train wreck. But I struggled to get groups below 3”, and the 200-250’ potential of the cartridge was limited mostly by accuracy. ...back to the rifling

The “4 groove” rifling that Winchester used is better described as “12 groove” with 8 of the lands missing. It has four thin lands and is mostly four big wide grooves. It wasn’t until I took a good at a 150 I recovered from bambi I noticed the problem with the rifling.

The bullet had four nice grooves from the lands of the barrel. Large areas to the side of the grooves showed no evidence of contact with the barrel, and the areas where the bullet did contact the groove portion of the bore were irregular. It just wasn’t something I expected in this day and age.

The factory 180’s (I believe the only factory load still offered) were tack drivers. They slugged to the bore better and offered true 200++ yard accuracy. My experience on bambi was they suffered badly from over-penatration. They were ok if you connected with solid bone. If you missed bone they were likely to do more damage to the tree behind bambi. Three deer I shot with the 180’s were lost to other hunters after traveling a few
hundred yards. My one experience with the factory 180’s on bear was similar.

I had a slightly aft of broadside shot and aimed just behind the shoulder. The bear was off to the races. It left a good blood trail in fresh snow and I was at a loss to figure out why I was still tracking it six hours later.

At a later date I met another hunter in the same area who had taken a 400 pounder that showed evidence of a previous wound. It had a healed entry would just behind the left
shoulder. The bullet did its dirtywork in the far side shoulder, but apparently had done little or no damage on its trip through the bear’s chest.


Tom

 

[Tom Matiska]

I switched to loading the Nosler 170 partitions and they did well at the range. Nosler doesn’t give loads for the .307 in their manual, but loads for the round have found their way into magazine articles. Apparently the author of the article never checked to see if the rounds would feed reliably when the action was cycled fast.

The Noslers might work if the seating depth could be changed, but the need to crimp limits that option.

Since then I’ve tried Hornady 170’s and Speer 150’s. Both feed reliably, and both shoot somewhere between the factory 150’s and 180’s accuracy wise. The Hornadys have a
heavy jacket and don’t expand as quickly as I’d like for deer. I haven’t connected the Speers with Bambi yet.

Tom

 

[patrickt66]

Tom, Thanks for all the info, it's exactly what I was looking for. Do you think the 150 gr PMC Firestar bullet is tough enough for .307 velocities? I like the fact that it is a solid. Here in New England it's rare that a shot over 100 yards ever presents itself so I can live with groups that aren't quite MOA but I don't want a dog of a round either.

 

[Tom Matiska]

I'm not familiar with the Firestar bullet but I'm ready to start doing some serious experimenting.

Is the tip soft enough for use in a tubular magazine? The .307 does generate a little more kick than the 30-30, and I'd hesitate to have anything too solid against a primer.

Tom

 

[Tom Matiska]

I went to http://www.pmcammo.com and think I may try it myself. I was unaware they made a flatpoint intended for 30-30s. The hollow point design may be just what bambi needs.

If the holow point is intended to work at 30-30 velocities then it should work well out of the 307 well past 200 yards. I can't imagine the solid portion of the bullet comming apart at 307 velocities, so under-penatration shouldn't be a problem.


Tom