best factory load for .357
- Thread starter markj
- Start date
I think you are referring to Federal's Classic 180gr. JHP. If that is the case I would say that particular load is probably going to penetrate more than preferred for SD. It probably won't expand very well as it is a more primitive design. Some good loads are the 125-158gr. premium JHP loads from the major manufacturers. Look for something that doesn't have too much flash and controllable recoil. I find that most of the 158gr. JHP defense loads don't have any flash and are similar to a 230gr. 45ACP in the controllability and recoil dept. These will give decent expansion and better penetration than most semi-auto defense loads(about 16"). If you like the 180gr. loads, I hear that the Win PG is a good all around SD and hunting load. It offers excellent penetration and expansion. The last test that I recall shows it penetrating 18" and expanding to nearly .60 in diameter.
juliet charley
New member
Probably best .357 Magnum defence load available is the 145-grain Silvertip.
azredhawk44
Moderator
Federal Hydrashocks in 158gr are right-on-target at 25ft. in my sp101 3". Only shot them at paper, so I don't know what they do, but I do know they go where I point.
I like the 140gr. Corbon JHP. It is a good balance between the light and fast and heavy and slow mentalities. It should penetrate somewhere around 13-14" and offer explosive expansion as it goes about 1300fps from a 4" revolver. The Win St. is also an excellent load. About 15-16" of penetration with .58-.64 expansion. Can't beat that. I've found that my 686 loves Federal Hydrashoks. I shot the best off-hand group with a handgun ever with my 686 and 130gr. Federal HS. Just a little over 2" at 25yds. I was on fire that day.
Product Description: Centerfire Pistol Cartridges, .357 Magnum, 180 Grain, Semi-Jacketed Hollow Point, 50 Rounds Per Box, 10 Boxes Per Case
Catalog Item #: 66477 Mfg Item #: R357M10
I got 3 boxes of these for 13 per box. I have shot 1/2 box so far and they do kick a bit out of my ruger gp100 3in.
I am looking into other loads tho. Dont want to over kill
Catalog Item #: 66477 Mfg Item #: R357M10
I got 3 boxes of these for 13 per box. I have shot 1/2 box so far and they do kick a bit out of my ruger gp100 3in.
I am looking into other loads tho. Dont want to over kill
Ben Shepherd
New member
As a general rule, as others noted, 180's are a bit much in the penetration dept. for 2 legged varmits. I personally like the 158 grain speer gold dot. The other loads already mentioned I would carry without hesitation- IF I couldn't get my gold dots.
In fact they are all good enough you may want to pick up some of each, see if YOUR gun has a distinct preference for a certain one-and run with it.
In fact they are all good enough you may want to pick up some of each, see if YOUR gun has a distinct preference for a certain one-and run with it.
Funny how widely disparate the definition of "best .357 load" is. To some it's "What's fastest?" To others, it's "What's heaviest?" To others, it's "What has the most energy?"-- which is virtually the same as asking what's fastest.
To me, a good 180 is a great hunting load, but is a bit tough to control for multiple shots out of a large frame revolver, let alone a midsized. It will penetrate, to be sure. There are some that get worried about excessive penetration. (I'm not much worried about that.)
The 125g loads are capable of amazing energy, and have been known to create some impressive stops, but also have a tendency not to penetrate much. They can (and often do) blow up on the surface and may not make that 12 to 18 inch penetration envelope that we want to see.
I like the 158gr bullet weight, with a JHP or semijacketed SP.
Remington offers a superb 158g load in both SP and Semi-JacketedHPj that runs about 1235 fps.
Hornady offers their excellent XTP 158gr bullet in .357 Mag. This bullet is renown for giving good controlled expansion over a variety of velocities, along with very good accuracy. For some reason, the XTP line has been mostly the favorite of hunters over self-defense shooters. It's loaded to 1230 fps.
