Bolt stuck

Bill Daniel

New member
Can a few granules of powder between the bolt face and cartridge cause the bolt to lock up? While at the range today the last round of the magazine was missing a primer. Other than calling myself an idiot for not priming the round I did nothing other than put in the next magazine (after checking all the bullets). I released the bolt and lined up my shot but there was a failure to fire. When I tried to cycle the bolt it wouldn’t budge. It was out of battery enough to prevent opening via the take down pin so I headed home to disassemble and investigate. After removing the receiver extension I was able to remove the upper and tap the bolt out. Everything look good except for some flakes of powder(H4350) between the bolt face and the cartridge. Is that enough to lock up the bolt?
Thanks in advance,
Bill
 

Metal god

New member
Yes , 4350 ? what cartridge ? 6.5cm ? FWIW you likely could have just mortared it at the range and the BCG would have likely moved and extracted the round .
 

stagpanther

New member
You may think you forgot to put the primer in but it may have simply fallen out. Be sure to examine your upper and lower--especially under the trigger, to make sure your primer didn't fall out. A primer under the trigger can cause a failure to reset which is not a good thing--unless you're curious about what your rifle is like full-auto.
 

44 AMP

Staff
If the primer didn't fall out, then I count it as two mistakes. Loading the case with no primer, and loading a round with no primer into the magazine.

(you did load your own magazines, right??)

It was out of battery enough to prevent opening via the take down pin so I headed home to disassemble and investigate.

You mean you couldn't hinge it open, right? And, to be clear, you took the rifle home with a loaded round stuck in the chamber?? :eek:

After removing the receiver extension I was able to remove the upper and tap the bolt out.

This part confuses me a bit. If we're talking about an AR (and I thought we were) what part is the receiver extension?

My experience with AR's that have stuck shut so that they cannot be hinged open by pushing out the rear pin is that they can have the upper removed by pushing out both front and rear pins, then lifting (and wiggling) the upper forward and up. Done it many times on different guns.

Enough crud, in just the right spot will jam a rifle solid. How much, and where differs widely.
 

Bill Daniel

New member
44AMP, correct on all counts. I probably used the wrong term. The part I removed at home contains the recoil spring and buffer.
All the best,
Bill
 

Bill Daniel

New member
brasscollector, right. I suspect the bolt being out of battery is what prevented the firing pin from contacting the primer when I pulled the trigger.
All the best,
Bill
 

44 AMP

Staff
I suspect the bolt being out of battery is what prevented the firing pin from contacting the primer when I pulled the trigger.

I suspect you're right, that's what it is built to do. ;)

The "receiver extension" is usually called the buffer tube.

SO, gun was apart, cleared, and is now cleaned and back together?

Did you, by any chance save the round with no primer?? It would be very useful to have.

My first guess would be that it was not a few grains of loose powder that jammed the rifle. I think the rifle jammed on the case which was also dribbling a bit of powder. I've had jams just as you described with ammo that wasn't leaking powder, so I doubt the powder was the culprit.

Back in the 80s I had a batch of "crap" ammo, loaded with factory second soft points, mostly, intended just for blasting. The stuff was cranked out on a Dillon 450 without much care for brass prep or the usual QC.

The AR I had at the time, would jam solid on some of them. Bolt just short of proper lock up, and no amount of force on the forward assist would close it, and there was no way a human could use the charging handle and open it.

(personal note, I will not "mortar" an AR unless there's no other choice because someone is shooting at me)

The bolt carrier was stuck too far to the rear to allow the gun to hinge open but I was always able to get the upper off by popping both front and rear pins. With the upper off, a slight tap rearwards on the front face of the rear of the carrier would pop it free. After the second time it happened I did the same thing. After that, I didn't touch the forward assist again.

it happened several more times (I had several hundred rounds of the stuff), and if I didn't hit the FA trying to close it, the rifle only had to be taken apart about half the time to clear it.

I wound up putting that ammo through my Mini 14. I put the rounds that jammed in the AR through the Mini 14. Most ran without issue but a few did stop the Mini's bolt just short of fully shut. A wack on the back of the op rod handle ALWAYS locked it shut, and the round would fire.

SO, if you still got that primerless round available, measure it, and see if it is different than what it ought to be. Especially shoulder and neck, as a first step. I think its possible that if a primer didn't get put in, the case might not have been properly sized, and I think that is more likely than a little powder causing the jam.

I could be wrong, I often am, If you've got the round, (and you're a glutton for punishment, :rolleyes:) shake the powder out or plug the flash hole and then try and rechamber it. If it jams, it was the round, if it doesn't it was the powder. Probably....:D
 

Rimfire5

New member
One last thing to check.
The BCG might have hung up on the 'receiver extension' AKA 'buffer tube'.

A range buddy had that happen with all the same symptoms as you had and didn't notice the buffer tube was bent just a bit during the jam. When he rectified what he thought was the cause, he finally found that the BCG had damaged the buffer tube and the bolt would not close completely.

Just to be sure, I recommend you check out all the components before you fire it again. There may be some other cause other than some pellets of powder in the action lurking inside your AR. In his case, it did more damage than just jamming the BCG.
 

Metal god

New member
I’m not sure why you guys are looking for a different issue . The case didn’t have a primer in it . We know it’s likely some powder fell out and what all might happen if there is no primer in your charged case .

If i were looking to find another cause i might think the case was never sized , what about a sized case that grew the neck to far and now with the bullet in the neck it jammed into the throat . Or how about .... see what I mean ? We can go on and on of posible things that can lock up the BCG . I can throw out a bunch more stuff if you’d like ? Lol ;)
 

stagpanther

New member
A case that's a "Crush fit" in the chamber will do that...too...
Yes--but something else might be at work; Creedmoor AR's are pretty finicky about a precision fit of components (I've built about a half dozen of them). Even a perfect cartridge, if the cycling is not precise, can jam fairly easily considering those high SD bullets are "hanging way out there" being seated long. You can usually see the problem when "controlled dropping" of a charged bolt slowly. In my experience, the case and/or bullet nose will almost always show abrasion damage when the cycling is out of time even ever-so-slightly (which in turn will throw the accuracy/consistency off). Incomplete lock-up of the bolt to extension lugs can be a potential Kaboomer--the cartridge could go into battery enough that the firing pin can still ignite the primer; look for things like primer cratering even on loads that are fairly mild.

The surest way to make a jam worse is to force the cartridge with the forward assist.
 

Bill Daniel

New member
Thanks for the interest fellows. I believe it was the powder. The case was new. Remeasured as per 44AMP. All within spec. Reloaded that case and the primer pocket is not loose. Got a good look at the whole rifle during disassembly and reassembly. No problems.
All the best,
Bill
 
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