CZ P-07 jamming and lots of issues

[Moloch]

Hey guys,

my CZ P-07 in 9x19 has some issues and I hope you can help me or maybe point me in the right direction.

So I bought a new P07 (2023 production) and fired a total of 300 rounds through it (cleaned it and oiled it lightly every 100 rounds) , 4 boxes of Sellier & Bellot 124 grain FMJ, one box of 115 grain FMJ also from S&B and 50 rounds of my own 124 grain reloads. I'm using the original magazines that came with the gun.

Problem #1: I get failures to feed every 30-50 rounds, the slide is slightly out of battery and needs a push to fully chamber the round. There is no resistance and I can easily push it closed with my thumb.

Problem #2: ejection pattern is just crazy. It ejects brass all over the place, even at 9 o'clock, straight into the air and also right onto my forehead. Ammunition does not seem to matter, it just spits it everywhere, sometimes the brass barely makes it out of the chamber. Ammo works fine in other pistols.

Problem #3: sometimes the slide feels like it is operating in slow-motion for 3-4 rounds and then it cycles properly again. I can really feel it slowly cycling going CA-CHUNK every shot. It feels like a really slow semi-auto shotgun cycling.

It feels like the slide catches on something every now and then but I cannot see any wear marks and cycling the gun by hand it feels smooth like any other 9mm pistol. The surface on the hammer and the area the slide contacts the hammer are both very smooth and well machined. I cannot see or feel any burs where the slide rides in the metal recesses in the frame.
In fact the gun looks exceptionally well machined.

I'm an experienced gun owner and I've been shooting pistols for a decade now - never had issues like that before, not even with poor quality 1911's with really terrible set up extractors.

 

[TunnelRat]

CZ has a USA division that handles the warranty service. I'd advise calling them. I have used them in the past and the turnaround was I think 2 weeks and they paid shipping both ways.

 

[Moloch]

I live outside the US and do not have access to the services of CZ USA. Probably should have mentioned that beforehand

 

[armoredman]

Replace the recoil spring. What is the closest CZ center to you? They do have spots in some areas of the world. There is a warranty on the sidearm. Are there any burrs on the slide rails? Something is holding up the slide, so my first thought is replacing the recoil spring.
Note, not a gunsmith.

 

[Moloch]

My suspicion is that the rounds enter the chamber at a VERY steep angle for some reason, causing the slide to slow down a lot, sometimes so much it gets stuck entirely before getting the round into the chamber.

I just did an experiment - I loaded dummy cartridges into my Glock 17 magazines and my P-07 magazines. Put the magazines into the pistols and tried to chamber the rounds at a deliberately slow speed. The Glock chambered the round with relatively little resistance but the P-07 really hit kind of a wall in the middle of the chambering process, right when the tip of the bullet dragged on the top of the chamber wall.

The chamber looks fine though, no burrs no rough spots. Looks pretty much like my Glock's chamber.

Now cartridges nose-diving is usually caused by either a weak magazine spring or a tight or burred extractor.

Magazines springs are very hard, they are new after all. They are harder than my Glock 17 mags or those of my Walther PDP. Extractor tension seems to be just about right, and there are no burrs on it. I can easily slip a cartridge under the extractor with about the same resistance as with the Glock 17.

I had some issues with a CZ 97B once and tried to contact CZ Europe via mail, but they did not even answer.

 

[Mosin44az]

Well that’s certainly not typical P07 behavior. I have owned two P07 Dutys and still have a newer version. One of the Dutys was a bit finicky, my current one has had 3 malfunctions in 1500 rounds, two on break in, and one likely ammo related (ZSR Turkish dud primer). So not typical P07 and could easily justify a warranty return.

A possibility is a tight chamber. I think one of my Dutys suffered from that, diagnosed by me (non-expert) when I noticed that longer ammo had problems in the gun. Maybe shoot some on the lighter/shorter side, see what happens. 115 grain is what I’m suggesting. I see you used mostly 124 grain, which might be longer. Did you have the issues with the 115 also? Also measure cartridge length.

Another possibility is the S&B, which for some reason has caused feeding problems in a couple of my Ruger pistols which have digested EVERYTHING else with no issues. You would think S & B would work in a CZ, but it is true that not all guns like every load or brand.

I DO note that a CZ I bought recently, a fancy and expensive Shadow 2 SA, suffered a catastrophic failure in its trigger in the first 50 rounds, jamming back on a cocked hammer! Fortunately my gun store took care of it by giving me a replacement ( not tested yet). Hopefully CZ itself is not having QC problems.

 

[TunnelRat]

I am pretty sure S&B is what CZ uses to factory test the pistols.

 

[Moloch]

I tried my reloads Fiocchi 124 grain FMJ OAL 1.141 with VV N340 4.8 grains - prior to shooting I dropped every single round into the chamber to see if they get stuck but they all worked fine. At the range I had the exact same issues.