Speer produces their excellent Gold Dot 158g bullet in .357 mag. This another very good controlled expansion bullet, with a proven record of accuracy. They too claim 1230 fps.
Winchester offers two 158g loads in .357: the JHP and the JSP. Both are at 1235 fps. On a personal and unscientific note: while I really don't know much about them, I'd be much more willing to rely on them than Winchester's 145g Silvertip, which was most famous for failing to stop in the famous Trooper Coates shooting of 1990.
If you just want silly recoil, there's the Buffalo Bore Heavy .357 Magnum, in which they claim 1475 fps with a 158g JHP. Lord.
For real value, try Georgia Arms. They offer a 158g JHP at 1200 fps, for a mere $12./box of 50!!! $23.50 buys you 100 of 'em. That's just over half the price of other name brand manufacturers. I haven't tried this load, but I've tried their .44 Mag loads, and they are accurate and hot. I'm impressed with them.
Finally, Federal offers their HydroShock, another JHP, and a JSP in 158g loads at 1230 fps. The HydroShock is a proven round that works.
To me, a good 180 is a great hunting load, but is a bit tough to control for multiple shots out of a large frame revolver, let alone a midsized. It will penetrate, to be sure. There are some that get worried about excessive penetration. (I'm not much worried about that.)
The 125g loads are capable of amazing energy, and have been known to create some impressive stops, but also have a tendency not to penetrate much. They can (and often do) blow up on the surface and may not make that 12 to 18 inch penetration envelope that we want to see.
I like the 158gr bullet weight, with a JHP or semijacketed SP.
Remington offers a superb 158g load in both SP and Semi-JacketedHPj that runs about 1235 fps.
Hornady offers their excellent XTP 158gr bullet in .357 Mag. This bullet is renown for giving good controlled expansion over a variety of velocities, along with very good accuracy. For some reason, the XTP line has been mostly the favorite of hunters over self-defense shooters. It's loaded to 1230 fps.
Speer produces their excellent Gold Dot 158g bullet in .357 mag. This another very good controlled expansion bullet, with a proven record of accuracy. They too claim 1230 fps.
Winchester offers two 158g loads in .357: the JHP and the JSP. Both are at 1235 fps. On a personal and unscientific note: while I really don't know much about them, I'd be much more willing to rely on them than Winchester's 145g Silvertip, which was most famous for failing to stop in the famous Trooper Coates shooting of 1990.
If you just want silly recoil, there's the Buffalo Bore Heavy .357 Magnum, in which they claim 1475 fps with a 158g JHP. Lord.
For real value, try Georgia Arms. They offer a 158g JHP at 1200 fps, for a mere $12./box of 50!!! $23.50 buys you 100 of 'em. That's just over half the price of other name brand manufacturers. I haven't tried this load, but I've tried their .44 Mag loads, and they are accurate and hot. I'm impressed with them.
Finally, Federal offers their HydroShock, another JHP, and a JSP in 158g loads at 1230 fps. The HydroShock is a proven round that works.
How could the 158gr. loads have fared better? The 145gr. Win ST isn't exactly known for shallow penetration. 15-16" of penetration is at the top scale of the FBIs penetration standards. Did the Win ST fail to expand properly or what was the failure. I'm aware of the incident but I didn't see a lot of investigation afterwards as to what the root cause of failure was. I think the 158gr. JHP loads are good for an all around load if you never really know what you will find yourself up against. Cougars, coyotes, 250lb human males. I like the middle of the road loads such as 140gr. Corbon JHP and the 145gr. Win ST. I feel these are great for SD against 2 legged threats, while I load 158gr. JSP in the woods. I saw a test of the 140gr. Corbon load and it penetrated 23" of water, which should net slightly more than 14" of penetration in gelatin. The Corbons have been shown to expand very reliably in animals that I've shot and seen shot with it. Sierra's PJHP that is used in the Corbon loads is an excellent bullet that expands very uniform and reliably. Not quite as good as the Speer GD though.
