Baron Von Odkolek, Inventor of the Gas Piston Firearm

[B. Lahey]

I've been reading "Automatic Arms Their History, Development, and Use", a cool old book by Melvin Johnson and Charles Haven, and it mentions this guy. Apparently he was the first to build a gun with a gas piston mechanism.

That seems pretty important, a big step forward from the potato-digging swinging doodad Browning came up with first.

But I can't find much more info except that his design eventually influenced the Hotchkiss MG. Who was this Baron Von Odkolek?

What other arms did he work on / influence? Anyone have a photo or diagram of his protoHotchkiss?

Any additional info about this fellow will be appreciated, I have not been able to locate a great deal.

 

[kraigwy]

The Hotchkiss MG came out about the same time Browning came out with the Colt MG. in 1889. (The Maxim predated both guns). Browning patented the Colt MG in 1890, which was his first patent. Both guns used the piston.

The inventer of the Hotchkiss MG was in fact an Austrian Army Officer, Baron Bon Odkolek. The Hotchkiss was fed from 30 round strips.

Thought Odkolek invented the gun, Ben Hotchkiss, an American put it into manufacture. The Hotchkiss Co. was owned by Ben Hotchkiss. The French Army Adopted the Hotchkiss MG in 1905.

But it was Browning who first invented the gas piston with his Colt MG.

 

[B. Lahey]

I don't know that I would call the early Browning action a gas piston, at least not the form we see everywhere today. It has that crazy flapping arm, in the Hotchkiss everything looks to be compact, linear, and it uses a tube with a sliding plug operated by internal pressure (what I've always thought of when I hear the word "piston")

 

[kraigwy]

I don't know that I would call the early Browning action a gas piston,

Principle of Operation: Colt MG.

In the bottom of the barrel about 8 inches from the muzzle there is a vent, and pivoted in the casing under the barrel is a lever, called a gas lever, Which carries at its free end a cylindrical plug, called a piston, which rest against at Vent.

The Colt was in fact a gas/piston operating system.

 

[B. Lahey]

I can see how that would be correct, however, this dude seems to have come up with the configuration that really took off.

Still wondering what else he worked on, general biographical info, etc...

 

[kraigwy]

Ben Hotchkiss made other guns, one being a revolving cannon, which is version of the Gatling gun, but fired one pound shells. Use mostly by navies for battering shores & such before landings.

I'm not aware of any other inventions by Bon Odkolek. The Hotchkiss MG was a difficult gun to operate. It required constant adjustment of the gas regulator, when it got hot, different ammo, etc etc.

Browning's Colt MG was a bit better, you didn't have to adjust the gas, it was relatively simple to operate and train soldiers. Basically if you could load the gun you could operate it.

As mentioned it was Browning's first patent, but we all know it wasn't his last.

Maybe it was the timing of the adoption of machine guns that left Bon Odkolek in the dust. Europe was gearing up for WWI, Germans relied heavily on machine guns and Bon Odkolek had to compete with the Maxim MG which was a favorite of the Germans in WWI.

At the time, everyone was trying to come up with automatic MGs and Rifles. The Patent Office was virtually flooded with patent request. Compared to the vast numbers, very few saw the light of day.

 

[Mike Irwin]

"Browning's Colt MG was a bit better, you didn't have to adjust the gas, it was relatively simple to operate and train soldiers. Basically if you could load the gun you could operate it."

Except for the fact that that swinging actuator arm made it pretty much impossible to get low with the gun.

During World War I Marlin Rockwell redesigned the gun to use a modern-style gas piston to replace the swinging actuator arm.

The US never used them in combat, but did use them extensively for training.

 

[BlueTrain]

The Colt-Browning was used in Cuba, was it not? I believe two were privately purchased by a member of the Tiffany family who served in Cuba. For some reason, they were chambered in 7mm Mauser, which the Spanish used.

The army also used a light machine gun that was, I think, (before I check this on Wikipedia) a derivation of the big Hotchkiss. That was during the pre-WWI period.

I think the Hotchkiss company is still going strong in France.

 

[kraigwy]

If one is interested in older machine guns, the best book available is

"Machine Guns" 1917 by (then) Major Julian Hatcher, Major Glenn Wilhelm, and Major Harry Malony.

Besides machine guns, it covers their developement, operation, and tactics of the period (much of the tactics are still valid today).

Kind of hard to find, but well worth the choice. Mine was stolen (not by me) from the PA NG.

 

[Buzzcook]

Kraigwy, that book is out of copyright. You could scan it and post it somewhere.

iirc the US did use the Hotchkiss at Wounded Knee

 

[Mike Irwin]

"The Colt-Browning was used in Cuba, was it not?"

Yes. I meant, but should have been clearer, that the US never used the redesigned Marlin Rockwell guns in combat in World War I.

 

[BlueTrain]

I thought the Marlin was used in aircraft. Maybe in the 1920s. There's one on display in the Air & Space Museum. They also have Lindberg's rifle.

The Hotchkiss company, by the way, was merged out of existance a few decades ago but one of the successor companies is still in the arms business, now politely referred to as the defence industry.

 

[Mike Irwin]

It may well have been. But the 1920s were after World War I ended.

 

[BlueTrain]

That was fast!

 

[B. Lahey]

All these side conversations are very intetesting, but I guess if we want the backstory of the baron, we are going to have to make it up ourselves...

I propose that he was the illustrious operator of the Austrian Cheesemaker's Guild, and was inspired to construct his gas piston machine gun when he witnessed a bizarre cheesemaking accident. Fermentation gas buildup started firing cheesewheels around with amazing velocity and rapidity, one of them striking and crippling the baron's loyal hound Hans.

 

[Bart Noir]

iirc the US did use the Hotchkiss at Wounded Knee

That was not a machine gun. Those (I think there were 2 of them at the battle) were little single shot breechloading cannon. I think the bore was 1 inch or 37 mm, which is 1.45 inch.

The Colt-Browning also saw early combat in the defense of the Legation quarter in Peking during the Boxer rebellion of 1900. The USMC guards there had some in caliber 6mm Lee, and they had Lee straight-pull rifles. Apparently they also had a supply of belted ammo

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/6mm_Lee_Navy

Bart Noir