Conversation topics supporting gun rights

[ripnbst]

Lets have a thread (sticky anyone?) where we all can dump any opposition we have faced in recent gun control conversations and the well thought out responses to those oppositions so that we can sound like we know what we are talking about and can make sound arguments against the antis.

Here is an example of what I am looking for in format or your posts:

Opposition: Some people say "At the time the 2nd amendment was written there is no way that the founding fathers could have foreseen the technology and firepower available to citizens today."

Response: I would tend to agree. When they wrote the first amendment, do you think they knew the internet would exist? What about TV? Radio? Not likely. Your freedom of speech is now restricted to words and printed media only.

What's wrong? You don't want to make your bed and then lay in it?

 

[Spats McGee]

Opposition: Some people say "At the time the 2nd amendment was written there is no way that the founding fathers could have foreseen the technology and firepower available to citizens today."

Response: Nor could they have forseen the firepower available to criminals or the military. Remember that when the Bill of Rights was written, we'd just finished with a war that we had declared on our own government. The rights enumerated under the Second Amendment are there to protect all of our other rights. We just hope we never seriously need those rights.

Opposition: Nobody needs an military-style rifle.

Response #1: Rights aren't based on needs. Technically, you don't "need" to vote either. Feel like giving that one up? Besides, what rights that society needs for me to have is a different question from what I, personally, need. I've never needed to exercise my 4th, 5th, or 8th Amendment rights (against unreasonable search and seizure, self-incrimination, and cruel & unusual punishment), either. But we as a society need for citizens to have those rights. Without them, it would be perfectly permissible for the police to kick in a door without a warrant, and then torture confessions out of whoever happened to be inside at the time.

Response #2: Go look for online images of a Mini-14 Ranch Rifle and a Mini-14 tactical. One might look scarier than the other, but they fire the same round, have the same ammunition capacity, the same firing mechanism. Functionally, they're the same. (This one runs the danger of having someone say, "Fine. Ban them both.")

Response #3: Clearly, you've never been hog hunting.

 

[DaleA]

I'll play.

Opposition: If we could just get HALF the guns off the street we’d cut the homicide rate in half.

Response: It’s the other half that will commit the murders. The law abiding people will turn in their guns, the bad people will not.

 

[DaleA]

I'll play again.

Opposition: If we get rid of guns we would get rid of gun violence.

Response: There are over 200 MILLION guns in the U.S. You are not going to be able to get rid of guns.

 

[DaleA]

Third play and out for a while.

Opposition: Nobody needs…

Response: Really? Seriously? Okay let’s play the ‘Nobody Needs Game’: motorcycles, cigarettes, sail boats, sports cars, professional sports, COLLEGE sports, golf courses, jewelry, red meat, any kind of meat, wine, private airplanes…

 

[lockedcj7]

I'll play...

Opposition: You people are paranoid. Guns DO NOT save lives!

Response: According to the 2011 FBI Uniform Crime Report, there were 201 Justifiable homicides using a firearm where “justifiable homicide” is defined as: “The killing of a felon, during the commission of a felony, by a private citizen.” Of course, this does NOT include the felons who were wounded and survived or who ceased their hostile activities upon seeing a gun in the hands of a citizen. The statement that it never happens or is a fantasy of the gun-nut crowd is demonstrably false.

 

[lockedcj7]

One more... I found this list online

Opposition: The idea that CWP holders have stopped mass shootings is a myth perpetrated by the gun lobby.

Response: Killers such as this have been stopped many times by armed citizens and off-duty police. Feel free to look these up.

-- Clackamas Town Center Mall, Happy Valley, Oregon, 2012: Masked gunman begins shooting patrons. His gun jammed and a CCW holder aimed from cover and verbally challenged him. Gunman runs to a stairwell and takes his own life. Total dead: Two.
-- Mayan Palace Theater, San Antonio, Texas, this week: Jesus Manuel Garcia shoots at a movie theater, a police car and bystanders from the nearby China Garden restaurant; as he enters the movie theater, guns blazing, an armed off-duty cop shoots Garcia four times, stopping the attack. Total dead: Zero.
-- Winnemucca, Nev., 2008: Ernesto Villagomez opens fire in a crowded restaurant; concealed carry permit-holder shoots him dead. Total dead: Two. (I'm excluding the shooters' deaths in these examples.)
-- Appalachian School of Law, 2002: Crazed immigrant shoots the dean and a professor, then begins shooting students; as he goes for more ammunition, two armed students point their guns at him, allowing a third to tackle him. Total dead: Three.
-- Santee, Calif., 2001: Student begins shooting his classmates -- as well as the "trained campus supervisor"; an off-duty cop who happened to be bringing his daughter to school that day points his gun at the shooter, holding him until more police arrive. Total dead: Two.
-- Pearl High School, Mississippi, 1997: After shooting several people at his high school, student heads for the junior high school; assistant principal Joel Myrick retrieves a .45 pistol from his car and points it at the gunman's head, ending the murder spree. Total dead: Two.
-- Edinboro, Pa., 1998: A student shoots up a junior high school dance being held at a restaurant; restaurant owner pulls out his shotgun and stops the gunman. Total dead: One.

By contrast, the shootings in gun-free zones invariably result in far higher casualty figures -- Sikh temple, Oak Creek, Wis. (six dead); Virginia Tech, Blacksburg, Va. (32 dead); Columbine High School, Columbine, Colo. (12 dead); Amish school, Lancaster County, Pa. (five little girls killed); public school, Craighead County, Ark. (five killed, including four little girls).

 

[StrongSideArmsInc]

Opposition: I have nothing against people owning guns, but I see no need for people to own military style rifles.

Response: I really like your new Dodge Challenger, but I see no need for you to own that car, you should own a prius.. By the way lets govern all vehicles not exceed 70mph, its not needed , right?