bad reloading data?

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Norrick

New member
My Lyman manual says I can use H-380 in .308 Winchester. It calls for 45.5 grains as a starting load with a 165 grain partitioned bullet (soft point). I didn't have the exact bullet that it indicated, but I had two different 165 grains soft points to try out.

It states that the max load of 55.5 grains is a compressed load.

I started at 45.2 grains and already the load was slightly compressed using its documented OAL (I can't remember off hand, I think it was 2.780).

Just to see how full the case would get with their "max" load I tried putting 55.5 grains in and it completely spilled over the top of the case. It won't fit, not by a long shot.

I did try shooting some of the 165's and they were pushing about 2560 fps. Primers were flattened slightly.

Any ideas what could be wrong? I'm using a variety of brass and it doesn't seem to make a difference (I thought maybe it is possible I had some 7.62 which might have slightly reduced case capacity like the whole .223 vs 5.56). Some of it is marked 308 win, and others just have WCC headstamp. Brass was once fired out of my Remington 700 in .308 before I sold it a while back. Full length sized for the new X-bolt.

I dont normally see loads with H-380 for .308, usually varmint calibers, but it was documented and I had it on hand so I tried it.

I looked at the loading data for some 180 grains and used that for some 175 grain hollow points and it turned out ok (not compressed, acceptable velocity). Primers were still somewhat flattened though.
 
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243winxb

New member
Yes, bad data. Remember, different components=different pressure. Start low on the powder charge and work up as always. My old Lyman 45th edition lists for a 165gr- H380-45.0gr start & 51.0gr maximum. Steves pages list a Maximum of 51.0gr also. Steves pages > http://stevespages.com/page8a.htm Having loaded H380 & H450 years ago, i would use it for fertilize for the lawn. Sorry. :)
 
P

PawPaw

New member
I jumped over to the Hodgdon site to see what they say about H380 in the .308 Winchester. They don't list any loads at all for that powder, with any bullet.

I've trusted Lyman manuals for a long time and I've seen some things in their manuals that you might not see anywhere else. However, the standard procedure is to check a load from two or three sources. I don't see H380 listed in the Nosler or Lee manuals either, so you're in uncharted territory.

Go slow, be careful, and double-check everything.
 
S

sserdlihc

New member
I always confere with several different manuals before rolling a new load. Just safe practice. I like the fact that you questioned the manual and done your own homework concerning the load.:cool:
 
M

mehavey

New member
My Lyman manual says I can use H-380 in .308 Winchester....165 grains soft ...states that the max load of 55.5 grains is a compressed load.
Click to expand...
Please go back and relook at the Lyman manuals. Both my 48th & 49th show 50.5 grains as max for this bullet.

That 50.5gr is near a full case. (I just loaded 50.6 into an LC case. It stopped 3/16" below the mouth.)

H380 is an excellent powder for the 308Win and 165gr Bullets
At 56,000psi ranked by velocity (2,796-2,730fps)/full case/98+% burn:

RL-17
Ramshot Big Game
IMR4985
RL-15
IMR3031
IMR4064
H380
IMR4320
AA2495
Varget

It's an accuracy game for the particular rifle within these constraints.
 
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PawPaw

New member
If you're looking for top velocity from 165 grain bullets in the .308, don't forget to look at Alliant's 2000-MR. I picked up a pound to play with and I'm getting 2950 fps with 150 grain bullets from my Remington 700 with a 22" barrel. As I'm not yet to a max charge, I think that Alliant's data is a little conservative.

Alliant shows 2840 fps from that powder with a 165 grain bullet. I've still got some experimenting to do with this (relatively) new powder, but from all indications, it's going to be a keeper.
 
N

Norrick

New member
Yes Mehavey you are correct the max load is listed as 50.5

It was a few days ago I did this and was going off of what I remembered I had problems with, but I will say that I did in fact mix up the numbers for the max load. I was under the impression that it was 55 point something (off memory I thought it was 55.5). Thank you for pointing that out.

And since I double checked it looks like I used load data for the 200 grains (not 180 as previously mentioned) to get a starting point for the 175's ( I figure if you can put X number of grains behind a heavier bullet, you could safely do the same or less behind a slightly smaller bullet).

But as for checking multiple sources, yes I agree, bad form on my part, but I haven't seen H-380 listed anywhere really besides this manual (My Lee manual is usually more comprehensive than my Lyman).

I think the 165's I'm using are slightly compressed because they are boat tails and not flat base like the bullet provided. Maybe the material removed to curve the back of the bullet has to be added to the front to make up for lost mass, basically a longer bullet. With the same OAL, a longer bullet would be pushed farther into the cartridge, correct?

I'm not looking for max velocities. I initially started with the intent of metallic silhouette shooting, so ideally, reduced loads, but I wanted to start on the low side of normal loads. I discovered, however, my gun's barrel heats up way too fast to do that. I was doing 5 shot groups and the second group would be much larger than the first. It opened up from like 1.5 inches to 4.5 inches. I was waiting maybe 1 and a half minutes between shots and 5 minutes between groups. Still not enough time to let it cool down though (sporter contour, fluted). I think its 2 and half minutes to shoot 5 targets, then you switch and the other relay gets 2 and a half, then a small break before moving to the next distance.

Will a faster burning powder heat up the barrel less? Or is it going to be pretty much equal (since a roughly equivalent amount of energy is being released)?

I guess I'll just use this as a hunting gun, which is what it is best suited for I think. Too bad I don't hunt, yet... Gives me a good excuse to go and do it now though!
 
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chris in va

New member
Yeah, my Lyman manual is off with 223 loads compared to the Hodgdon site. I charged what I thought was mid level with my 63gr bullets only to discover the primers were flattened and had issues with stuck cases.
 
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