black talon

[seaville]

I ran across some Winchester Black Talon Ammo today. It didn't have a black coating and was in yellow boxes. Prices ran from $54 to 59 per box of 50. He had examples of spend Jhp. They are really bad looking. I can't decide if I need to buy them.
Facts and opinions would be appreciated

 

[Logs]

I don't think they are worth the $$$$ several other options out there.

 

[ldpantoja]

Don't waste you money. It sounds like they might be selling you some of those Winchester Ranger SXT rounds. I do think those would be next in line after Black Talons but I know for a fact that they don't cost $59.

I got some Talons for $40 and some Ranger SXT for $27 about 2 months ago.

 

[MrNiceGuy]

Exactly as ldpantoja said, those are not black talons, and they are not worth anywhere near what he's asking.

i have a few boxes of black talons that were purchased before they were discontinued and the price was still "reasonable". They were great bullets in their time, but today there's better options available without the media created and ill-deserved stigmata associated with black talons.
I keep them only as a conversation piece, or sometimes as background for photos, but I dont plan on ever shooting or even loading them.

Real black tallons should run absolutely no more than $40-50 per 20. For this you get $15 dollars worth of bullets, and $35 worth of cool factor. Whether the cool factor is actually worth $35 is imo, up to the buyer.

What you were probably looking at are ranger SXT's. The next gen, family friendly, non scary named version of the black talon.
http://www.tds-us.com/catalog.php/tds/dt44310/Ranger_Talon_LEO
They should run no more than $35 per 50.... usually.

Of course, supply and demand does play a roll, but those prices are beyond what i'd personally consider reasonable even in times such as these.

 

[scorpion_tyr]

Black Talon... aka... Ranger SXT. They just changed the name and removed the black coating that only reduced barrel wear. And you can get them cheaper than that.

 

[IdahoG36]

Black Talons are only popular due to being discontinued by Winchester, after the media bombarded the airwaves with ridiculous myths about them. People still seem to believe that they are some kind of magical, ultra deadly, super killer round.
If you like Black Talons, buy a box of SXT(Same Xact Thing) at half the price. Or, in my opinion, your money would be better spent on more modern loadings like the Winchester Ranger T, Federal HST, CorBon DPX, or Winchester Supreme Elite handgun ammo. These are newer designs and offer superior expansion and penetration compared to the Black Talons.
All of these loadings are also bonded (except the DPX, which is a solid copper bullet).
Last but not least, I am not saying that the Black Talon is a bad round. It is perfectly capable of killing. I'm just saying, don't fall for all of the myths that still float around on the internet about the Black Talon. It's BS.

 

[John8680]

Bass Pro Shops has an exclusive from Winchester that is pretty much the same old black talon. They are however much cheaper than what you found. Check here for the Winchester SXZ They have a JHP and a FMJ version for practice. Both are supposed to shoot the same, kinda like the Speer Lawman and Gold dots.

 

[guypowell]

I accidently shot my new VCR one night with a 9mm black talon. It went through the VCR, tape and all, out the end of the trailer I was living in, and lodged in a big Oak tree. Expansion was what it should have been. It completely gutted the VCR.

 

[Wasabi]

 

[Boncrayon]

I've heard about the Black Talon ammo and understood they were only available to law enforcement. I personally keep Hornady Tap's in my 9 and 40cal. I think I'm getting the equivalent. Honady Tap's have a dark nickle casing. I feel certain that the jacketed hollow point is very similar to the Talons. Any feed back on my observation?

 

[jpoolsmyd2]

I accidently shot my new VCR one night with a 9mm black talon.

Um, how? Cleaning? Bad movie? (sorry, couldn't resist!)

 

[ar15chase]

Black Talons are over-rated. There are many different hollow points on the market that are better and cheaper. Gold-Dot is my prefered round.

 

[Rampant_Colt]

Black Talon "myths"

Bass Pro Shops has an exclusive from Winchester that is pretty much the same old black talon. They are however much cheaper than what you found. Check here for the Winchester SXZ They have a JHP and a FMJ version for practice. Both are supposed to shoot the same, kinda like the Speer Lawman and Gold dots.

SXZ is NOTHING like Black Talon

I've heard about the Black Talon ammo and understood they were only available to law enforcement. I personally keep Hornady Tap's in my 9 and 40cal. I think I'm getting the equivalent. Honady Tap's have a dark nickle casing. I feel certain that the jacketed hollow point is very similar to the Talons. Any feed back on my observation?

XTP/TAP is NOTHING like Black Talon or Ranger T
The black nickle cases are for feed reliability, and the XTP bullet is a 'standard' jacketed hollowpoint



W-W engineers tweaked the original BT bullet to make it expand more reliably through obstacles with larger recovered diameters, and to pass the FBI "jello test". Ranger T is much more than a renamed Black Talon. Same eXact Thing would be incorrect.

They contain no Teflon
They cannot penetrate body armor [bullet-proof vest ]
They are not illegal to own or possess
Winchester volunteered to stop selling them
They are not law enforcement only
They are desireable as a collector cartridge, hence the high price

 

[Tom2]

I agree. No reason to pay a gouging thief price for ammo to get good performance. As for collectability, that is based on the inflated value put on because they were dropped from production and notorious in the press. They may be real collectables in 25 years, or banned altogether by some new regime, anyway. Go look at some top o' the line loads from Speer, Winchester, Federal, etc. that are the latest and greatest, you will get what you need. I had some .45 B. T. ammo before they got bad press. Sold the stuff for a nice profit a year or two after they stopped making it.

 

[guypowell]

Um, how? Cleaning? Bad movie?

Really bad movie that I was tired of watching.

 

[seaville]

Thanks for the imput. I'm almost out of Speer Gold dot, and can't find any defensive loads except from price gougers. I did find some umc ball that the dealer was rationing in .380, he only charged 15 and change for a box of 50.
At the last gun show that I attended one booth had $50 on a 100rd. white box Winchester that Walmart sold for $31+ 2 weeks ago.

 

[Naterstein]

Black Talons are behind the curve now anyway. Personally, I would look for cheap HSTs, Ranger Ts, Gold Dots, Corbon DPX... in that order.

 

[Rondog]

I have a full box of .357 BT's that are cherry, they're only going in my "stuff" collection. Don't have a .357 anymore anyway.