Bullet selection? (9mm / .38 Super)

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Aguila Blanca

Staff
It looks like Berry's Bullets finally has some bullets in stock to sell to us peons. I have enough .45 bullets for awhile, but I could maybe use some in 9mm. But I also have a .38 Super gun, which takes the same diameter bullet as 9mm, so I'm trying to decide if I should double up, and standardize on one bullet for both "calibers."

I seem to have used up my 115-grain round-nose. For 9mm I have two boxes of 124-grain. And for .38 Super I have one box of 130-grain. Obviously, I can use either bullet in either round -- if I can find data. But I'm wondering if I should buy 147-grain bullets to use for both (once I have used up the existing stocks). And if I go with the 147-grain, do I get round-nose, hollow-point, or cone shaped flat-point?
 
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Shadow9mm

New member
Berry's recommends staying under 1250fps with their standard plated bullets. Based on a quick glance in my manuals it is easy to push 124s over that in 38 super. I have done it in 9mm with berry's 124 during load development. Based on that I would personally be looking at the 147s for your specific application.

As far as profile. I would go round nose. After loading some Hornady XTP's with the same tapered profile, I found I had to seat them shorter than I preferred because the sharp shoulder was hitting the rifling. The round nose are more forgiving in seating depth.

For example in 9mm, Berry's recommended seating depths.

Berrys 124g round nose 1.160
Berrys 124g target HP 1.060
Berrys 124g flat point 1.060

But if you don't mind the shorter COL's and reduced case capacity the flat or HP's could be a good choice.
 
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Shadow9mm

New member
Unclenick said:
Seating depth is how far into the case mouth the bullet goes. Those numbers are all COLs.
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True, they are col. However with bullets of the same diameter and weight, and based on the placement of the shoulder, to me it appears that it would be seated deeper. I have some Berrys 124 round nose, measured 10, average of 0.585. Looked for data on the 124g flat points. No luck with google. I messaged berrys, not sure when I will get a response back.
 
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74A95

New member
Aguila Blanca, it's not clear what you're looking for. What information can members provide that will help you make your decision?
 
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Shadow9mm

New member
74A95 said:
Aguila Blanca, it's not clear what you're looking for. What information can members provide that will help you make your decision?
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From what I gathered there are 2 questions.

1, should he consolidate to 1 bullet weight to be used in both 9mm and 38super to keep things simple. Or keep different weights and be cartridge specific.

2. When buying bullets, what style should he get.
 
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Aguila Blanca

Staff
Shadow9mm said:
74A95 said:
Aguila Blanca, it's not clear what you're looking for. What information can members provide that will help you make your decision?
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From what I gathered there are 2 questions.

1, should he consolidate to 1 bullet weight to be used in both 9mm and 38super to keep things simple. Or keep different weights and be cartridge specific.

2. When buying bullets, what style should he get.
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Shadow9mm is correct.

It doesn't compute for my dinosaur brain that 9mm is typically available in 124-grain and 147-grain bullet weights, but .38 Super seems to be more typically available in 130-grain but NOT 124-grain or 147-grain. They are all (at least according to Berry's web site) .356" diameter, so I can load any of those weights in either case. It would simplify my inventory to standardize on one bullet weight, unless there's a good reason not to do so.

I have been loading 124-grain for 9mm and 130-grain for .38 Super. A friend who shoots 9mm in IDPA has recommended changing to 147-grain because, loaded to the same power factor, the 147s generate less felt recoil and less muzzle rise. According to him, that's what all the cool kids are shooting. So I thought it might be worth a try.

So then I wondered about using the same 147-grain projectiles in .38 Super. Or, if that's not a good idea, what about using the 130-grain bullets in 9mm? They're not much heavier than 124-grain, but they are heavier.

Yes, I recognize that I occasionally (??) overthink things. Can't help it -- it's just the way my mind works.
 
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Shadow9mm

New member
You could easily run 130s in 9mm. again im not sure how fast your pushing your 38 supers, but Berrys reccomends not exceeding 1250fps.... If you at or over those velocities with your 130s you might want to go 147 to keep the energy but slow things down.
 
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Shadow9mm

New member
Unclenick said:
Seating depth is how far into the case mouth the bullet goes. Those numbers are all COLs.
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Ok, I was correct based on my observations, but I crunched the math for you.

9mm case length of 0.754
Berry's 124g round nose 0.585, COL of 1.160 protrusion into the case 0.178
Berry's 124g flat point 0.512, COL of 1.060 protrusion into the case 0.206

Final results, the flat point protrudes into the case 0.028 deeper, if that makes any difference to the OP, but it does reduce case capacity.
 
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Sevens

New member
It looks like Berry's Bullets finally has some bullets in stock to sell to us peons.
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Just for a handful of levity, it has been Berry’s position since day one that Berry’s has built relationships with retailers to sell them bullets at a wholesale price to market their product. It was not ever their business plan to operate their website to sell directly to us “peons” and they’ve been up front about that before when taken to task over their unwillingness to offer bulk/volume pricing.

Is this off topic? Possibly. I’m just the guy over here that has a very large level of respect for a fine American business that feeds a great product to our sport/lifestyle.

Long live Berry’s. These are the good guys.
 
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Shotgun Slim

New member
Your friend is correct about the cool kids because of the better recoil "signature" of the heavier bullets. My idea is to go with 147s to keep it simple and not have to worry about excess velocity. Curiously,Berrys doesn't list a 147 under the 38 super bullet selection,but they do have it under 9mm.
 
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Aguila Blanca

Staff
Shotgun Slim said:
Your friend is correct about the cool kids because of the better recoil "signature" of the heavier bullets. My idea is to go with 147s to keep it simple and not have to worry about excess velocity. Curiously,Berrys doesn't list a 147 under the 38 super bullet selection,but they do have it under 9mm.
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Yes, I know. And they list a 130-grain bullet under .38 Super but not under 9mm.

And then, of course, there are the .356" bullets they list under .380 ACP ...
 
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74A95

New member
The 130 grain bullets have been used in the 38 Super because that was the 'traditional' bullet weight for the 38 Automatic (parent cartridge of the 38 Super) created in 1900. That's the only reason. I repeat, that's the only reason.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.38_ACP

Some people, like Berry's, list the 130s for the Super. Winchester and Remington still make the 130s for the Super. This is keeping with tradition for people who want to do that. Do people have to do that? No, of course not. There is nothing special about the 130s. Really.

9mms and 38 Super can shoot a wide range of bullet weights, from 80 grains up to 185 grains. Whatever fits.

The 9mm bullet has 'traditionally' been .355. The 38 Super bullet has 'traditionally' been .356. It makes no difference. Both the 9mm and the 38 Super have the exact same SAAMI barrel specs, .355 groove diameter. Same for the 380 Auto, which has also been a traditional .356 bullet.

But .357 bullets and .358 bullets can be used in either one as well. Hornady includes .357 bullets in their 38 Super data.

If you're looking for speed, the 38 Super delivers:
https://www.shootingtimes.com/editorial/super-powders-for-the-38-super/99160

If you're looking for accuracy, the 38 Super delivers:
https://www.shootingtimes.com/editorial/super-accurate-38-super-loads/326242

Concerning accuracy, plated bullets are unlikely to give you the same level of accuracy a jacketed bullet will.
 
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