Now thats information, thanks guys. I saw some 158gr jsp here locally at lunch for 9.95 a box, UMC brand, I also picked up 3 boxes of 115gr fmj 9mm for 5.99 per. I will shoot this up at the range and let you know how it turns out. As a hunter I always look for penetration, I dont care if it passes thru or not. Most deer I have shot had the bullet go thru the body leaving a nasty exit wound, isnt this what you want in SD?
If you want deep penetration then the 158gr. Speer GD is your ticket. It will penetrate about 18" and expand to about .55 or so. For SD you want to have adequate penetration but also increase the size of the hole you are making in the BG. It goes about 1200fps factory loaded from a 4" barrel.
Long Path's Post
You guys are probably way ahead of me on this..and may very well have visited this site...I was interested in finding out about the Tooper Coates shooting.
I got information on that, and a "do it yourself" ammo test!
http://www.firearmstactical.com/briefs3.htm
John
You guys are probably way ahead of me on this..and may very well have visited this site...I was interested in finding out about the Tooper Coates shooting.
I got information on that, and a "do it yourself" ammo test!
http://www.firearmstactical.com/briefs3.htm
John
The reason they state 12-18 inches is that the average thoractic cavity is about 10 or so inches deep. Then you have bone that isnt accounted for in the tests. So you need those extra few inches to penetrate bone or whatever else and still reach vitals. You don't what a huge amount of penetration because in a SD situation you are not always going to have a backstop behind your target, and you don't want your bullet to pass through and possibly harm innocents. You also want your bullet to dump all of that energy in your target to stop the fight with as few rounds as possible because handguns don't have that huge amount of energy that rifles do. Rifles have energy to spare in hunting situations and it doesn't always matter so much to have a pass through.
Ben Shepherd
New member
You'll find that UMC stuff to be fairly hot, reasonably accurate, but really dirty.
However, if you don't reload, and don't mind cleaning your gun a little more often, it's not a bad practice round for the price.
However, if you don't reload, and don't mind cleaning your gun a little more often, it's not a bad practice round for the price.
juliet charley
New member
Of course, if you really take the Trooper Coates shooting of 1990 too far heart, you'd believe .22 out of NAA mini-revolver is superior to the .357 Magnum. You have to be careful about drawing conclusions based on a single isolated incidents (particular when penetration was NOT the problem in the Trooper Coates incidenent).
An excellent point, and one that I've made myself, to be sure. Anecdotal evidence is, as I said, unscientific. As i mentioned, it's a purely personal issue. Honestly, a man could do a decent job of defending himself with any of the .357 factory self-defense loadings, and even the +P .38 loads. But often the confidence in having that load that is .002% better will allow you to do things better.
With regard to the 145g bullet vs. the 158g? I tend to believe that the 158g will, ceteris parabus, penetrate deeper, by virtue of its higher sectional density:
Man, I wonder if Winchester got their pictures wrong on their website? While it makes my point beautifully, that sure looks like a 125g Silvertip, and a 158g or possibly even a 180g JHP (that cross-sections into a JSP?).
With regard to the 145g bullet vs. the 158g? I tend to believe that the 158g will, ceteris parabus, penetrate deeper, by virtue of its higher sectional density:
Man, I wonder if Winchester got their pictures wrong on their website? While it makes my point beautifully, that sure looks like a 125g Silvertip, and a 158g or possibly even a 180g JHP (that cross-sections into a JSP?).
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juliet charley
New member
There is little doubt the 158-grain JHP will give you deeper penetration, but I would suggest it would have more to do with its expansion characteristics (or lack thereof) rather than the small difference in sectional density. The 158-grain bullet starts out with a very slight 13-grain advantage in mass, but the 145-grain bullet starts out with a very slight 55 fps advantage in ME. If we were talking about FMJs with identical profiles at these weights and velocities, I doubt if we would see any meaningful difference in penetration.