I then made a dummy cartridge from the same FMJ with a very long OAL to check if its a tight chamber. As I said my reloads and the S&B stuff is OAL 1.141. My dummy cartridge fed and chambered at 1.200 with no issues.

I wanted the P07 to be my all around all-purpose pistol but if its picky with freaking FMJ service spec ammunition its not fit for that role. None of my other 9mm guns are picky with FMJ and eat whatever I throw in them.

 

[Moloch]

Now I cycled the pistol with dummy rounds and managed to induce the jam several times. I think its an extractor issue.
Just when the new round is picked up and the rim of the round is sliding
under the extractor it seems like it meets enough resistance to stop the slide without going fully into battery.
That's why the pistol often feels like it cycles in slow motion, the slide barely has the power to push the cartridge into the chamber.

Like this:

I tried to induce the malfunction in my Glock and I could not do it, the slide always closes no matter how slowly I cycle it.

So I think either the extractor spring is too powerful or the angles of the extractor claw aren't right.

 

[TunnelRat]

Is there a warranty service for CS for where you are in whatever European country you’re in? I know you said you emailed them and hadn’t heard back, I was curious if for some reason you might not be able to get service in that country. I sometimes have better luck with phone calls than emails, too.

 

[Moloch]

Well I mailed CZ in the Czech republic again fully explaining the malfunctions and they actually replied and said I need to bring it to the shop I bought it from and let them fix it. DUH.

The problem is I had a 1911 that was really riddled with major issues and it took me 1 year to get the dealer to give me a refund. I think I did like 10 trips to the shop telling them that the gun is beyond fixing.
They always kept the pistol for a couple weeks and returned it to me saying it runs flawlessly. That's what happens when you buy a gun that does not work around here.

If there is one thing the US is doing right its customer service, CS absolutely positively SUCKS everywhere else in the world, especially here in Europe. Its atrocious.

In any case, I think my best bet is to get a new extractor and extractor spring. I'll fiddle round with those parts and see what happens. Maybe I'll shorten the extractor spring and see where this goes. I don't know.

 

[Moloch]

I decided to give it one more try, I polished the breechface, polished the extractor claw (did NOT smoothen its engagement surfaces) and gave the feed ramp a mirror finish. Basically all the stuff I do to improve feeding on my 1911's.

Cycling the gun with dummy rounds it does feel smoother now, but whether that helps with the FTF's remains to be seen.

 

[Jim Watson]

gave the feed ramp a mirror finish.

Look at fired cases and jammed rounds to see if there are creases or scrapes.
One fault in some guns is a sharp corner as machined between the ramp and the chamber. It should be beveled or radiused SLIGHTLY.

 

[Moloch]

I got some horizontal lines on the brass before I polished the feed ramp and the area just before the chamber.
Those are gone now, but I can still make the pistol jam on a life round when I
chamber it very slowly, it gets stuck halfway into the chamber.
I cannot do that with my other 9mm pistols.
Though after my polishing job its not as easy to jam it than before.


Like this:

The barrel before and after my little polishing job.

Round after chambering a couple times after I polished the feed ramp.
There are some very faint vertical lines but that's about it.

 

[GGuzz]

Shouldn’t be an issue with your 1.141 OAL vs. 2969mm/1.169in SAAMI. Bullet wt is irrelevant as it is the bullet ogive that acts on the ramp/chamber.
Until you have this sorted out, I would stay factory to develop a baseline:
Is FTF through 2/both shipped/in-box mags?
Is 115/124 from the same time/vendor (presumably of the same lot)?
Test other spare mags, test other ammo.

My 2023 P-07 is 3 weeks old (02/28 mfg per CZ-CS), 150rds so far with 50 Fiocchi/Italy, 50 Fed Champion, 50 Blazer Brass x 115gr = 0 malfunctions, an early testament of this unit/sample at break-in. I have not yet vetted this with my carry Fed HST 124 +P.
Yours also being a 2023, I noticed your extractor does not have an LCI. I wonder if the extractor/LCI is a US issue and if there are different spring part nums.

Good luck.

(I now see your polish edits).

 

[Moloch]

I think the LCI is a feature only present on CZ USA made guns and not on the European specimens. I've never seen a LCI on any Czech made gun -

Yeah FTF happened with both magazines that came with the pistol. Both have strong springs, are clean and the feed lips look perfect.

I'm not very convinced that is the ammunition since I shot 124 & 115 grain and also my own reloads and I ran into the same issue with every load. I will try some Fiocchi ammo though just for the hell of it.

But I don't think its the magazines, I can load the gun, remove the magazine and when I slowly pull the slide back almost ejecting the round and let it forward again the slide hangs up JUST before going fully into battery.

I can do this without a magazine: